News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
So, is there a compromise to be made? I'd agree Disney giving up a board seat or Nuclear Power Plant is not a compromise in itself, but what if they agree to do that to give Desantis his win, and then they add something extra to make the deal even better for Disney than before? I have no idea what that would be, just thinking out loud, but maybe that is where the compromise would come in (and yes, I realize compromise is probably the wrong term here).

Does Disney even have a say in any of this?

A compromise would indicate Disney (RCID) is sitting at the table trying to find a solution but it seems this is 100% legislative and Disney is just a bystander watching like the rest of us.

I’m sure they are lobbying and talking behind the scenes but I don’t think they have to agree to anything for this to be undone or even modified.
 

LAKid53

Official Member of the Girly Girl Fan Club
Premium Member
Does Disney even have a say in any of this?

A compromise would indicate Disney (RCID) is sitting at the table trying to find a solution but it seems this is 100% legislative and Disney is just a bystander watching like the rest of us.

I’m sure they are lobbying and talking behind the scenes but I don’t think they have to agree to anything for this to be undone or even modified.

I'm pretty sure the tax assessors in both Orange and Osceola counties have passed on to their legislative delegation what the tax & budget ramifications for the counties and property owners would be.
 

LSLS

Well-Known Member
Other than backing off, what more could the state give Disney? RCID had taxing, permitting and operational control. Frankly, it serves less like a special district and more like a county.

Honestly I have no idea. I'm as far from knowledgable on what Disney receives for the district/other incentives as anyone out there, just throwing out there the idea that maybe they roll that way.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Does Disney even have a say in any of this?

A compromise would indicate Disney (RCID) is sitting at the table trying to find a solution but it seems this is 100% legislative and Disney is just a bystander watching like the rest of us.

I’m sure they are lobbying and talking behind the scenes but I don’t think they have to agree to anything for this to be undone or even modified.
Do you have a say in your local government? A good representative would listen to their constituents, and given the relationship between Disney and the Districts electorate, they’re going to have a say.

Creating an actual new District would absolutely involve Disney because new districts require unanimous approval from landowners.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
Well, it is. To give up the right to construct a power generating plant - actually they wouldn't do it, Duke Energy would do it for them and operate it - is foolish. You think FPL would concede to something like that?

FPL isn't RCID. So what's your point? RCID can buy power from other utilities as it does today. Why is there any interest at all for a Nuke power plant? RCID isn't in that game, isn't in a position to host one, and has no need other than a power need which is a commodity they can get from many other sources.

Where is this new urge to need a nuke power plant coming from?
 

LAKid53

Official Member of the Girly Girl Fan Club
Premium Member
Honestly I have no idea. I'm as far from knowledgable on what Disney receives for the district/other incentives as anyone out there, just throwing out there the idea that maybe they roll that way.

The only thing I could think of that would have real benefit to Disney is to allow RCID to handle the permitting that now must go through SFWMD. But that would be giving TWDC more, not less, power.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
The mind obviously goes to Neville Chamberlain, but I wasn't really referring to that specifically. There are numerous instances of appeasement that just lead to further problems down the road.

While DeSantis will personally move on, the Florida Legislature as a whole will not, and there are others in the Florida Legislature that have advocated for moves like this.

Sure, but fighting now doesn't make those other people go away either. So you're stuck playing future predictions... Do you blow up everything now for the POTENTIAL of what happens in the future? Like I said, winning doesn't preclude that future from happening either. So, fight now for what? It doesn't secure anything about the future. The attacks can still come as they did this time.


So as they say, focus on what you can control. Disney doesn't NEED this fight as long as the concessions are trivial. Disney has far more to lose then to gain by digging in IMO. Unlike Desantis, who just wins favor by being wasteful and malicious as long as they can spin the target into a common enemy with his fan base.

