News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Then why do they need to change the comprehensive plan and the development agreement? To this day the board has not identified any actual issues with the comprehensive plan. The only issue they have identified is affordable housing, something already allowed throughout almost the entire district.

That’s already the worst part of the plan. Not because I oppose affordable housing…because I don’t want Florida’s problems being planted behind a hedgewall next to Coronado springs

 

[Chi84]

Where do you think the District was going to facilitate all those critical tasks they wanted to address like affordable housing, services for workers, etc? And the absurd comments from the Gov about prisons was not haphazard. All of this was said knowing the District doesn't have the developable land to do any of this.

While none of it had real teeth, it's all posturing, which you now question as if it were... unsubstantiated?

I’m not sure what you mean. The posturing was real but the teeth were not.

 

[Dranth]

Wait,...didn't we all agree that Disney had the legal and moral high ground on this and that Disney's business was in NO danger from ANY of this?

Disney always has and still does have the moral high ground in this instance, at least for anyone who doesn't approve of dictatorships and blatantly ignoring whole chunks of the Federal and Florida constitutions.

Also, I don't believe anyone said there was no danger. Many people pointed out that due to the partisan nature of the courts that it could go either way and rested almost entirely on which judge they got. It was also pointed out that no matter who "won", the ruling was all but guaranteed to be appealed by the other side but hey, continue to twist what people said to fit whatever perceived slight you feel.

Did we not clearly establish over the past two years that Disney's logo was essentially bulletproof and that any "small" amount Disney brand damage was only due to a tiny minority of small weirdo consumer groups?

Yes, I think we all agreed on this and that Disney had (and still has) nothing to fear on the public relations side. The deep love and consumer goodwill for this company is rock-solid and unwavering in 2024.

No one ever claimed they were immune from bad movies, overpricing everything and nickel and diming people to death. What they are insulated from is boycotts from small, fringe groups which is what the number of people following this fight closely who are willing to boycott would be. If that group really made that much of a difference we would see a major decline across all parks, not just a minor one at WDW.

Bottom line, not being able to build because you are fighting with the state is bad for business, an infinitesimally small group of people who care enough about this fight refusing to buy anything Disney is not.

 

[flynnibus]

I’m not sure what you mean. The posturing was real but the teeth were not.

So I think you answered your own question then... When you say "What did he say that makes you think" -- Their statements and posturing.

It's not like they fear the courts throwing out their ideas.

 

[Chi84]

Comments like this one from DeSantis today. Similar comments I feel have been made in the past.

“So we have an interest as a state in moving forward to make this region very strong. This Tourism Oversight board, and that district is a big part of that. I think that there’s going to be ways where, you know, we can do things that are in the best interest of the State of Florida, and I think Disney can be a part of that.”

I could be reading too much into it. But it just seems like they are interested in developing the land with or without Disney.

That doesn’t say anything about taking Disney’s land and developing it. How are they going to take Disney’s land and why?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Comments like this one from DeSantis today. Similar comments I feel have been made in the past.

“So we have an interest as a state in moving forward to make this region very strong. This Tourism Oversight board, and that district is a big part of that. I think that there’s going to be ways where, you know, we can do things that are in the best interest of the State of Florida, and I think Disney can be a part of that.”

I could be reading too much into it. But it just seems like they are interested in developing the land with or without Disney.

Very legitimate concern…his particular ilk don’t observe guardrails in public by keeping the goals and discussion that should be private…well…private

 

[Ghost93]

At the end of the day I said this was coming several posts ago. DeSantis and crew really have no interest in keeping this fight going now considering the outcome of his political ambitions.

Disney just needs to focus on negotiating the best agreements possible so they can get back to running their parks. No more of this cat and mouse game that has been going on for the last couple of years.

Agreed. While I don't think Desantis and Disney will ever be on great terms, the end of his presidential campaign kind of took away the main driver behind his war with Disney in the first place.

Hopefully the next governor of Flordia — whether they be Republican or Democrat — is friendlier to the company. I think this feud is one of the main reasons why Walt Disney World has been so slow in announcing projects/construction plans the past couple of years, as there was so much uncertainty about the future.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Man, you're a genius! Do you think that they could rent the Galactic Starcruiser to the state penitentiary system? It shouldn't take much modification. That way we can get the prison and the 5th gate!

The cafeteria would be considered cruel and unusual punishment…but then again I think be our guest is too

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Agreed. While I don't think Desantis and Disney will ever be on great terms, the end of his presidential campaign kind of took away the main driver behind his war with Disney in the first place.

Hopefully the next governor of Flordia — whether they be Republican or Democrat — is friendlier to the company. I think this feud is one of the main reasons why Walt Disney World has been so slow in announcing projects/construction plans the past couple of years, as there was so much uncertainty about the future.

That would be best…but I think we opened the Pandora’s box of wingnuts and it could get worse

 

[lazyboy97o]

I’m not sure what you mean. The posturing was real but the teeth were not.

And Disney just gave them their teeth back. Why would they not continue to pursue any of that? They can now make Beyond Big Thunder contingent on providing land for district projects.

