Smoking areas GONE starting may 1st Pinned so people can still see the announcement.

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Ummm...income absolutely affects how much someone will spend on the statistical whole.

Sure their are billionaires that own the Pittsburgh pirates and Tampa bay DEVIL rays and squeeze a quarter so hard they make the eagle scream...and people in debt up to their eyeballs that spend like a sailor on shore leave...

But there is a statistical correlation between income/wealth and expenditures on leisure.

Welcome to “travel Econ 101”

So if smoking tends to trend to lower income - which of course it absolutely 100% does - then here you are.

 

[tallica]

Had to look up the 10 dollar word. profligate : a person given to wildly extravagant and usually grossly self-indulgent expenditure , utterly and shamelessly immoral

 

[Lensman]

Had to look up the 10 dollar word. profligate : a person given to wildly extravagant and usually grossly self-indulgent expenditure , utterly and shamelessly immoral

I meant it in the "wildly extravagant" sense, not the immoral sense. Spendthrift

 

[Bubba Feet]

Well I’ve smoked on Main Street and the rest before and there’s been nothing said so... meh. Can’t see it’s going to make any difference to me!

 

[LittleBuford]

Well I’ve smoked on Main Street and the rest before and there’s been nothing said so... meh.

On Main Street? Why would you do that?

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Ummm...income absolutely affects how much someone will spend on the statistical whole.

Sure their are billionaires that own the Pittsburgh pirates and Tampa bay DEVIL rays and squeeze a quarter so hard they make the eagle scream...and people in debt up to their eyeballs that spend like a sailor on shore leave...

But there is a statistical correlation between income/wealth and expenditures on leisure.

Welcome to “travel Econ 101”

So if smoking tends to trend to lower income - which of course it absolutely 100% does - then here you are.

Not to derail the thread any more than it already has been, but just want to throw this out there...

There are also differences in the way the wealthy vacation vs those from lower income brackets. A person of wealth is far more likely to take risks when choosing their vacation destinations, while a person with less disposable income is more likely to find a place that they enjoy and visit repeatedly rather than risk possibly not enjoying something that cost a decent chunk of change.

My cousin is independently wealthy. He took his daughters to WDW once. His daughter has now taken her toddler to WDW once for I think 4 days. I can see them maybe going back once more when the toddler is older or maybe possibly twice once the sister starts having children. They tend to gravitate more towards the islands off Cape Cod or the tropics when they vacation. I'd be stunned if they owned more than a handful of Disney merchandise.

Then you've got my sister, who makes a pretty decent living. She's taken my niece to WDW once (for I think 3 days while visiting someone they know who is local to WDW), and also gone on a Disney cruise. Unless my niece specifically asks to go to WDW again or their friends plan a group trip again (the cruise was one of these), they likely won't be heading back. Mind you, my sister does use credit to travel, and she vacations multiple times a year. If her new boyfriend decides he wants to take his kids to WDW, that might be another reason she'd go back, but I really don't see that happening. Disney merchandise/videos really aren't even a blip on my sister or niece's radar...I don't think my niece was ever dressed as a Disney princess even when she was a toddler.

Then you've got people like us. We don't make a ton of money, and aside from long weekend semi-local (driving distance) trips twice a year, we really don't travel all that much...except to go to Disney. For us, the cost of flights alone makes it not worth risking a vacation that one or more members of our little family might not enjoy, and all of us enjoy WDW. It's our family happy place. That said, we don't use credit for our trips (with the exception of a rental car once), and most of our trips to WDW are middle-of-the-road cost-wise (we tend to splurge on food/merchandise, rather than a room we only sleep and shower in). My husband and I both went once each as children, we honeymooned there, and since 2013, we've taken our boys three times with all of us chomping at the bit to go back (we're overdue). We don't stay strictly at the Value resorts, but most of our trips are for 6-7 days, if we can afford to splurge and stay longer, we do. We own most of Disney's (including Marvel, Star Wars, and Pixar) movies, and merchandise from all of Disney's brands makes up a large part of Christmas and birthdays. Our boys are as big, if not bigger, Disney fans than my husband and I are.

Then you've got AP holders and DVCers who have made an initial investment, but who generally spend way less in the parks than the typical vacationer does (I know a bunch of these) because they know they'll be coming back.

