News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[marymarypoppins]

I do find Disney's silence on this very interesting.

Well being vocal is what has gotten them here .

 

[Disstevefan1]

The two biggest ways it hurts Disney?

1. They will need to get county approval on infrastructure projects and the county approval process will almost assuredly not be as quick as it was getting approval from RCID, and

2. Since RCID was basically controlled by Disney, they could control the fees for basic services, including building plan approval. Now, there is nothing preventing the counties from assessing enormous fees to make Disney foot the bill for the general public. For example, there is nothing preventing Orange County Florida from creating a fee structure where the entity seeking building permit approval must pay a fee commensurate with the number of man hours spent by the county in the permit approval process for that particular permit. That way, the more time and county government services Disney uses, the more Disney pays to the county government in fees. And it definitely won't be less than they pay to RCID.

And of course, this doesn't even address the permits the county denies because **INSERT NONSENSE BUREAUCRATIC REASON HERE**

Disney does not care. They will simply do less infrastructure, less building in WDW, AND NOW they now they can blame the counties and the state.
It doesn't matter what the offerings are at WDW. Folks will still come.
Disney wins again.

 

[EeyoreFan#24]

I’m just curious because currently guests and cast can call 24/7 for Reedy Creek paramedics to check them out with their health issues and or transport to the hospital where they want to go locally of course. This is all free of charge to the patient. If no more Reedy Creek will there be a medical charge passed onto the patient if and when Orange County takes over?

My guess is since the area of service, rescue requirements, specialty equipment needed for the physics jurisdiction won’t change, RCFD people and equipment will be absorbed into the county. Logos will change, personal may transfer around and have more OT opportunities, but also the policies of the county will take over for everything including billing. (Disney could still cover costs, but would they is the question). Would be no different than if someone fell at the old fudruckers across the street.

I’d be more afraid the “Disney district” would be run and lumped into the budget by the county. Counties all over fl have issues staffing and equipping the general population. What would guarantee Disney’s tax payment to the county instead of RCID would go to Disney areas. (I don’t know, maybe someone else does) What pull would disney have if they were lobbying for more coverage.

(Sorry, after I wrote this I see only one or two lines relates to the reply, the rest is going off on a tangent.)

 

[AdventureHasAName]

Feel sorry for Disney? LOL, when RCID gets removed, Disney can DUMP a 2 BILLION debt on to the taxpayers!
And the law that started this mess will be probably be overturned eventually.
Disney Wins again.

There is literally no debt that Disney currently owes that the government cannot find a way to reassess to the company at will. The notion that Disney would be able to escape its debt and pin it on the general public and the state and local governments would just throw up their hands and say, "That sucks. We've been foiled again!!!" and go home is absurd.

EDIT: Two immediate solutions come to mind ... first, they could tax employers with more than X amount of employees and just pick a threshold number that only applies to Disney in that county, or second, they could put a gigantic toll booth right outside the Disney property and annihilate the company's employees and customers with toll charges for the next couple decades.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

The only thing I can think of that really would hurt Disney by doing this is that the financing for infrastructure projects (such as the Disney Springs garages) would have to be financed in a normal fashion instead of being financed through municipal bonds.

I don't have time to look into RCID bonds at the moment but if they are tax free municipal bonds then there is a huge benefit to Disney because they are issued at lower interest rates because the bond holders don't have to pay tax on the interest. If this is what they do, they can do things like finance a garage at 3% instead of 5.5% or whatever the going rate is for Disney corporate bonds. On projects that cost tens of millions of dollars, that savings adds up.

Also, Orange County won't repave World Drive as an example because it is a private road in the same way that private developments within the county have to repave their own roads when necessary. With RCID under their control, they can have RCID contract the work. Even though Disney pays for it via taxes to RCID, the cost would be lower assuming they are using tax free municipal bonds.

These seem to be a couple of the few downsides for Disney. Their roads are public but they maintain them as private, very few potholes at Disney, that may change if the county takes over. It’s also very easy for Disney to adjust to traffic patterns right now, if RCiD ends so does the speed in which they can get anything done.