Disney risks looking bad for almost anything they do.. DeSantis only looks bad to the people who were against him from the start anyways. It's not a good spot for Disney to fight from. This is why Disney has to tread lightly and let the machine do its work vs being aggressive and trying to tear this down way out in front.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
That’s not answering the question. Electricity in Florida is generally provided by private companies. So yes, anybody could start their own electric company to provide services, and that company would be allowed to operate a nuclear power plant. If I could put together the capital to take FPL private I could do that and I would own a couple of nuclear power plants.
At the state level this is likely true. The NRC does have the authority to reject a permit to build and/or a sale if the new owner is not deemed qualified. For example, just having the money to buy or build the plant isn’t sufficient, you would have to show the financial capability to properly maintain and operate the facility for its life and beyond. There are many costs that continue long after a nuclear plant is retired. That being said, I doubt the NRC would find RCID inadequate as an owner due to the steady cash flows from Tax dollars. To my knowledge the only non-financial limitation is they will not allow a foreign entity or government to be the majority owner and that’s for national security reasons. They cannot pick and choose owners based on whether they “like” the company.

Where the state comes in would be around safety plans and safe operations. The NRC in conjunction with FEMA have to approve safety and evacuation plans but developing those plans is the responsibility of state and local governments. If the state determined there was no way to effectively and safely evacuate people from around the site they could not approve a safety plan the project would be rejected. This happened in Long Island in the 80s where a plant was built but never reached full operations because the state refused to approve safety plans. This is basically a long winded way of saying if the state was really worried about Disney (through RCID) building a nuclear power plant they already had the built in mechanism to stop that without any change to the district.

IMHO there’s zero chance a new nuclear plant is licensed so close to a major tourist area and a large population center anyway so the whole debate was just a political talking point.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
FPL isn't RCID. So what's your point? RCID can buy power from other utilities as it does today. Why is there any interest at all for a Nuke power plant? RCID isn't in that game, isn't in a position to host one, and has no need other than a power need which is a commodity they can get from many other sources.

Where is this new urge to need a nuke power plant coming from?
It’s not about needing a plant. It’s about the precedent of establishing the idea that you can exclude entities from engaging in otherwise allowable activities because of their political associations.

Sure, but fighting now doesn't make those other people go away either. So you're stuck playing future predictions... Do you blow up everything now for the POTENTIAL of what happens in the future? Like I said, winning doesn't preclude that future from happening either. So, fight now for what? It doesn't secure anything about the future. The attacks can still come as they did this time.


So as they say, focus on what you can control. Disney doesn't NEED this fight as long as the concessions are trivial. Disney has far more to lose then to gain by digging in IMO. Unlike Desantis, who just wins favor by being wasteful and malicious as long as they can spin the target into a common enemy with his fan base.

Disney risks looking bad for almost anything they do.. DeSantis only looks bad to the people who were against him from the start anyways. It's not a good spot for Disney to fight from. This is why Disney has to tread lightly and let the machine do its work vs being aggressive and trying to tear this down way out in front.
Not fighting almost never results in things just stopping. It just becomes an invitation to seek more. Yes, fighting now may result in more fighting later but not fighting now pretty much guarantees more fighting with bigger stakes.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
It’s not about needing a plant. It’s about the precedent of establishing the idea that you can exclude entities from engaging in otherwise allowable activities because of their political associations.


Not fighting almost never results in things just stopping. It just becomes an invitation to seek more. Yes, fighting now may result in more fighting later but not fighting now pretty much guarantees more fighting with bigger stakes.

Disney doesn't want to be the hero here - It wants to crawl back into the shadows and hope someone else takes the stage.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
IMHO there’s zero chance a new nuclear plant is licensed so close to a major tourist area and a large population center anyway so the whole debate was just a political talking point.
As a hypothetical, what if the District wanted to buy Orlando’s ownership stake in one of the reactors at St. Lucie? Or what if we were talking about Orlando? Assume they didn’t have that stake in St. Lucie, would you really be saying that the City of Orlando should be prohibited from using nuclear while other jurisdictions that provide power can?
 

LSLS

Well-Known Member
Didn't this fight significantly impact how people viewed Disney as well? Meaning it had a real negative impact on the company just getting into a fight here? I'd think it would make the most sense for them to ensure politicians don't think they can get easy wins by doing stuff to you when it could really impact your company as well.
 

