should there be a waiting period for wheelchairs

[Wilt Dasney]

How about everyone just focuses on the people in their own party. Rather than looking for ways that other people are cheating you? This is such a minor issue, I can't believe it comes up on these boards as frequently as it does.

Watch your kids smile, watch the birds, smell the turkey legs in the air.

Live and let live.

Just for the record I don't use ecvs or wheelchairs, I also don't let line jumpers and generally creepy wdw visitors bother me.

I'm with you. If you're letting other people's actions bug you on vacation, you're doing it wrong!

 

[ErickainPA]

very true cmatt, early stages of MS, surgery unseen, so many things.

my cousin can stand up from his chair but doesn't mean he can walk or stand long. My mom had knee surgery but she can walk and stand like others just fine, but for long walking like disney it's better to use a cart.

 

[mickeypal1]

Why not help spread the magic a little at Disney? Give people in ECV and wheelchairs a smile of encouragement! Many of these people already feel bad because they get many rude remarks and looks. They would love to be able to walk onto a ride or the bus. My wonderful MIL was treated badly by many people. She just wanted to spend time with her grandchildren at WDW. Without a ECV she would have been unable to do so. She did not choose to be disablied but she also did not choose to let it stop her from enjoying herself. We always waited in line for the bus. However, many people were mad because it took a minute or two to load her.

I say be thankful you are able to walk on the bus or stand in lines. My MIL would love to be able to do that. Also, hope that a member of your family never needs assistance. Smile and give them the minute or two it takes. You will make up the time when you get where you are going and can quickly walk to your destination.

 

[devoy1701]

So, If I got out of the chair to stretch my back and walk a bit, and my wife who was having serious knee problems at the time decided to sit and ride for a while, you would look at us and know we were abusing the system. Or would you make that assumption based on your preconceived notions?

see the problem? You really don't know. I know you said a bunch of teenagers in the chairs. I mean how often do you really see a bunch of kids, unsupervised with a wheelchair switching around? I can't imagine it happens all that often that it ruins your trip. I went three times last year and I never saw that problem once. If it is really that big of a deal than the real issue isn't the wheelchairs, it is the UNSUPERVISED kids and Disney not doing anything about that. IMO a completely different issue.

Maybe if teenager abuse of wheelchairs is rampant you should go to City Hall and make a complaint, instead of lumping all wheelchair users that you think shouldn't be in one with those abusing.

I'm sorry, this might sound mean but when I went in a wheelchair last time we had some fast passes for Peter Pan that we ended up not needing because of the wheelchair. We gave them to a family waiting in line. I hope you weren't that family.

what the hell are with some of you guys on here???

I obviously wasn't talking about someone with back or knee issues. I was clearly talking about a very obvious situation where there is clearly system abuse going on, such as this group who were horseplaying and clearly not needing a chair (unless they were simply having such a magical time that they forget they were injured when one of them jumped out of the chair and swapped places on their rolling thrown ).

I'm glad you feel the need to be rude. I have seen situations similar to the one I used as an example on numerous occasions, that's how I was able to come up with it. That is the benefit of visiting WDW 3 or 4 times a month, ever month for the past 4 years...you see alot of stuff!

But people in wheelchairs or ECVs never ruin my trips, nor have I ever stated that they do.

Geez...you can't have a civilized converstaion with anyone anymore. You always end up offending someone!

 

[zweltar]

To echo the sentiments of many people, just because someone "looks" healthy or okay doesn't mean they are. The invisible health problems that many people have (both of my parents included) can make it very uncomfortable at Disney. The dirty looks, the comments and such. Sometimes it can be very hurtful. And just because they can walk 10-20 feet to get on a ride or get to a bus seat, others assume that they should be able to walk for the entire day in the park.
I would say I'm sorry for a strong reaction, but I'm not sorry at all. It is ignorance toward others that can (and often does) take the magic out of the parks.

 

[fabroman]

Seven years ago I had a cast on my leg up until the DAY before I took my three kids, alone, to WDW for a national tumbling meet my daughter was competing in. My leg was so swollen and painful, I had not walked in 8 weeks before the trip, so yes, I rented a chair. Did I look impaired? NOPE. Was I impaired? YES.