My point is that Disney may like the "fast cash" brought in by wealthier guests, but in the long haul who spends more? The family that visits 4 times over three generations, or the family that visits many more times over the same time span? This is where I feel like Disney is shooting themselves in the foot...they're jumping on the "let's make money NOW" bandwagon and neglecting the nostalgia and repeat guest base that curates the Disney fandom within their family, basically guaranteeing that Disney gets more new guests with each new generation. Sour that group to your product, and you're going to miss out on some serious cash.

 

[tallica]

Not to derail the thread any more than it already has been, but just want to throw this out there...

There are also differences in the way the wealthy vacation vs those from lower income brackets. A person of wealth is far more likely to take risks when choosing their vacation destinations, while a person with less disposable income is more likely to find a place that they enjoy and visit repeatedly rather than risk possibly not enjoying something that cost a decent chunk of change.

My cousin is independently wealthy. He took his daughters to WDW once. His daughter has now taken her toddler to WDW once for I think 4 days. I can see them maybe going back once more when the toddler is older or maybe possibly twice once the sister starts having children. They tend to gravitate more towards the islands off Cape Cod or the tropics when they vacation. I'd be stunned if they owned more than a handful of Disney merchandise.

Then you've got my sister, who makes a pretty decent living. She's taken my niece to WDW once (for I think 3 days while visiting someone they know who is local to WDW), and also gone on a Disney cruise. Unless my niece specifically asks to go to WDW again or their friends plan a group trip again (the cruise was one of these), they likely won't be heading back. Mind you, my sister does use credit to travel, and she vacations multiple times a year. If her new boyfriend decides he wants to take his kids to WDW, that might be another reason she'd go back, but I really don't see that happening. Disney merchandise/videos really aren't even a blip on my sister or niece's radar...I don't think my niece was ever dressed as a Disney princess even when she was a toddler.

Then you've got people like us. We don't make a ton of money, and aside from long weekend semi-local (driving distance) trips twice a year, we really don't travel all that much...except to go to Disney. For us, the cost of flights alone makes it not worth risking a vacation that one or more members of our little family might not enjoy, and all of us enjoy WDW. It's our family happy place. That said, we don't use credit for our trips (with the exception of a rental car once), and most of our trips to WDW are middle-of-the-road cost-wise (we tend to splurge on food/merchandise, rather than a room we only sleep and shower in). My husband and I both went once each as children, we honeymooned there, and since 2013, we've taken our boys three times with all of us chomping at the bit to go back (we're overdue). We don't stay strictly at the Value resorts, but most of our trips are for 6-7 days, if we can afford to splurge and stay longer, we do. We own most of Disney's (including Marvel, Star Wars, and Pixar) movies, and merchandise from all of Disney's brands makes up a large part of Christmas and birthdays. Our boys are as big, if not bigger, Disney fans than my husband and I are.

Then you've got AP holders and DVCers who have made an initial investment, but who generally spend way less in the parks than the typical vacationer does (I know a bunch of these) because they know they'll be coming back.

My point is that Disney may like the "fast cash" brought in by wealthier guests, but in the long haul who spends more? The family that visits 4 times over three generations, or the family that visits many more times over the same time span? This is where I feel like Disney is shooting themselves in the foot...they're jumping on the "let's make money NOW" bandwagon and neglecting the nostalgia and repeat guest base that curates the Disney fandom within their family, basically guaranteeing that Disney gets more new guests with each new generation. Sour that group to your product, and you're going to miss out on some serious cash.

Well said...... definitely fall into your category, that is until we decided to become locals.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Well said...... definitely fall into your category, that is until we decided to become locals.

I'm still driving my nearly 20-year-old truck because I'd rather spend on a family trip than take up car payments and higher insurance premiums. Trust me...I bend hubby's ear about becoming locals on the regular.

 

[SoupBone]

Well I’ve smoked on Main Street and the rest before and there’s been nothing said so... meh. Can’t see it’s going to make any difference to me!

Not a chance unless you were hiding in one of the alleys in a corner.

And why?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Not to derail the thread any more than it already has been, but just want to throw this out there...

There are also differences in the way the wealthy vacation vs those from lower income brackets. A person of wealth is far more likely to take risks when choosing their vacation destinations, while a person with less disposable income is more likely to find a place that they enjoy and visit repeatedly rather than risk possibly not enjoying something that cost a decent chunk of change.

