Problems I ran into having Beauty and the Beast castle in my MK park (PLEASE READ)

[KentB3]

As most of us already know, the Magic Kingdom park in my Disney theme park proposal has Beauty & the Beast castle. Unfortunately, I have run into a few problems; mostly involving Entertainment in the park(s). Here is a list of what I ran into so far:

* Since B&TB have the castle, I thought it would be appropriate to run the stage show; which is in fact based on the popular Broadway show. At first, I had planned on running the show at Disney Studios, but then thought it should be closer to the castle.

* The castle stage would be the best setting, since the castle is B&TB castle after all. However, this limits the popular stage show in terms of scenery, seating, and effects. For example, an indoor theater would have the advantage of creating more realistic and elaborate stage effects; most notably the transformation of the Beast into Vincent, the prince. Also, many of the elaborate indoor scenes would have to go, for example, the very memorable ballroom scene. Also, these backdrops would obscure the castle too much. I then thought about the moving the show to Fantasyland Theatre, but that seemed too distant from the castle to me.

* Beauty and the Beast is a popular stage show at Disney-MGM, and is inside a 1,500 seat theater. There is nowhere near enough seating at the castle stage for a show on this magnitude-- if B&TB were staged here on the castle stage; between the parades, fireworks, etc., Main Street (the side that the castle stage faces) would be a cluttered, overcrowded mass of people all day!

* I had orginally planned a shorter, smaller-scale stage show similar to Cinderella's Surprise Celebration; hosted by Belle and the B&TB characters, but with various other Disney characters as well. To me, multi-character shows seem to fit the castle stage better! If I place B&TB stage show in Fantasyland in the MK, it would create a sense of monotony and B&TB overload!

* The castle selected actually comes from after its transformation, when the spell was lifted and the Beast turned into Vincent. As far as I know, only the Beast is avaliable for meets & greets, parades, etc. Vincent only appears at the end of the stage show after the "transformation" takes place.

* In a recent Disney park proposal, BT&B castle was chosen for a villians-based Thrill Ride 5th WDW park proposal; therefore, B&TB castle may seem too dark to fit into the MK.

* I then moved the B&TB stage show back to the Disney Studios park; but then, it just seemed like more B&TB overload due to the castle, shows, etc. in the MK!

Therefore, I am seriously having second thoughts about using B&TB castle in my Magic Kingdom park. The above reasons may be why it was never used in any of Disney's parks; which is a terrible shame, since it is perhaps one of the most beautiful Disney cartoon castles, in addition to one of the most successful Disney animated feature films! (B&TB was in fact nominated for an Academy Award for Best Picture!) Also, B&TB castle is very original in design; especially the domed ballroom on the castle's left side-- which I found so striking that I even placed a B&TB dark ride inside this part of the castle!

BTW, B&TB castle wasn't even my first choice for the MK castle-- my selection was in fact determined by a poll I conducted, since many felt that my first choice and personal favorite Disney castle (Cinderella's castle) was too similar to WDW's Magic Kingdom. Also keep in mind that I am designing this park proposal from the standpoint as if were to be built somewhere in the U.S.-- this is why I tremendously de-emphasized similarities to this park to WDW and Disneyland over time as I wrote and drew each additional park draft.

Please try to let me know what I should do about this, since I have run out of ideas to solve this problem. I really could use your help here, and I look forward to hearing from you!

 

[space*mt*ranger]

I too have placed the Beauty and the Beast castle in my park(Although I call it Belle's Castle). I didnt have to run into the problems you did with the stage show simply because I didnt place it in my park.

I did think about the problem that if its the transformed castle why the beast still appears in meet and greets and infront of the castle. Well to solve my problem I decided that I would have the Beast out infront of the castle during the day and when night falls and the lights of the castle come on there would be the transformation of the Beast into the prince(Vincient?) just as the fireworks start going off and he would stay there until the park closes signing autographs.

Well anyways I dont think that would be much help to you but thats how I solved my problem.

If your not content with BaTB castle, maybe try Snow Whites :veryconfu

P.S: My message may be very confusing,afterall I just woke up :hammer: . Sorry I couldnt have been more helpfull.

 

[meeko_33785]

Just a few sugestions that you could ponder...

If you decide to use the pre-transformation castle, then using Belle and Beast in a stage show in front of the Castle. The problem with this, though, is that during the transformation, Belle was suppose to be shut off from the outside world. It would seem very strange for her to be out in front of the castle doing a show for everyone. Meet-and-greets would even be stretching it if you decide to go with the theming, but the could work if they are in the Castle Courtyard or gardens area. Also, if you choose this theme for the castle, I doubt it would be too dark or spooky. It's still a beautiful fairy-tale castle.

If you decide to do the Castle post-transformation, you can use Belle and her Prince (Vincent, Adam, or whatever you choose to call him) in a show. I don't believe the Prince is allowed to do meet-and-greets at any of the current parks, but I think that if you are clear in showing that it is past-transformation, it shouldn't be a problem. If you do decide to go this route though, you cannot use the Beast in any shows, parades or meet and greets.