I have a daughter with Lupus, she is going with us September. The heat and stress make it worse sometimes. Does she look impaired? NOPE, Is she impaired? YES. Will I rent a chair if she gets too tired? YEP, darn right I will.

I find it best to mind my own business, usually. And now, I have said my peace, but you all better duck because you are about to get slammed if this thread is not locked.

Ok, pass the popcorn please!

Yes, but you're not cutting lines are you?
If your simply going to the front of the lines b/c you're in a wheelchair thats ignorant. If you're jumping lines even for busses that's still rude.
If your not doing that, then more power to you.

 

[Bubb@]

I’ve always thought that attractions with a separate wheelchair entrance should have a machine at the start that spits out a ticket with the current time plus the stand by wait. Then the disabled party waits in the wheelchair queue until their ride time. That way everyone waits the same amount of time regardless of which line you’re in.

I love that idea.

 

[Pooh Lover]

People in wheelchairs could also wait with or without part of their party in an area (like the child swap area) while the other part of their party goes thru the regular line and then meet up to ride together.

 

[copcarguyp71]

Geez...you can't have a civilized converstaion with anyone anymore. You always end up offending someone!

Welcome to the wonderful world of internet forums!:wave:

 

[Monty]

People in wheelchairs could also wait with or without part of their party in an area (like the child swap area) while the other part of their party goes thru the regular line and then meet up to ride together.

So what would you do with a person or persons in wheelchair with nobody able-bodied in their party? :shrug:

The reality is Disney has been in the business of catering to guests, able-bodied or not, for decades. They might actually know a thing or two about running a Theme Park effectively. Disney has probably determined that it is not worth their effort to put convoluted practices in place to try to be "fair" to able-bodied guests by making the disabled wait. It's quite possible that Disney has determined that the disabled have enough other things going against them on a day-to-day basis that maybe it would be the decent thing to do to give them a bit of a break here and there to brighten their day.

Of course, humanitarian considerations or decency shouldn't be issues to the great internet culture....

Perhaps a few folks here would like to truly trade places with these disabled people they feel so wronged by for a week in Disney. Walk a mile in their shoes... Oh wait, silly me! They can't all walk.

 

[Babylon Control]

what the hell are with some of you guys on here???

I obviously wasn't talking about someone with back or knee issues. I was clearly talking about a very obvious situation where there is clearly system abuse going on, such as this group who were horseplaying and clearly not needing a chair (unless they were simply having such a magical time that they forget they were injured when one of them jumped out of the chair and swapped places on their rolling thrown ).

I'm glad you feel the need to be rude. I have seen situations similar to the one I used as an example on numerous occasions, that's how I was able to come up with it. That is the benefit of visiting WDW 3 or 4 times a month, ever month for the past 4 years...you see alot of stuff!

But people in wheelchairs or ECVs never ruin my trips, nor have I ever stated that they do.

Geez...you can't have a civilized converstaion with anyone anymore. You always end up offending someone!

Actually if this will make you feel any better, I saw one of the morbidly obese ECV users trying to cheat the system when I was there in December. Here's what happened.

As I stated in my earlier post, I was forced to use an ECV myself due to having a cast on my foot. Now when I could I would use the standby line but this was only when the lines were less than 10 minutes or if there were no stairs in the lines, otherwise I would speak to the CM working the line to find out how each particular line handled ECVs. Some lines handled them in the regular line, some in the fastpass line and some through the exit. This example occurred at Buzz Lightyear.

The first time I rode, the line was less than 10 minutes so I walked through the standby line. The second time the line was over 20 minutes long and I knew there was no way I could stand on my leg for that amount of time. So my mom (that was the extent of my travel party - me and my mom) and I went to the CM working the line and asked him how the line handled ECVs. He was going to tell me to park the ECV and make my way to the main Standby line, that is until he saw my cast. At that point he started writing me a 'Return Pass', which is similar to a fastpass but it allows me and the people in my party to return to the attraction at a certain time, usually the length of time that is equivalent to the current standby time is for the attraction but it is at the discretion of the CM working the line, and we can then enter through the fastpass line, ECV and all (at Buzz - Not all attractions allow ECVs through the fastpass line).