My cousin is independently wealthy. He took his daughters to WDW once. His daughter has now taken her toddler to WDW once for I think 4 days. I can see them maybe going back once more when the toddler is older or maybe possibly twice once the sister starts having children. They tend to gravitate more towards the islands off Cape Cod or the tropics when they vacation. I'd be stunned if they owned more than a handful of Disney merchandise.

Then you've got my sister, who makes a pretty decent living. She's taken my niece to WDW once (for I think 3 days while visiting someone they know who is local to WDW), and also gone on a Disney cruise. Unless my niece specifically asks to go to WDW again or their friends plan a group trip again (the cruise was one of these), they likely won't be heading back. Mind you, my sister does use credit to travel, and she vacations multiple times a year. If her new boyfriend decides he wants to take his kids to WDW, that might be another reason she'd go back, but I really don't see that happening. Disney merchandise/videos really aren't even a blip on my sister or niece's radar...I don't think my niece was ever dressed as a Disney princess even when she was a toddler.

Then you've got people like us. We don't make a ton of money, and aside from long weekend semi-local (driving distance) trips twice a year, we really don't travel all that much...except to go to Disney. For us, the cost of flights alone makes it not worth risking a vacation that one or more members of our little family might not enjoy, and all of us enjoy WDW. It's our family happy place. That said, we don't use credit for our trips (with the exception of a rental car once), and most of our trips to WDW are middle-of-the-road cost-wise (we tend to splurge on food/merchandise, rather than a room we only sleep and shower in). My husband and I both went once each as children, we honeymooned there, and since 2013, we've taken our boys three times with all of us chomping at the bit to go back (we're overdue). We don't stay strictly at the Value resorts, but most of our trips are for 6-7 days, if we can afford to splurge and stay longer, we do. We own most of Disney's (including Marvel, Star Wars, and Pixar) movies, and merchandise from all of Disney's brands makes up a large part of Christmas and birthdays. Our boys are as big, if not bigger, Disney fans than my husband and I are.

Then you've got AP holders and DVCers who have made an initial investment, but who generally spend way less in the parks than the typical vacationer does (I know a bunch of these) because they know they'll be coming back.

My point is that Disney may like the "fast cash" brought in by wealthier guests, but in the long haul who spends more? The family that visits 4 times over three generations, or the family that visits many more times over the same time span? This is where I feel like Disney is shooting themselves in the foot...they're jumping on the "let's make money NOW" bandwagon and neglecting the nostalgia and repeat guest base that curates the Disney fandom within their family, basically guaranteeing that Disney gets more new guests with each new generation. Sour that group to your product, and you're going to miss out on some serious cash.

I don’t disagree with anything you said. Case in point...I do well and we are branching out. I have no interest to pay the full price ransom at WDW in this bubble economy. I’ll slow until insanity crashes like launchpad Mcquack.

But what is Disney looking to get? It used to be the “safe traveler” on repeat through incentives.

No longer...now it’s those with the wealth or self driven illusion of wealth. Higher short gains for execs looking to retire.

So the smoking ban makes even more sense in that context.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Well I’ve smoked on Main Street and the rest before and there’s been nothing said so... meh. Can’t see it’s going to make any difference to me!

Well I’d rat you out and make a specifically designed stink that I know the blue IDs can’t ignore...because I know what works.

Not fair to anyone else around you.

Have a magical day

 

[ImperfectPixie]

I don’t disagree with anything you said. Case in point...I do well and we are branching out. I have no interest to pay the full price ransom at WDW in this bubble economy. I’ll slow until insanity crashes like launchpad Mcquack.

But what is Disney looking to get? It used to be the “safe traveler” on repeat through incentives.

No longer...now it’s those with the wealth or self driven illusion of wealth. Higher short gains for execs looking to retire.

So the smoking ban makes even more sense in that context.

Yep. And I really do think they're going to reach a breaking point eventually. Business-wise, it's a very shortsighted strategy.

 

[networkpro]

Not to derail the thread any more than it already has been, but just want to throw this out there...
Sour that group to your product, and you're going to miss out on some serious cash.

Everyone has a different reality which may or may not be applicable to others situation. I make a decent amount of money, have been working at the same company for long enough to have a bunch of paid vacation each year, and still go to Disney as its value to my wife and I is fine. We split our vacation times between Disney and our places in the country. Our spending pattern doesn't match your narritive.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Everyone has a different reality which may or may not be applicable to others situation. I make a decent amount of money, have been working at the same company for long enough to have a bunch of paid vacation each year, and still go to Disney as its value to my wife and I is fine. We split our vacation times between Disney and our places in the country. Our spending pattern doesn't match your narritive.

