Something original maybe ?

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Yeah I get that, but a lot of times the argument goes back to "There was no IP in the original Disneyland" which is just flat out wrong. That whole park was inspired and designed based on Disney's IP.
That's what bothers me. The concept that Disney created all of the characters and stories from the air. What Disney did that was different was to put a specific spin on an idea, concept or story. All of them Cinderella, Peter Pan, Toad, Snow White, Mary Poppins and a long list of others, were expanded creations based on another individuals idea, book or movie. Disney just added his own magic to it. The misconception of one poster that said he/she hated the term "intellectual Property" because so many things are not necessarily creatively brilliant. It is nothing more then misunderstanding what the word intellectual means. It means coming from the intellect (brain) of an individual. Walt just thought of it as an idea that he could be creative with, thus creating his own IP.

Maybe define IP as something that someone other then the person(s) expanding the idea thought of on his own. Almost all of Walt's most successful ventures were thought of by someone else, either on his payroll or purchased from the originator. The only way to have an original is to do something that no one has ever done, thought of or built before. Even Disneyland is not a new idea. Walt was influenced by others. A lot of his ideas for the park were copied in thought from others. He just displayed it in a unique way that no one else had done. The original part was the spin that he put on someone else's idea. But the whole thing is an IP no matter who thought of it first. Hell, shrink down Oswald Rabbit's long ears, make them round, lengthen his snout and give him a string like tail and you have one Mickey Mouse.
 

Tony the Tigger

Well-Known Member
We’re not talking Jimmy and Sally from 30-40 years ago. The franchise mandate is not that old.

Allowing the parks to create their own content would allow them to differentiate from all of the content available in other formats. This idea that people only want what they know doesn’t make sense. People weren’t turned off by Frozen because it lacked characters people already know. People weren’t asking for more Mickey Mouse in a Disney movie.

Except there’s nothing proprietary about generic pirates. Any other theme park can do a pirates ride.

And, frankly, these days, any park with $$ can do theming, especially if they hired people from Disney. The world has caught up.

Frozen can’t be anywhere but a Disney Park. That’s what they’ve got. That’s what they’ve earned, created, or bought that’s exclusive to Disney.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Except there’s nothing proprietary about generic pirates. Any other theme park can do a pirates ride.

And, frankly, these days, any park with $$ can do theming, especially if they hired people from Disney. The world has caught up.

Frozen can’t be anywhere but a Disney Park. That’s what they’ve got. That’s what they’ve earned, created, or bought that’s exclusive to Disney.
So now Pirates of the Caribbean is now just some generic ride and not one of the most celebrated dark rides ever created even half a century after its debut? Its just at every park and nothing exclusive to Disney?
 

Tony the Tigger

Well-Known Member
So now Pirates of the Caribbean is now just some generic ride and not one of the most celebrated dark rides ever created even half a century after its debut? Its just at every park and nothing exclusive to Disney?

I think you’re intelligent enough to understand the point. It’s wonderful. I love it. But if Uni wanted to do a pirate attraction, they could, without any legal jeopardy. They couldn’t do Captain Jack Sparrow; that’s the (recently added) IP.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I think you’re intelligent enough to understand the point. It’s wonderful. I love it. But if Uni wanted to do a pirate attraction, they could, without any legal jeopardy. They couldn’t do Captain Jack Sparrow; that’s the (recently added) IP.
You claim to love it, you just don’t ever want to see anything like it ever again.

Universal has done Jack Sparrow and lots of other Disney stuff as part of Halloween Horror Nights. They also get to advertise the films as part of the famous tram tour. The law actually doesn’t treat theme park intellectual property as less legitimate than movies, even if so many have such a personal view. You’re ”uniqueness” is nothing more than copying Universal.
 
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danlb_2000

Premium Member
I think there is one thing that everyone involved in the 1,264 posts on here about IP are missing. IMO, the majority of WDW visitors are not die-hards or theme park fanboys like most of us on forums like this one-they are only interested in coming to the parks and having fun.....

I bet most of the people hanging out at the Griffith Park Merry-Go-Round felt the same way.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Please don't make things up. It makes for poor and insincere discussion.

WDW can't do most Marvel characters in Orlando, and Universal can't do a Captain Jack Sparrow attraction; and you know that.
I didn’t make anything up. You repeatedly claim to love the creativity and originality of Imagineering, but then only ever argue why it is wrong. Now you have concocted a nonsense legal argument to again argue against something you claim to love. Universal can’t do a Pirates of the Caribbean attraction and you should know that. A theme park attraction is intellectual property no different than a movie. No legal protections are gained by basing an attraction on a movie.