As I was sitting near the fastpass entrance waiting for the CM to write the return pass, a morbidly obese person on an ECV came zipping up to the fastpass entrance and tried to go in, simply because he saw me sitting there. The CM stopped him and told him, in no uncertain terms that he had to park his ECV and go through the standby line. The guy on the ECV acted as if he never heard the CM and again tried to drive into the fastpass line only to have the CM step in front of him and repeat that he had to park his ECV and enter through the standby line. The guy finally got the message and left. Once he left, the CM finished my return pass and let me through the fastpass line where I became a part of the regular line right up until the point where everyone has to get into their cars as the ECVs can't go on the moving walkways and I had a difficult time walking from a stationary surface to the moving walkways in my cast. At this point I was sent to the through to the exit and held until they had a number of ECVs/Wheelchairs to load at once.

 

[hrcollectibles]

i'm sorry this might sound mean but does it bother anyone else to see someone overweight or clearly able to walk, using a wheelchair to get to the front of a line, then watching them walk no problem onto the ride? shouldn't there be some sort of wait for them too? it just bothers me seeing some people ( not everyone) taking advantage of the system:shrug:

Maybe those that need the wheel chair can only walk for a short distance....People take advantage of systems all the time, that does not make it right..TO be honest when I am on vacation or when I am at home I do not worry myself with what others do... If they want to cheat or take advantage of the system they are free to do so but I will not judge nor will I let it ruin my vacation...

 

[devoy1701]

Actually if this will make you feel any better, I saw one of the morbidly obese ECV users trying to cheat the system when I was there in December. Here's what happened.

As I stated in my earlier post, I was forced to use an ECV myself due to having a cast on my foot. Now when I could I would use the standby line but this was only when the lines were less than 10 minutes or if there were no stairs in the lines, otherwise I would speak to the CM working the line to find out how each particular line handled ECVs. Some lines handled them in the regular line, some in the fastpass line and some through the exit. This example occurred at Buzz Lightyear.

The first time I rode, the line was less than 10 minutes so I walked through the standby line. The second time the line was over 20 minutes long and I knew there was no way I could stand on my leg for that amount of time. So my mom (that was the extent of my travel party - me and my mom) and I went to the CM working the line and asked him how the line handled ECVs. He was going to tell me to park the ECV and make my way to the main Standby line, that is until he saw my cast. At that point he started writing me a 'Return Pass', which is similar to a fastpass but it allows me and the people in my party to return to the attraction at a certain time, usually the length of time that is equivalent to the current standby time is for the attraction but it is at the discretion of the CM working the line, and we can then enter through the fastpass line, ECV and all (at Buzz - Not all attractions allow ECVs through the fastpass line).

As I was sitting near the fastpass entrance waiting for the CM to write the return pass, a morbidly obese person on an ECV came zipping up to the fastpass entrance and tried to go in, simply because he saw me sitting there. The CM stopped him and told him, in no uncertain terms that he had to park his ECV and go through the standby line. The guy on the ECV acted as if he never heard the CM and again tried to drive into the fastpass line only to have the CM step in front of him and repeat that he had to park his ECV and enter through the standby line. The guy finally got the message and left. Once he left, the CM finished my return pass and let me through the fastpass line where I became a part of the regular line right up until the point where everyone has to get into their cars as the ECVs can't go on the moving walkways and I had a difficult time walking from a stationary surface to the moving walkways in my cast. At this point I was sent to the through to the exit and held until they had a number of ECVs/Wheelchairs to load at once.

lol. you know someone is going to turn this story around on you and say something like "maybe the guy really didn't know the policy AND he was partially deaf on the side that the CM was standing on...you just don't know!!!"

but just like your story, my point was that there are some times when you just KNOW that people are cheating the system. Yes it's true that you can't always tell just by looking at someone, but we all know that it happens sometimes.

But who really lets it ruin their vacation? Yeah you might make a comment to someone in your group, you might accidently get an instinctive "look" on your face for a split second (my gf accuses me of these looks all the time), but you go on, they go on, and at the end of the day you're watching fireworks, eating a dole whip, and you've forgotten about the entire thing.

 

[memster]

The OP sorta came off pretty harsh. I understand the frustrations when you see people blatantly abuse the system. That's true in everything as other posters have mentioned.

That said, I caution those who are quick to judge. You don't know those people or their circumstances.