I realize that, my aim was just to provide some examples.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Not to derail the thread any more than it already has been, but just want to throw this out there...

T
Then you've got people like us. We don't make a ton of money, and aside from long weekend semi-local (driving distance) trips twice a year, we really don't travel all that much...except to go to Disney. For us, the cost of flights alone makes it not worth risking a vacation that one or more members of our little family might not enjoy, and all of us enjoy WDW. It's our family happy place. That said, we don't use credit for our trips (with the exception of a rental car once), and most of our trips to WDW are middle-of-the-road cost-wise (we tend to splurge on food/merchandise, rather than a room we only sleep and shower in). My husband and I both went once each as children, we honeymooned there, and since 2013, we've taken our boys three times with all of us chomping at the bit to go back (we're overdue). We don't stay strictly at the Value resorts, but most of our trips are for 6-7 days, if we can afford to splurge and stay longer, we do. We own most of Disney's (including Marvel, Star Wars, and Pixar) movies, and merchandise from all of Disney's brands makes up a large part of Christmas and birthdays. Our boys are as big, if not bigger, Disney fans than my husband and I are.

Then you've got AP holders and DVCers who have made an initial investment, but who generally spend way less in the parks than the typical vacationer does (I know a bunch of these) because they know they'll be coming back.

My point is that Disney may like the "fast cash" brought in by wealthier guests, but in the long haul who spends more? The family that visits 4 times over three generations, or the family that visits many more times over the same time span? This is where I feel like Disney is shooting themselves in the foot...they're jumping on the "let's make money NOW" bandwagon and neglecting the nostalgia and repeat guest base that curates the Disney fandom within their family, basically guaranteeing that Disney gets more new guests with each new generation. Sour that group to your product, and you're going to miss out on some serious cash.

ahhh, I don't know. you forgot one other group. the first timers who are going to be one and done. Disney doesn't get "new guest" due to generational visitors. Disney pulls in the new folks from brilliant marketing. they've made WDW a necessity, parents are now programmed to take their kids at least once to wdw. then the mouseworld hopes they fall in love.
They hook the new generation because they make sure they saturate them with everything from movies to now a new streaming service.

I think the wealthy guest actually spend less money especially on the stuff that has great markup value. My wealthy friends and relatives don't buy disney shirts. I have a niece who rolls through college with a 600 buck burberry hoodie and louie vuitton bags, she's not buying a sweatshirt at the mouseworld. she's just not. they may pick up a charm for their bracelet but that's it.

I totally fit your dvc description but not sure if it's because I know I'll be back, I think it's more an issue of as I get older I don't need anymore crap. seriously, I don't need anymore tee shirts or hoodies, God knows I don't need more junk to fill up my house, I'm trying to declutter 50 years worth of junk as it is. so maybe every 5 years I get a photo album but outside of that, there isn't any thing I really want or need.

I also think Disney does a marvelous job on the upsell. people here might not like it but folks will pay for "experiences". My brother dropped almost a grand doing the bippide boopide bootique thing for his 3 granddaughters.

lol, I took a picture of this because it blew my mind the price

yet it was sold out when we checked. 500+ bucks for a mom and 2 daughters to have tea with the fairy godmother.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

ahhh, I don't know. you forgot one other group. the first timers who are going to be one and done. Disney doesn't get "new guest" due to generational visitors. Disney pulls in the new folks from brilliant marketing. they've made WDW a necessity, parents are now programmed to take their kids at least once to wdw. then the mouseworld hopes they fall in love.
They hook the new generation because they make sure they saturate them with everything from movies to now a new streaming service.

I think the wealthy guest actually spend less money especially on the stuff that has great markup value. My wealthy friends and relatives don't buy disney shirts. I have a niece who rolls through college with a 600 buck burberry hoodie and louie vuitton bags, she's not buying a sweatshirt at the mouseworld. she's just not. they may pick up a charm for their bracelet but that's it.