I also wonder if it would mean more little annoyances like beeping dump trucks on property during the day rather than after hours due to a government schedule rather than a customer service schedule.

It seems like this would hurt Florida much more than Disney but since Disney has never tried to get rid of it themselves there must be pros we are missing.

 

[MurphyJoe]

Feel sorry for Disney? LOL, when RCID gets removed, Disney can DUMP a 2 BILLION debt on to the taxpayers!
And the law that started this mess will be probably be overturned eventually.
Disney Wins again.

Interesting take. RCID dissolves so their bonds default and get passed to FL's taxpayers. Disney fights the action in court and wins due to comments made about the dissolution being retaliatory in nature. RCID reforms without the debt as it's been transferred due to the previous default.

 

[lordsigma]

RCID going away. Does that mean... the horror... normal green road signs?

RCID may just be the start. Don’t want to be treated as a political organization? Don’t be political. If Disney continues to act as a lobbying arm for the DNC, they should expect much more pushback.

Americans with different views are not evil. Stop treating them that way. They’re potential customers. Try finding a way to respect their views, too.

Pushback by public criticism on a certain media outlet and on social media and by people who disagree not spending their money at Disney parks or on Disney + - sure. I made this point yesterday but I think whatever one thinks about the law or whether Disney should have commented is somewhat irrelevant to this point. My issue with this is the idea of government retaliation to essentially excercising free speech about an issue. Yes free speech rights don't protect you from consequences of the content of that speech on all forms - in this case attention in the media, social media, the internet, and conservative consumers who may choose not to patronize Disney's businesses as a result - that's the free and open market and free speech rights don't protect you from market consequences for the content of the speech and shouldn't. But free speech rights should protect you from retaliatory action by government for exercising said speech..

 

[zombiebbq]

It doesn't matter what the offerings are at WDW. Folks will still come.
Disney wins again.

Anyway I can't imagine this is good for Disney. If it was they would have petitioned to get rid of RCID a long time ago. I mean they won't even do housekeeping right now to save a buck.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Anyway I can't imagine this is good for Disney. If it was they would have petitioned to get rid of RCID a long time ago. I mean they won't even do housekeeping right now to save a buck.

When RCID gets removed, Disney can DUMP a 2 BILLION debt on to the taxpayers!
And the law that started this mess will be probably be overturned eventually.
Disney Wins again.

 

[Lilofan]

These seem to be a couple of the few downsides for Disney. Their roads are public but they maintain them as private, very few potholes at Disney, that may change if the county takes over. It’s also very easy for Disney to adjust to traffic patterns right now, if RCiD ends so does the speed in which they can get anything done.

I also wonder if it would mean more little annoyances like beeping dump trucks on property during the day rather than after hours due to a government schedule rather than a customer service schedule.

It seems like this would hurt Florida much more than Disney but since Disney has never tried to get rid of it themselves there must be pros we are missing.

Good points , Disney World is 24/7 operational even though parks are closed at a certain time. If Orange County waste disposal and repair do take over will they come in the middle of the night or do guests have to see, smell , take videos of the waste and sewage if it does explode like a volcano? ( example )

 

[JusticeDisney]

Two things that should be kept in mind regarding this news:

1) this underscores exactly why most politicians are absolute laughingstocks
2) this will not hurt Disney in any way, shape or form

 

[AdventureHasAName]

Disney does not care. They will simply do less infrastructure, less building in WDW, AND NOW they now they can blame the counties and the state.
It doesn't matter what the offerings are at WDW. Folks will still come.
Disney wins again.

If they wanted to, the county could force them to apply for a permit every time they need to replace a lightbulb.

 

[lordsigma]

Pushback by public criticism on a certain media outlet and on social media and by people who disagree not spending their money at Disney parks or on Disney + - sure. I made this point yesterday but I think whatever one thinks about the law or whether Disney should have commented is somewhat irrelevant to this point. My issue with this is the idea of government retaliation to essentially excercising free speech about an issue. Yes free speech rights don't protect you from consequences of the content of that speech on all forms - in this case attention in the media, social media, the internet, and conservative consumers who may choose not to patronize Disney's businesses as a result - that's the free and open market and free speech rights don't protect you from market consequences for the content of the speech and shouldn't. But free speech rights should protect you from retaliatory action by government for exercising said speech..