LAKid53

Official Member of the Girly Girl Fan Club
Premium Member
FPL isn't RCID. So what's your point? RCID can buy power from other utilities as it does today. Why is there any interest at all for a Nuke power plant? RCID isn't in that game, isn't in a position to host one, and has no need other than a power need which is a commodity they can get from many other sources.

Where is this new urge to need a nuke power plant coming from?

That's not the point. The point is allowing the Florida Legislature to restrict one entity from providing power from a specific source while not prohibiting other operators from the same. Not for safety, financial or regulatory concerns, but due to politics. And once that happens, it opens the door for the state to punish not only private corporations, but county and municipal governments, while allowing the same activity for others. All because of politics...
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Again... businesses don't operate on Hero mentality. They know they have the legal high ground here... but as long as they don't give it up, needing to defend it or not is a business decision.
Since when do businesses not like stability and minimizing costs? That’s your business reason, to try and avoid doing this every two years whenever someone wants to juice their fundraising and profile.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
As a hypothetical, what if the District wanted to buy Orlando’s ownership stake in one of the reactors at St. Lucie? Or what if we were talking about Orlando? Assume they didn’t have that stake in St. Lucie, would you really be saying that the City of Orlando should be prohibited from using nuclear while other jurisdictions that provide power can?
The city of Orlando cannot be restricted in the same way because it’s not a special district. As a special district RCID has a limited scope and has limited authority and those limits are set by the state. One of the purposes is to provide utility services to WDW and other businesses in the district. Restricting the district’s right to own a nuclear power plant does not stop it from achieving that goal. The district can enter into a long term PPA where they receive all or part of the output of a nuclear power plant without officially owning and operating the plant. They are also free to build and operate any other type of power generation facility that is allowed in the area. So there are options.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
The city of Orlando cannot be restricted in the same way because it’s not a special district. As a special district RCID has a limited scope and has limited authority and those limits are set by the state. One of the purposes is to provide utility services to WDW and other businesses in the district. Restricting the district’s right to own a nuclear power plant does not stop it from achieving that goal. The district can enter into a long term PPA where they receive all or part of the output of a nuclear power plant without officially owning and operating the plant. They are also free to build and operate any other type of power generation facility that is allowed in the area. So there are options.
Municipalities are not sovereign, they too are subdivisions of the state whose authority and power are defined by the state.
 

bpiper

Well-Known Member
A new district would not necessarily have the same land. One of the other land holders could choose not to participate in the new district.
Question: Just who are those other land holders?

Doesn't Disney/RCID de-annex the property when they sell it? Like at Celebration and Golden Oak? The hotel row and Swan/Dolphin are on Disney owned land that is leased to the Hotels.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Didn't this fight significantly impact how people viewed Disney as well? Meaning it had a real negative impact on the company just getting into a fight here? I'd think it would make the most sense for them to ensure politicians don't think they can get easy wins by doing stuff to you when it could really impact your company as well.
It’s hard to say what the real impact was. I’ve seen people here state they wouldn’t go back to WDW after the initial fight and then some of the same people have since posted trip reports. I think there was some damage done but there would have been damage done by saying nothing too. Disney also has customers who expect them to speak up and be inclusive and they are trying to please them too. I know it was dismissed by many as corporate speak, but what Iger said makes sense and is probably the best approach.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
Since when do businesses not like stability and minimizing costs? That’s your business reason, to try and avoid doing this every two years whenever someone wants to juice their fundraising and profile.
Rather than repeat myself...
Sure, but fighting now doesn't make those other people go away either. So you're stuck playing future predictions... Do you blow up everything now for the POTENTIAL of what happens in the future? Like I said, winning doesn't preclude that future from happening either. So, fight now for what? It doesn't secure anything about the future. The attacks can still come as they did this time.


So as they say, focus on what you can control. Disney doesn't NEED this fight as long as the concessions are trivial. Disney has far more to lose then to gain by digging in IMO. Unlike Desantis, who just wins favor by being wasteful and malicious as long as they can spin the target into a common enemy with his fan base.

Disney risks looking bad for almost anything they do.. DeSantis only looks bad to the people who were against him from the start anyways. It's not a good spot for Disney to fight from. This is why Disney has to tread lightly and let the machine do its work vs being aggressive and trying to tear this down way out in front.
 

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