I totally fit your dvc description but not sure if it's because I know I'll be back, I think it's more an issue of as I get older I don't need anymore crap. seriously, I don't need anymore tee shirts or hoodies, God knows I don't need more junk to fill up my house, I'm trying to declutter 50 years worth of junk as it is. so maybe every 5 years I get a photo album but outside of that, there isn't any thing I really want or need.

I also think Disney does a marvelous job on the upsell. people here might not like it but folks will pay for "experiences". My brother dropped almost a grand doing the bippide boopide bootique thing for his 3 granddaughters.

lol, I took a picture of this because it blew my mind the price

View attachment 360745


yet it was sold out when we checked. 500+ bucks for a mom and 2 daughters to have tea with the fairy godmother.

The "one and done" almost describes my cousin and his daughters and grand-daughter. The older our boys get, the less we spend on merch - for exactly the reason you spoke of, lol. I'm over buying "stuff". Our merch spending really just shifts to experiences...but they have to be worth it (like boat rentals or horseback riding). We'd never spend on a cupcake party or dessert fireworks viewing.

 

[BoarderPhreak]

Well I’d rat you out and make a specifically designed stink that I know the blue IDs can’t ignore...because I know what works.

Not fair to anyone else around you.

Have a magical day

 

[Tanna Eros]

I'm still driving my nearly 20-year-old truck because I'd rather spend on a family trip than take up car payments and higher insurance premiums. Trust me...I bend hubby's ear about becoming locals on the regular.

Cheers to 20 year old trucks! I have a Tahoe myself, still with a working smoke lighter.

There's a built in return use to a product with dependability If WDW remains dependable in it's service, they'll have repeat customers from those who value their dollar.
When I spend money, I think of how many hours it took to get that money (well, now the money comes easier, tbh,). Is it worth that many hours of my life to own that item? Experience wise, hands down, I'll lay down dough. It will replace the work hours in my memories.

 

[VJ]

Seems like another great example for what Disney has needed all along. A demerit system in MDE. Three strikes you're out.

Get caught smoking... get a mark
Be an a s s that requires security get involved... get a mark
Get busted for disrupting other guests with your camera antics... get a mark

Accumulate enough, you get dimissed from the park. Keep doing it, get banned.

Vacation goers need their MDE accounts... AP holders can't readily change their identity without rebuying. So MDE provides a reasonable form of 'record' that can follow a guest.

i think by "a mark" you mean "an apology and a free fastpass for whichever attraction you want"

 

[Tanna Eros]

ahhh, I don't know. you forgot one other group. the first timers who are going to be one and done. Disney doesn't get "new guest" due to generational visitors. Disney pulls in the new folks from brilliant marketing. they've made WDW a necessity, parents are now programmed to take their kids at least once to wdw. then the mouseworld hopes they fall in love.
They hook the new generation because they make sure they saturate them with everything from movies to now a new streaming service.

I think the wealthy guest actually spend less money especially on the stuff that has great markup value. My wealthy friends and relatives don't buy disney shirts. I have a niece who rolls through college with a 600 buck burberry hoodie and louie vuitton bags, she's not buying a sweatshirt at the mouseworld. she's just not. they may pick up a charm for their bracelet but that's it.

I totally fit your dvc description but not sure if it's because I know I'll be back, I think it's more an issue of as I get older I don't need anymore crap. seriously, I don't need anymore tee shirts or hoodies, God knows I don't need more junk to fill up my house, I'm trying to declutter 50 years worth of junk as it is. so maybe every 5 years I get a photo album but outside of that, there isn't any thing I really want or need.

I also think Disney does a marvelous job on the upsell. people here might not like it but folks will pay for "experiences". My brother dropped almost a grand doing the bippide boopide bootique thing for his 3 granddaughters.

lol, I took a picture of this because it blew my mind the price

View attachment 360745


yet it was sold out when we checked. 500+ bucks for a mom and 2 daughters to have tea with the fairy godmother.

I'm a little embarrassed, now. I have tea with Fairy Godmother all the time. My mother looks dead onto her to the point that we got her a powder blue hoody robe one Christmas.
My father smoked on Main Street. In the 70's. I have the definite memory of him having to watch the 1776 parade at noon every day he was there. The Spirit of '76 would start the parade, (Fifer, drummer and flag bearer) and he just loved it. I can see him now my mind's eye, smiling, sitting on the curb in his JCPenney plaid Bermuda shorts, holding a cigarette down by his shoes. I think that was his happiest, and back then, I don't think they allowed drinks.