And on a further point - for the business reasons I stated - I agree Disney should have kept their mouth shut - but with what was going on with employee pressure it was somewhat darned if you do darned if you don't. They were in a pretty tricky spot. And they took a stand and there's nothing wrong with them having consequences in the public discourse or market for that. I don't think it's contradictory to simultaneously believe Disney made a dumb decision by opining but also being of the opinion that DeSantis and the state GOP are going way too far with this punitive bill that isn't really to the benefit of Florida taxpayers.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I take your point regarding Disney paying for Disney by way of RCID, whereas home developers pass the infrastructure costs onto the home buyer by way of the CDD debt, however, my position is that this arrangement benefits the free market by ensuring that smaller home builders like the one I worked with can exist in the market and compete against the likes of Lennar and DR Horton, who dominate the Central FL landscape. This arrangement is not perfect, but I can't personally think of a more effective strategy, because companies will always pass along their costs to the consumer one way or another.

More importantly, I maintain that Disney should pay directly for their infrastructure. If they need a highway overpass at the MK toll plaza (their property), they should arrange for the work and pay for it out of their enormous coffers. They should also be forking over some money to the counties, outside of ordinary taxes, for new infrastructure development that serves them (but not exclusively); same with Universal vis-a-vis Epic Universe.

Again, developers working in minimum 1,000 acres chunks aren’t that small. That’s the minimum threshold to create a district. Actual smaller developers don’t get that advantage. It creates a lot of incentives for sprawl since those costs can be passed on and obscured in massive developments versus actual smaller developments that infill existing built out space.

The mechanisms for ensuring a location-based entity covers financing are districts, and those districts always trade some level of say for the financing. Whether it is a special district, business improvement district, tax allocation district, or even a Resort Area there is some trade off. You can’t just say “These areas or those businesses pays more”

 

[The Mom]

I’m just curious because currently guests and cast can call 24/7 for Reedy Creek paramedics to check them out with their health issues and or transport to the hospital where they want to go locally of course. This is all free of charge to the patient. If no more Reedy Creek will there be a medical charge passed onto the patient if and when Orange County takes over?

It would depend upon their insurance coverage, or lack thereof.

 

[Figgy1]

Interesting take. RCID dissolves so their bonds default and get passed to FL's taxpayers. Disney fights the action in court and wins due to comments made about the dissolution being retaliatory in nature. RCID reforms without the debt as it's been transferred due to the previous default.

Could that even happen? If Disney fights and wins wouldn't that undo everything?

 

[Touchdown]

Again, I’m not a lawyer but I’ve got to think it’s a legal question to determine if the legislature can simply say that a provision that states a dissolution must be put to a vote locally simply does not apply in this situation. While this is being put through the legal system, RCID will continue.

 

[Disstevefan1]

If they wanted to, the county could force them to apply for a permit every time they need to replace a lightbulb.

When RCID exits No. After RCID is gone, Yes. And they will, And WDW can blane the county and state..
No real loss here, they are not very good at replacing light bulbs at WDW now

 

[DisneyCane]

Two things that should be kept in mind regarding this news:

1) this underscores exactly why most politicians are absolute laughingstocks
2) this will not hurt Disney in any way, shape or form

Politicians are laughing all right. They are laughing at the people who keep reelecting them (both parties). The incumbent reelection rate is some insanely high percentage (80%+ IIRC) even though government bodies always have high disapproval ratings.

As far as #2, if this will not hurt Disney and could be of some benefit to Disney, why have they not previously dissolved RCID on their own. I don't know enough to know what it is but there must be some significant benefit to Disney for RCID to continue to exist.

 

[lordsigma]

Again, I’m not a lawyer but I’ve got to think it’s a legal question to determine if the legislature can simply say that a provision that states a dissolution must be put to a vote locally simply does not apply in this situation. While this is being put through the legal system, RCID will continue.

I think at the end of the day there's a very good chance that after the dust settles and media attention moves on from this and they get their bragging rights for sticking it to Disney they'll quietly declaw the provision and most of the status quo will continue.