Several years ago I worked with a really great lady, single mom, worked very long hours to provide for her 3 kids. Great human being. If you saw her on an ECV you might think that's a lazy overweight person who needs to get off their tush & walk. The truth is this particular lady has arthritis so she physically cannot be doing a lot of walking which in turn has caused her weight issues. Then the weight issues cause the problems with her arthritis to worsen. She has tried everything under the sun to get her insurance provider to pay for her to have surgery to address the weight problems but they refuse. And a single mom supporting 3 kids just doesn't have the money to foot the bill on her own. An ECV is not optional for this person. Her condition is not something she is too lazy to do something about. She physically cannot.

Another example. My aunt was in a terrible car accident 20 years ago. Her leg/foot/ankle were broken very, very badly. Here's a lady who is a painfully independent soul who wants nothing from nobody. She has always prided herself in being completely self-sufficient. Her broken bones have never healed properly and to this day is permanently disabled. If you saw her cruising thru the parks on an ECV you'd never know there was anything wrong with her. If you saw her standing you'd not know. Occasionally she takes a few steps that can almost pass as normal. However, getting thru any amount of walking is not a luxury she has anymore. Believe me, she'd far rather be on foot like us zipping about. Unfortunately that wasn't the hand she was dealt. Some of you may look at her & think she's another bum abusing the system. Not so. I'm proud to say that she does not let her disability stop her from doing anything she wants to do. She rents her cart, does WDW solo when she feels like it, and doesn't depend on anyone else to do for her. She's as big a Disney fanatic as the rest of us so I'm happy for her to keep on doing what she loves in spite of what others may think.

And finally, I'd like to tell you about my father-in-law. Three years ago he was diagnosed with prostate cancer. He did a lot of research into all his options & elected to have radiation pellets inserted around the affected area vs. having the highly invasive surgery to remove everything. We were blessed in that the treatment worked and he's now cancer-free. The drawback is that there's still metal rods in there that weigh down & cause him excruciating pain when he stands or walks for prolonged periods. Also, that kind of activity can & has caused him to pass blood. Additionally, he has 3 vertebrae in his lower back that were broken when he was a kid. When on his feet or moving about for long periods he has numbness in his legs, shooting pain, and his back & neck cause him tremendous pain. My in-laws joined us at WDW in January. My father-in-law refused to rent an ECV. Following Illuminations one night we walked from just outside Germany to our resort bus. We had to stop 3 times for him to sit & rest. He had the worst time trying to keep moving throughout the trip and admits now that maybe he shouldn't have been so hard-headed about that cart. If you saw him in a park on an ECV you might think there's nothing wrong with him. If he parked his ECV and hopped off you might think, "Hey! That guy is being lazy!" In actuality, you couldn't be more wrong. My in-laws are discussing going back to WDW and a cart will be used by my FiL. I hope nobody says anything to him because they'll be peeling some of us off of them.

You can't judge a person by appearances or by 2 minutes of watching them. That's not fair. I understand there are those who would abuse the systems set up to help those who need it. I've seen those people myself. But is it fair to mistreat everyone because of those bad apples? I think not. Be kind. Leave the rest to karma. You never know, it might be you or your loved one needing a wheelchair or a cart someday. Treat those folks as you would want your loved one to be treated.

I so agree with you... I have a Grandson that has joint issues it's almost like adolescent arthritis yes we do use a wheelchair he hates it but I know a couple of hours in the park walking in he's going to be in extreme pain so yes when he tranfers to a ride he does look normal and yes I do get those looks from other people. I've never been confronted and I feel sorry for the person that ever trys.

 

[kittybubbles]

When talking about the rides, I do not see how 'renting a wheelchair' to cheat the system would work or make any sense. I believe Disney does issue a guest assistant card for guest who show the need, a guest would not need a wheel chair to have a guest assistance card that allowed the use of 'alternate entrances'. The guest card does limit the number of folks that can accompany the guest with the need.

I believe a guest with a scooter or a wheel chair would not be allowed to use an alternate entrance w/o the assistance card.

Newer rides (look at Midway Mania) have a separate line altogether where guest wait until certain ride vehicles are sent down to a separate loading area.

From reading about Disney's plans for Dumbo, I think they are trying to do more to make 'waiting' more enjoyable for all.