I also wouldn't completly rule out the possibility of doing another Cinderella castle. Currently there are (counting HK) 3 Sleeping Beauty Castles and 2 Cinderella Castles. Another Cinderella would even things out. You could change the design a little to make it more unique. Maybe make it more stylized like they did with Sleeping Beauty Castle in Paris.

Personally, I like the post-transformation Castle idea best, so all you would have to do is not send the Beast character out for shows, parades, or meet-and-greets. Just use the Prince insteed.

 

[KentB3]

Originally posted by meeko_33785
Just a few sugestions that you could ponder...

If you decide to use the pre-transformation castle, then using Belle and Beast in a stage show in front of the Castle. The problem with this, though, is that during the transformation, Belle was suppose to be shut off from the outside world. It would seem very strange for her to be out in front of the castle doing a show for everyone. Meet-and-greets would even be stretching it if you decide to go with the theming, but the could work if they are in the Castle Courtyard or gardens area. Also, if you choose this theme for the castle, I doubt it would be too dark or spooky. It's still a beautiful fairy-tale castle.

If you decide to do the Castle post-transformation, you can use Belle and her Prince (Vincent, Adam, or whatever you choose to call him) in a show. I don't believe the Prince is allowed to do meet-and-greets at any of the current parks, but I think that if you are clear in showing that it is past-transformation, it shouldn't be a problem. If you do decide to go this route though, you cannot use the Beast in any shows, parades or meet and greets.

There in lies another problem! Only the Beast is out for meets & greets and parades, and Vincent (Belle's prince) only at the end of the Disney-MGM stage show. After all, the movie is called "Beauty and the Beast"; so I guess this is why the Beast has been out for meets & greets, parades, etc. Unless you've seen B&TB before, few would even know who Vincent (Belle's Prince) is, so therefore, the Beast has an advantage over the prince with recognizability! I was planning to use the "post-transformation" castle, which may create another inconsistancy problem. This is perhaps the reason B&TB castle has never been used in Disneyland Paris or the upcoming Hong Kong park.

I also wouldn't completly rule out the possibility of doing another Cinderella castle. Currently there are (counting HK) 3 Sleeping Beauty Castles and 2 Cinderella Castles. Another Cinderella would even things out. You could change the design a little to make it more unique. Maybe make it more stylized like they did with Sleeping Beauty Castle in Paris.

Actually, Cinderella's castle was my first choice, but many on this forum felt that it was too similar WDW's castle. Please keep in mind that I designed my park from the standpoint as if it were built in the U.S. somewhere! As for Snow White's castle, her castle (at least the castle her prince took her too after they go married) is very plain looking compared to the other Disney castles and rather odd-shaped.

If my park were built in the U.S., my first choice for the location was Hawaii, and Australia if international. In the case of Australia, Cinderella's castle would be fine; especially since it is very far from both DL and WDW and over twice the distance to Tokyo as Anaheim is to Orlando. As for Hawaii, not sure. Disneyland is the closest park to Hawaii, with Tokyo a close second. However, it could even be in the continental U.S. (although not terribly likely), which is the standpoint I took and why I de-emphasized similarities to Disneyland and WDW!

Personally, I like the post-transformation Castle idea best, so all you would have to do is not send the Beast character out for shows, parades, or meet-and-greets. Just use the Prince insteed.

If it comes down to it, I could just come up with a composite castle not exactly like either the pre-transformation or post-transformation castles. Sleeping Beauty castle in the movie is actually nothing like either castle in Anaheim or Paris. That's another thought to keep in mind!

Oh and BTW, I could use a few more suggestions about the stage show and other related entertainment. If anyone has any ideas, please reply!

 

[Wilt Dasney]

I would say to just put the show at the Studios where it makes the most sense logistically. Ariel shows up at MK and MGM, HISTK is at MGM and Epcot, and it wasn't too long ago that the Lion King was at MK and DAK. Having the same character or film featured at two parks isn't that big a deal.

 

[meeko_33785]

Originally posted by KentB3


There in lies another problem! Only the Beast is out for meets & greets and parades, and Vincent (Belle's prince) only at the end of the Disney-MGM stage show. After all, the movie is called "Beauty and the Beast"; so I guess this is why the Beast has been out for meets & greets, parades, etc. Unless you've seen B&TB before, few would even know who Vincent (Belle's Prince) is, so therefore, the Beast has an advantage over the prince with recognizability! I was planning to use the "post-transformation" castle, which may create another inconsistancy problem. This is perhaps the reason B&TB castle has never been used in Disneyland Paris or the upcoming Hong Kong park. [/B]

There's nothing saying that you have to have the Beast out insteed of the Prince in the parades. Tokyo Disneyland for one is currently using the Prince with Belle insteed of the Beast for their parade. There wouldn't be any problem in using the Prince insteed of the Beast as long as you don't use the Beast elsewhere in the park. The Beast is more recognizable, you are right about that, but when he's in the blue suit and on Belle's arm, people will realize who he is.