There was no business justification for the franchise mandate. There was no legal justification for the franchise mandate.
 

Tony the Tigger

Well-Known Member
I didn’t make anything up. You repeatedly claim to love the creativity and originality of Imagineering, but then only ever argue why it is wrong. Now you have concocted a nonsense legal argument to again argue against something you claim to love. Universal can’t do a Pirates of the Caribbean attraction and you should know that. A theme park attraction is intellectual property no different than a movie. No legal protections are gained by basing an attraction on a movie.

There was no business justification for the franchise mandate. There was no legal justification for the franchise mandate.

They can absolutely do a generic pirates attraction.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
They can absolutely do a generic pirates attraction.
Pirates of the Caribbean is Pirates of the Caribbean. Universal can also make pirate movies, even supernatural pirate movies, but they can’t copy the movies made by Disney just the same as they can‘t copy the attractions. You’re also back to dismissing one of the most celebrated attractions ever created, one you claim to love, as not being unique or distinctive in any manner, something that should not be protected as intellectual property.
 

Tony the Tigger

Well-Known Member
Pirates of the Caribbean is Pirates of the Caribbean. Universal can also make pirate movies, even supernatural pirate movies, but they can’t copy the movies made by Disney just the same as they can‘t copy the attractions. You’re also back to dismissing one of the most celebrated attractions ever created, one you claim to love, as not being unique or distinctive in any manner, something that should not be protected as intellectual property.

You’re being deliberately obtuse.

That’ll be all.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
You’re being deliberately obtuse.

That’ll be all.
I’m not the one making a false argument with contradictory claims. What you describe as “obtuse” is your argument. Pirates of the Caribbean is only at risk of being copied if it is not creatively distinct. You’re trying to compare different levels of specificity that are not the same in order to claim a false legal advantage for a specific movie character over the general category of all pirate rides.
 
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lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Talk about hard headed - and let’s throw in poor reading comprehension.

Show me where I said anyone could COPY the specific POTC attraction and characters.

Next.
Universal’s ability to make their own pirate ride is only relevant if they can copy the specifics of Pirates of the Caribbean. You don’t recognize the comparisons you are making in your attempt to claim some sort of legal basis for the franchise mandate. Universal’s ability to make a pirate ride is the same as their ability to make a pirate movie. Their movie cannot include specifics from Disney’s movie just as their ride could not include specifics from Disney’s ride.
 
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Tony the Tigger

Well-Known Member
Universal’s ability to make their own pirate ride is only relevant if they can copy the specifics of Pirates of the Caribbean.

Wrong.

Let’s try this again: that’ll be all.

395F2E36-1BAC-47E6-814C-D220458D38CF.jpeg
 

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
Except they are kind of all second generation Future World, they would not get built today and D23 says the whole Future World concept is going to be removed from EPCOT.


Somebody said that Disney went on a spending spree to buy Marvel. Lucas films, Pixer... etc... for the theme parks.
You do not think maybe the studios so they can rake in 1.5 to 2 billion on box office receipts ?

I don’t think the studios need theme Park attractions to make money, I think they make attractions themed to their IP for some sort of synergy between the studios and parks.

As for EPCOT losing Future world, EPCOT lost the future long ago; the World Wide Web killed Future World long ago.

Let’s face it, the REAL EPCOT died long ago when Walt Died. From that moment on, the Walt Disney Compsny did the best they could with what we now call EPCOT.
 

Walt Disney1955

Well-Known Member
The honest truth is because the innovator who created so much of this stuff is dead, and has been for 53 years. It is like asking why there hasn't been a home run hitter as good as Babe Ruth. It is because he was the best at what he did, to this day.

Walt's vision is still prevalent in the parks. Since 1966 there was definitely a drop off in original ideas because the mind that created all of this stuff is no longer with us. Just think of a day at the Magic Kingdom for instance and the attractions that come with it. What are the ones that have Walt's original ideas?

- Pirates
- Haunted Mansion
- Country Bears (although in the rough stages when he died)
- Small World
- Carousel of Progress
- Hall of Presidents (inspired by "Great Moments with Mr. Lincoln from the 1964 World's Fair)
- Jungle Cruise
- Tiki Birds
- Tom Sawyer Island

53 years after he is gone these are the attractions that are based on original ideas from Walt's day that aren't from movies and that are still beloved at Magic Kingdom. Throw in Epcot as well. Sure it opened in 1982 and it was different from Walt's original vision but without him planning that idea before he died he wouldn't have planted the seed for it at all in the first place.

For starters there are less original ideas because the ones that Walt came up with are still filled in the parks and are loved. Secondly, there isn't someone with that sort of mind anymore.
 

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