I understand the frustration being expressed, but I do believe that Disney already has a 'card' system based on guest needs and it does limit the number of 'guest' that can join them.

 

[Babylon Control]

When talking about the rides, I do not see how 'renting a wheelchair' to cheat the system would work or make any sense. I believe Disney does issue a guest assistant card for guest who show the need, a guest would not need a wheel chair to have a guest assistance card that allowed the use of 'alternate entrances'. The guest card does limit the number of folks that can accompany the guest with the need.

I believe a guest with a scooter or a wheel chair would not be allowed to use an alternate entrance w/o the assistance card.

Newer rides (look at Midway Mania) have a separate line altogether where guest wait until certain ride vehicles are sent down to a separate loading area.

From reading about Disney's plans for Dumbo, I think they are trying to do more to make 'waiting' more enjoyable for all.

I understand the frustration being expressed, but I do believe that Disney already has a 'card' system based on guest needs and it does limit the number of 'guest' that can join them.

This is not true. I had an ECV, rented from an off property company and I in no way needed a Guest Assistance Card to use the alternate entrance, when needed. Most times all it took was for me to explain to the CM at the entrance that there was no way for me to wait in the standby line with my cast for _________ reason. Usually the reason was due to the length of the standby line wait or the because there were stairs. In fact at Spaceship Earth, I never even spoke to the CMs at the line, I went straight to the alternate entrance and the CMs there never once asked for my Guest Assistance Card, simply asked me if I was able to transfer out of my ECV. And at Big Thunder Mountain, the CMs always directed me to the alternate entrance and never once asked me for a Guest Assistance Card. Not once in my entire 8 days was I ever asked for a Guest Assistance Card. But then maybe the cast on my foot made it obvious.

 

[puntagordabob]

We're getting away from the subject here, people (go figure)

We're talking about the Disney BUSING SYSTEM, NOT RIDES.

Wheelchairs on rides are COMPLETELY understandable, but the thread is about buses.

....discussing busses...i will respond to some points.

My youngest boy is in a wheel chair...cant really walk...has CP. My family consists of myself, my wife, and four kids (one of which is in the wheelchair). Sometimes my Grandma Mom at age 87 comes along in scooter but normally uses wheelchair.

Someone suggested splitting the groups up going onto the busses... in the case of my family you would be crazy if you think we would split up because there are 6 (7 if we include Mom at 87 years). NEVER gonna happen! The very IDEA of having part of our party on one bus and the other section on another bus is crazy! We are not abusing the system, but under the criteria posted regarding bus parties we would be split up.

Also for the record I have two artificial hips and other issues...I could probably do the wheelchair scooter thing with no issues...but I dont.. because thats NOT the kind of person I am.... so when at times when other parties with wheelchairs etc bumps me from a bus when I am alone without handicap members of my family, its a Bummer. BUT I accept it as part of being a decent human being.

Are some of the people cheating the system? Yes, seems rather obvious....but never so obvious that you KNOW for sure. Complain on the forums if you want....but if you were to question my family in public, your results would vary...but expect a nice public humiliation and it would be Yours, not ours.

One time I had a guy complain at me because I parked in a handicap parking spot with my placard back in 2001.... so I offered to drop my pants to show him my two artificial hip operation scars....started to even unbuckle my pants... a person who was walking by (no idea who he was) decided to explain to the other guy that he was quite the ash-hole and to mind his own business.

At Disney, it is not your place to say a word to anyone... if you want to complain, tell a CM... but to say a word to another guest is not only ignorant, but in this day and age it could end up in you seeing stars...

People that whine about handicapped people ought to change places with any of us....I'll give up my parking placard if youll trade my two titanium hips for your good natural bone hips.....

I wish the Admins would lock this topic.

 

[stlbobby]

When talking about the rides, I do not see how 'renting a wheelchair' to cheat the system would work or make any sense. I believe Disney does issue a guest assistant card for guest who show the need, a guest would not need a wheel chair to have a guest assistance card that allowed the use of 'alternate entrances'. The guest card does limit the number of folks that can accompany the guest with the need.

I believe a guest with a scooter or a wheel chair would not be allowed to use an alternate entrance w/o the assistance card.

Newer rides (look at Midway Mania) have a separate line altogether where guest wait until certain ride vehicles are sent down to a separate loading area.