 

[flynnibus]

My theory is... the back channel to DeSantis and his team finally got through and everyone started talking $$$ for Florida (and DeSantis' campers)

DeSantis' tone is obvious... this isn't something done without his direct involvement. This isn't a settlement with the district... this is a settlement with DeSantis' camp. Clearly DeSantis' comments are coming from first hand perspective of objectives and priorities.

Remember awhile back when the message was the parties wouldn't connect... yeah obviously that is old news and the power brokers, not the lawyers, finally had a meeting of the minds.

Someone should watch the political contribution spigot opening back up from Disney.

 

[RamblinWreck]

I’m not sure there was any point to the state level litigation anyway. Wasn’t all of that moot the moment the state of Florida retroactively nullified the contract?

 

[Dranth]

The real losers here are Americans. Political and corporate backdealings matter more than your constitution.

Yep. Sad but not really all that surprising these days.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

My theory is... the back channel to DeSantis and his team finally got through and everyone started talking $$$ for Florida (and DeSantis' campers)

DeSantis' tone is obvious... this isn't something done without his direct involvement. This isn't a settlement with the district... this is a settlement with DeSantis' camp. Clearly DeSantis' comments are coming from first hand perspective of objectives and priorities.

Remember awhile back when the message was the parties wouldn't connect... yeah obviously that is old news and the power brokers, not the lawyers, finally had a meeting of the minds.

Someone should watch the political contribution spigot opening back up from Disney.

But to what end? He’s a lame duck with no clear path forward as of now…and last year went very disastrously for him. It’s hard to see what he specifically can glean from this?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Seems to me the state clearly won. Disney has 'conceded' itself a win behind the scenes - as in the whole event is over, they've clearly regained a working dialogue and are clearly moving towards being allowed to do whatever they want developmental wise again. Of course, why shouldn't they, the state trying to destroy their golden goose made absolutely no sense.

The real losers here are Americans. Political and corporate backdealings matter more than your constitution.

The whole “constitution” thing is like a shiny object here. There are many issues with “constitutionality” in this and damn near every court proceeding.

Yep. Sad but not really all that surprising these days.

I don’t think we’ve hit the low point yet…if you want to be really depressed?

 

[Chi84]

And Disney just gave them their teeth back. Why would they not continue to pursue any of that? They can now make Beyond Big Thunder contingent on providing land for district projects.

I suppose anything is possible. But given the tenor of the governor’s remarks I don’t see any benefit to them in doing it.

What district projects? You know more about land development than I do but wouldn’t anything of that nature have to be included in the yet to be negotiated development agreements? The ones that Disney referred to as a contingency for deferring briefing in their federal suit?

 

[Tha Realest]

But to what end? He’s a lame duck with no clear path forward as of now…and last year went very disastrously for him. It’s hard to see what he specifically can glean from this?

I think the personal and professional lives of the CFTOD folks being rattled affected this long term, as did the imminent prospect of them being deposed.

I don’t think it’s a coincidence this settlement occurred as all of that was happening, and the board and leadership is undergoing a lot of changes.

I mean, what is the coincidence that a GOP-leaning but longtime Disney vendor partner suddenly appears on the board as this happens?

I suspect you’ll find future hearings will be far more pragmatically focused on the core competencies of what used to be RCID.

 

[BrianLo]

Then why do they need to change the comprehensive plan and the development agreement? To this day the board has not identified any actual issues with the comprehensive plan. The only issue they have identified is affordable housing, something already allowed throughout almost the entire district.

I think this is probably Disney's win behind the scenes.

It all looks like a complete governmental win today and quietly, most of the shielding will occur moving forward with the new comprehensive plan and developmental agreement. But this time both quietly and with the governor's silent approval.

Sort of the DisneylandForward strategy. Wait it out as opposed to fight it out. Something else clearly was agreed to behind the scenes, which the governor will never acknowledge. Even the shuffling of the board is evidence.

 

[flynnibus]

I suspect you’ll find future hearings will be far more pragmatically focused on the core competencies of what used to be RCID.

What did you find unfocused?

Besides the unnecessary prayer sessions and stupid employee recognitions (wrong place, wrong audience)... they were very business focused. The place I would expect to see a change of course is the coordinated public speaker non-sense.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I suppose anything is possible. But given the tenor of the governor’s remarks I don’t see any benefit to them in doing it.

What district projects? You know more about land development than I do but wouldn’t anything of that nature have to be included in the yet to be negotiated development agreements? The ones that Disney referred to as a contingency for deferring briefing in their federal suit?

The new development agreement has to come after the new comprehensive plan and any changes to the zoning regulations. I don’t think we should expect it any time soon because otherwise you largely get the agreement they just killed.

A development agreement locks in the existing regulations. So if the board changes the regulations to require more development review that gets locked in. If they institute impacts fees and/or alternatives then those become part of the agreement.

The whole issue of affordable housing was/is a sham because under state law affordable housing is now special. It can now be built by right in a variety of zoning districts such as commercial and mixed-use (most of the buildable land of the district). So even with a development agreement, affordable housing can be built at Walt Disney World.

The federal lawsuit is a lousy contingency. If the district makes changes to the comprehensive plan and regulations that Disney doesn’t like and doesn’t want to lock in an agreement then Disney is still stuck having to follow the changes they don’t like in the meantime. Restarting the federal suit cannot pause changes to the local regulations.