News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[threvester]

“Breaking news. We have just learned that the local professional sports teams was bribed by local officials to build a new stadium. In exchange for owning and operating the stadium the team agreed to pay for all land acquisition, infrastructure and construction costs.”

See foxboro stadium

 

[Disone]

The state shouldn't stop because right now you have one company that operates under a special setup which gives it an advantage over the other companies. If I were Universal or Seaworld I would hate to see Florida back off and allow Disney to maintain their advantage. Would you like it if the state you lived in gave your neighbor a lower tax rate for life?

Do you know about the massive elevated traffic circle for Universal's epic universe theme park? Universal is paying $160 million of the cost but Orange county is paying $125 million and the state of Florida is throwing in an extra 16 million.

How much did Orange and Osceola counties pay for the roads, bypasses and overpasses within the boundaries of Reedy Creek improvement district?

 

[flynnibus]

Both. In 1965 they could have said "the mill rate for themed entertainment enterprises is $X. Every themed entertainment enterprise will pay the same mill rate."

They're not charging Disney anything extra. They're charging "everyone" equally. it just so happens that Disney is the only "everyone" around.

again.. catch up.

1) Mil rates are capped
2) They wouldn't have been able to raise money on property that wasn't actually developed for that... and watch out.. it took DECADES for Disney to develop much of the land. All while infrastructure was built out decades prior.
3) The property spans multiple counties.... further complicating who supplies what

This whole idea wasn't haphazard. At least at the bare minimum you need to read the FL Law Review article from a great author to at least grasp the skeleton of what you believe happened.. https://ir.law.fsu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1123&context=lr

 

[Disney Analyst]

This is where you might be wrong, and where DeSantis is really putting himself in a potentially dangerous position re: a Presidential campaign.

Playing heavily to the base will win you a primary, as you mentioned, but it could easily kill his chances in a general election. There are already moderate Republicans (and more importantly, independents) who have soured on him over the things he's done in Florida. Not solely this Disney issue, but it is part of it. He doesn't want to end up in a Trump situation where people that would normally vote Republican just don't vote.

DeSantis will not have the numbers he needs on a national level to win. Moderates, and independents are not going to vote for him, he is alienating many with his culture war, brutish style of politics, as opposed to focusing on real issues that actually impact Americans.

 

[ctrlaltdel]

THERE WAS NOBODY ELSE IN THE COUNTY.

A special district is a nice advantage because it carves out a specific area to tax to raise the necessary funds to operate, build capital projects, etc.

Disney essentially got to set up it's own local governing body because it is a much easier financing mechanism than paying for it themselves (now they have access to cheap municipal bonds and a planning structure to approve and build necessary projects) or burdening other county taxpayers with the load of financing the massive infrastructure necessary to build out and expand the property. This also had the effect of shielding said projects from political pressure since they were funding it themselves (through the special district).

 

[LAKid53]

THERE WAS (practically) NOBODY ELSE IN THE COUNTY.

And those that were there would have participated in the huge boon that Disney brought to the region, so of course they should have participated in the infrastructure investment costs.

Incorrect. Neither Orange County or Orlando were vacant in 1966.

 

[lentesta]

Based on case law, the way to read this from the Florida constitution:

No bill of attainder, ex post facto law or law impairing the obligation of contracts shall be passed.​

Is:

No bill of attainder shall be passed.​

​

No ex post facto law shall be passed.​

​

No law impairing the obligation of contracts shall be passed.​

In Calder v. Bull, the U.S. Supreme Court held that ex post facto laws only apply to criminal matters.

I knew punctuation was important.

 

[peter11435]

THERE WAS (practically) NOBODY ELSE IN THE COUNTY.

Sure if you consider the 6 largest county in the state by populations over 350,000 residents all to be nobody

 

[CaptainAmerica]

A special district is a nice advantage because it carves out a specific area to tax to raise the necessary funds to operate, build capital projects, etc.

Disney essentially got to set up it's own local governing body because it is a much easier financing mechanism than paying for it themselves (now they have access to cheap municipal bonds and a planning structure to approve and build necessary projects) or burdening other county taxpayers with the load of financing the massive infrastructure necessary to build out and expand the property. This also had the effect of shielding said projects from political pressure since they were funding it themselves (through the special district).