From reading about Disney's plans for Dumbo, I think they are trying to do more to make 'waiting' more enjoyable for all.

I understand the frustration being expressed, but I do believe that Disney already has a 'card' system based on guest needs and it does limit the number of 'guest' that can join them.

This is not true. I had an ECV, rented from an off property company and I in no way needed a Guest Assistance Card to use the alternate entrance, when needed. Most times all it took was for me to explain to the CM at the entrance that there was no way for me to wait in the standby line with my cast for _________ reason. Usually the reason was due to the length of the standby line wait or the because there were stairs. In fact at Spaceship Earth, I never even spoke to the CMs at the line, I went straight to the alternate entrance and the CMs there never once asked for my Guest Assistance Card, simply asked me if I was able to transfer out of my ECV. And at Big Thunder Mountain, the CMs always directed me to the alternate entrance and never once asked me for a Guest Assistance Card. Not once in my entire 8 days was I ever asked for a Guest Assistance Card. But then maybe the cast on my foot made it obvious.

I think two things are being combined or mixed up here. The Guest Assistance Cards are generally for families with a member that can't stand in a line, but it is for a reason that wouldn't be readily apparent to a CM at a ride, i.e asthma or autism. They are issued at guest services and often require a doctors note, but I'm not sure if it is absolutely necessary.

For wheel chairs and EVC's the CM's don't need a card because the chair itself makes it obvious.

I am not an expert on these issues and just going by what I've researched, maybe someone with firsthand knowledge could provide greater insight.

 

[mickeypal1]

....discussing busses...i will respond to some points.

My youngest boy is in a wheel chair...cant really walk...has CP. My family consists of myself, my wife, and four kids (one of which is in the wheelchair). Sometimes my Grandma Mom at age 87 comes along in scooter but normally uses wheelchair.

Someone suggested splitting the groups up going onto the busses... in the case of my family you would be crazy if you think we would split up because there are 6 (7 if we include Mom at 87 years). NEVER gonna happen! The very IDEA of having part of our party on one bus and the other section on another bus is crazy! We are not abusing the system, but under the criteria posted regarding bus parties we would be split up.

Also for the record I have two artificial hips and other issues...I could probably do the wheelchair scooter thing with no issues...but I dont.. because thats NOT the kind of person I am.... so when at times when other parties with wheelchairs etc bumps me from a bus when I am alone without handicap members of my family, its a Bummer. BUT I accept it as part of being a decent human being.

Are some of the people cheating the system? Yes, seems rather obvious....but never so obvious that you KNOW for sure. Complain on the forums if you want....but if you were to question my family in public, your results would vary...but expect a nice public humiliation and it would be Yours, not ours.

One time I had a guy complain at me because I parked in a handicap parking spot with my placard back in 2001.... so I offered to drop my pants to show him my two artificial hip operation scars....started to even unbuckle my pants... a person who was walking by (no idea who he was) decided to explain to the other guy that he was quite the ash-hole and to mind his own business.

At Disney, it is not your place to say a word to anyone... if you want to complain, tell a CM... but to say a word to another guest is not only ignorant, but in this day and age it could end up in you seeing stars...

People that whine about handicapped people ought to change places with any of us....I'll give up my parking placard if youll trade my two titanium hips for your good natural bone hips.....

I wish the Admins would lock this topic.

:sohappy:You have some very good points! Thank you for posting.

 

[Monty]

I think two things are being combined or mixed up here. The Guest Assistance Cards are generally for families with a member that can't stand in a line, but it is for a reason that wouldn't be readily apparent to a CM at a ride, i.e asthma or autism. They are issued at guest services and often require a doctors note, but I'm not sure if it is absolutely necessary.

For wheel chairs and EVC's the CM's don't need a card because the chair itself makes it obvious.

I am not an expert on these issues and just going by what I've researched, maybe someone with firsthand knowledge could provide greater insight.

You're correct. Occupants of ECVs and wheelchairs generally don't need a GAC unless there is some other factor in play that may need more accommodation that what is routinely afforded to them.

But Disney does not request or require a medical note. The CM at GR who gave my my first GAC explained that she had no medical training and the note would mean nothing to her. I simply explained what I couldn't do and she gave me the corresponding type of GAC.