So, you're saying RCID is a lower risk bond issuer than either Orange or Osceola county?
Wow, that's harsh. I can practically see them being called deadbeat counties.
Owning land in better run areas is worth more, news at 11.
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News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District
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Wow, that's harsh. I can practically see them being called deadbeat counties.
Owning land in better run areas is worth more, news at 11.
DisneyDebRob
Well-Known Member
You havent heard? The new talk is..you have your truth and i have mine..whatever the heck that means. Is there a headquarters somewhere with guys and gals banging their heads coming up with this stuff? New words.. talking points.. catch phrases..etc. theres a new one every few months.Just a reminder: “fake news” is a term for the fools that by definition doesn’t exist.
There are lies and there is truth…and then people spin all shades of those categories for attention and money.
carry on
Still a public service not a Disney one.
Should NASA pay for Florida State Road A1A since lots of traffic on is headed toward the Kennedy Space Center?
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
I’m not saying that necessarily.
I just know RCID bonds are very low risk/high value investments.
It literally contains the largest, highest revenue/profit generating complex owned by a single entity in the United States. People forget that.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
What makes you think it didn’t? Nasa and the US DOT have the same boss
UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
Of course. I said it somewhere above in the pages and pages of commentary but all that would do is shift the basis for litigation.
That idea is about as well-considered as the original bill to just dissolve RCID.
peter11435
Well-Known Member
And it’s important to point out that this reaches outside of the district sometimes as well. If someone calls 911 from the Buena Vista Place Apartments or gets into an accident on reams Road or certain sections of I4, Reedy Creek emergency services will respond as the closest first responder. They aren’t Disney and they aren’t even Disney’s guests but they will benefit from these public services.As far as the debt goes, that was used to pay for past projects done by RCID so not only would local taxpayers have to pay for future public services within the current RCID boundary, they would be covering debt payments to pay back bonds used on those past projects.
They're not really services for Disney. They're public services provided within RCID. It just so happens that most of those are related to Disney as the largest land owner.
When someone drives down Buena Vista Dr, Osceola Pkwy, World Dr, they're not Disney. When water run off doesn't wash out those roads so someone can drive down them, they're not Disney. When someone's car catches fire and the fire fighters put it out, they're not Disney. When someone calls an ambulance, they're not Disney. They're someone in the public using a public service.
It's unfortunate that we need to spell that all out. But, there's clearly people that don't understand that. When we say to Disney, it feeds into their incorrect perspective.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
I totally understand, and everyone knows in reality TWDC controls RCID but it can't be proven in court.
Reality and the court system (everywhere, not just in Florida) are two different things.
There's other roads that look like they're more restrictive. I would be willing to bet NASA did pay for those, bridges and all.
I picked State Road A1A specifically. It's a "state road". It goes near but not only to the space center. It goes other places too. But, it is the largest looking road that gets super close. I'm willing to bet it sees tons of traffic on launch days.
The point was, just because something is a big draw in the area for lots of people, that doesn't mean they are solely responsible for the public services. They're still public services paid for by the public.
In the case of RCID, the largest public taxpayer just happens to be Disney.
Of course, that didn't "just happen", it was by design and maintained in that ratio by design too. Doesn't change the fact that taxes are paid and those taxes are used to pay for the public services.
Of course Disney has huge influence on RCID. They hold a vote to determine the RCID government and the vote is based on ownership within RCID. Disney is enough of that vote to always get whomever in charge they want.
That doesn't make them the "same thing".
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
I agree with you, as you say, Disney is enough of that vote to always get whomever in charge they want.
You can call it "huge influence" I will call it "control" its just words.
Florida just cant take over the RCID because the law eliminates it. A new law creating a new RCID would need to be passes. However, Disney would have a great lawsuit against it because it would be unfairly taxing Disney for services they are already paying the counties for. Desantis blew this big time. The law he supported and signed is clearly stupid because Disney agreed to pay more in taxes so they could have better roads and services for their customers.
Now if anyone doubts this, look at the roads on Disney propery and then look at the roads outside. If you get sick on property you are not only provided free transportation to medical services but also back to property, anywhere you want to go. Florida must either repeal the stupid law or have the courts declair it illegal and pay the bonds and provide the services Disney is paying the counties for. Even if Disney somehow has to pay for the bonds the entire cost of the yearly budget for the RCID will have to be paid by the counties. This is just stupid. Let the RCID continue as it has been and let Disney pay for better services to those who use the parks and resorts. RCID is a win win for Disney and the Counties.
Now if anyone doubts this, look at the roads on Disney propery and then look at the roads outside. If you get sick on property you are not only provided free transportation to medical services but also back to property, anywhere you want to go. Florida must either repeal the stupid law or have the courts declair it illegal and pay the bonds and provide the services Disney is paying the counties for. Even if Disney somehow has to pay for the bonds the entire cost of the yearly budget for the RCID will have to be paid by the counties. This is just stupid. Let the RCID continue as it has been and let Disney pay for better services to those who use the parks and resorts. RCID is a win win for Disney and the Counties.
GoofGoof
Premium Member
Exactly this
Under Florida statute, when a special district is dissolved, all assets and debts are to be assumed by the local government(s) which will take over whatever function the special district formerly provided. Part of the millage rate WDW pays to RCID is to service that debt.
Those bonds were issued by Reedy Creek. They can't just be "handled" in any manner DeSantis thinks they can unless there specific language in the bond covenants allowing such. He's made comments to the effect that Disney won't escape its debts. The municipal bonds are debts of Reedy Creek, not TWDC.
RCID has about $79 million in outstanding utilities revenue and refunding bonds and approximately $766 million in outstanding ad valorem tax bonds, according to Fitch (a bond rating service).
Which will require some sort of legislation to do so. And most likely approval of the electors of the District.
JoeCamel
Well-Known Member
So where did the higher number (1.2B?) come from they were throwing around before?
kong1802
Well-Known Member
Exactly this.
GoofGoof
Premium Member
That seems to be the biggest rub to me. How can it be legal to arbitrarily setup a special tax district and levy additional taxes on the landowners in the district without giving them any say in how the district is run? The taxpayers have to have a say.
flynnibus
Premium Member
Or they just pass a law that cancels out the 4c law before the deadline - this isn't a barrier
Correct.
RCID's millage rate of 13.5741 won't become that of either Osceola or Orange County as Florida law caps what counties can charge. One reason special districts are created.
So Disney will find its overall tax liability decreased if RCID is dissolved next June. It will also find the level of services it received for that ~$150M in taxes it paid to RCID lessened when it now has to get those services from the county. And the counties can't charge WDW a higher millage than it charges other property owners. Thus, Orange County will be getting approximately 40 more square miles to provide services for WITHOUT a corresponding increase in tax collections as WDW is already paying taxes to the county. In essence, it just got a new city nearly the size of Ocala to provide water, waste, fire, emergency, roads, etc., for. It's going to have to raise property taxes. I doubt the county charter allows it to operate at a deficit. And that millage increase will go before voters.