A for-profit enterprise should not have access to municipal bonds.

Either the whole place is a business and they should finance the thing through corporate debt and/or the issuance of equity, or the infrastructure is public and should be paid for by a bona fide government body.

 

[flynnibus]

THERE WAS (practically) NOBODY ELSE IN THE COUNTY.

And those that were there would have participated in the huge boon that Disney brought to the region, so of course they should have participated in the infrastructure investment costs.

So you want what you claim is a virtually non-existent population to fund the massive infrastructure build out of an entire city... in just a few years.. for something they don't even use themselves? And you think this is a good thing? Vs having the guy that needs it pay for it? Dude, listen to yourself

You're comically wrong... oh and the county had over 250k residents at the time.

 

[GoofGoof]

Sure if you consider the 6 largest county in the state by populations over 350,000 residents all to be nobody

Who needs facts

 

[peter11435]

A for-profit enterprise should not have access to municipal bonds.

Either the whole place is a business and they should finance the thing through corporate debt and/or the issuance of equity, or the infrastructure is public and should be paid for by a bona fide government body.

The company didn’t have access to municipal bonds… the district did.

The infrastructure in question is public and was paid for by a bona fide government body

 

[flynnibus]

A for-profit enterprise should not have access to municipal bonds.

Either the whole place is a business and they should finance the thing through corporate debt and/or the issuance of equity, or the infrastructure is public and should be paid for by a bona fide government body.

This was already decided by the state supreme court... deciding that the bond use was in line with public use.

Don't worry, they didn't build Cinderella Castle with any bonds.

 

[BuddyThomas]

Correct, and it's usually the Left that gets up in arms about these deals. But this time the Left is suddenly pro-corporatism because Orange Man Junior Bad.

Uhhh, no. That’s not what is happening. At all.

 

[ctrlaltdel]

A for-profit enterprise should not have access to municipal bonds.

Either the whole place is a business and they should finance the thing through corporate debt and/or the issuance of equity, or the infrastructure is public and should be paid for by a bona fide government body.

I would argue that the governance structure clearly is a municipal entity. It provides all sorts of services that a municipal entity would and charges Disney (and the other smaller property owners) fair-market rate for those services, whether it be through utility payments or taxes. Disney itself is not taking out the bonds, even if they pay the vast majority of the taxes to fund the operation of RCID.

Disney is obviously getting something out of it, as it easier to work with a local government that doesn't have the other political incentives to worry about, such as other property owners not wanting to widen roads or build more theme parks. But I would argue there isn't anything unseemly or unethical in the relationship. Disney World is quite unique in the world and there is an argument that RCID is one of the more successful examples of a special taxing district anywhere in the world.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

The company didn’t have access to municipal bonds… the district did.

The infrastructure in question is public and was paid for by a bona fide government body

As I've said elsewhere, my primary objection is not to the existence of the district per se, it's to Disney's perpetual control of the district.

I understand that the district was a government body and that it was created through proper legislative means. I'm not questioning the legality. I'm questioning the morality of such a body being wholly controlled by a for-profit enterprise.

 

[lazyboy97o]

A for-profit enterprise should not have access to municipal bonds.

Either the whole place is a business and they should finance the thing through corporate debt and/or the issuance of equity, or the infrastructure is public and should be paid for by a bona fide government body.

So it’s wrong that Universal wants to pay for SunRail service instead of making the people of Volusia County pay for it?

 

[scottieRoss]

If there were bona fide residents of the district who were actual citizens with self-interest, then fine. But there weren't. The "residents" were corporate shills.

You are forgetting that corporations are people.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Interesting Tweet:




Besides everything else happening, one has to imagine the type of conversations taking place between Disney's Government Relations team and state officials.

This has been mentioned before. It’s literally the first few pages of the Comprehensive Plan.

https://www.rcid.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/2032-RCID-Comprehensive-Plan.pdf

 

[MagicHappens1971]

You are forgetting that corporations are people.

It doesn’t matter what he forgot. The “corporate shills” were still people. Residents.