 

[meeko_33785]

Originally posted by KentB3
If it comes down to it, I could just come up with a composite castle not exactly like either the pre-transformation or post-transformation castles. Sleeping Beauty castle in the movie is actually nothing like either castle in Anaheim or Paris. That's another thought to keep in mind! [/B]

Whether it is a composite castle or not, you'll still have to place a time to the castle. Sleeping Beauty and Cinderella Castle are both set after the film for examlple. I would probably do the same for Beauty and the Beast Castle as well. As for entertainment, I would do a Cinderella Suprise Celebration show with Belle and the Prince insteed of the Cinderella characters. Change some of the musical numbers and give it a different theme, but you could still do it as Belle and the Prince serving as hosts of the show. I could work.

 

[KentB3]

Originally posted by meeko_33785
There's nothing saying that you have to have the Beast out insteed of the Prince in the parades. Tokyo Disneyland for one is currently using the Prince with Belle insteed of the Beast for their parade. There wouldn't be any problem in using the Prince insteed of the Beast as long as you don't use the Beast elsewhere in the park. The Beast is more recognizable, you are right about that, but when he's in the blue suit and on Belle's arm, people will realize who he is.

With that in mind, would it be a problem to have Vincent (the prince) doing meet & greets and parades in the Magic Kingdom and the Beast in the Disney Studios park (especially if I have the BT&B: Live on Stage! show here)? At least this would give guests a chance to meet both Vincent and the Beast-- at WDW, OTOH, Vincent only appears at the end of the B&TB stage show at Disney-MGM.

Last but not least, would having B&TB: LIve on Stage! at Disney Studios create too much of a B&TB overload at my proposed park. I was planning to re-instate the B&TB stage show at Disney Studios, in addition to the other reasons, to help clear the way for the Beast to make appearances at the Studios park.

In other words, guests will now have to opportunity to meet both the Beast and Vincent, depending on which park you're in!

 

[meeko_33785]

Originally posted by KentB3
With that in mind, would it be a problem to have Vincent (the prince) doing meet & greets and parades in the Magic Kingdom and the Beast in the Disney Studios park (especially if I have the BT&B: Live on Stage! show here)? At least this would give guests a chance to meet both Vincent and the Beast-- at WDW, OTOH, Vincent only appears at the end of the B&TB stage show at Disney-MGM.

Last but not least, would having B&TB: LIve on Stage! at Disney Studios create too much of a B&TB overload at my proposed park. I was planning to re-instate the B&TB stage show at Disney Studios, in addition to the other reasons, to help clear the way for the Beast to make appearances at the Studios park.

In other words, guests will now have to opportunity to meet both the Beast and Vincent, depending on which park you're in!

I don't think that would be too much of a problem. I know they do that with the Queen in Snow White. At some parks she appears as the Queen and at others she appears as the Witch.

I don't think it would be an overload, but I think that at the same time in might be fun for you to try to create your own show insteed of just reworking an old one. Maybe theme the show to one of your favorite films and make a live broadway spectacular out of it. Maybe Little Mermaid or Peter Pan.

 

[KentB3]

Originally posted by meeko_33785
I don't think that would be too much of a problem. I know they do that with the Queen in Snow White. At some parks she appears as the Queen and at others she appears as the Witch.

I don't think it would be an overload, but I think that at the same time in might be fun for you to try to create your own show insteed of just reworking an old one. Maybe theme the show to one of your favorite films and make a live broadway spectacular out of it. Maybe Little Mermaid or Peter Pan.

How about a Cinderella stage show for the Disney Studios park? My first choice all along for the castle was Cinderella's Castle, but I wound up with B&TB castle for reasons mentioned above. This would help balance things out since WDW has the B&TB stage show and Cinderella's Castle!

As for the castle stage show, it could be similar to Cinderella's Surprise Celebration, but hosted by Belle and Vincent. This show would be sort of a combination of the B&TB stage show (with musical numbers such as Be Our Guest), and Cinderella's Surprise Celebration (includes various other Disney characters to join in on the fun!). Not a bad idea; in fact, maybe even better than WDW's castle stage show!

 

[SpaceMountainUK]

YOU are the designer

Remember YOU are the designer. If you think the BB stage show should be in the MK, then why not design a theater inside the castle? Afterall there's never much inside the exisitng Disney castles except shops and a resturant.

 

[meeko_33785]

Originally posted by KentB3
How about a Cinderella stage show for the Disney Studios park? My first choice all along for the castle was Cinderella's Castle, but I wound up with B&TB castle for reasons mentioned above. This would help balance things out since WDW has the B&TB stage show and Cinderella's Castle!

As for the castle stage show, it could be similar to Cinderella's Surprise Celebration, but hosted by Belle and Vincent. This show would be sort of a combination of the B&TB stage show (with musical numbers such as Be Our Guest), and Cinderella's Surprise Celebration (includes various other Disney characters to join in on the fun!). Not a bad idea; in fact, maybe even better than WDW's castle stage show!

Cinderella would be great, but I've found it a bit hard to convert into a musical show. It's a great movie, but I have never been abele to work it into a broadway style stage show to my satisfaction. You can try though. I think it would be interesting.

Originally posted by SpaceMountainUK
Remember YOU are the designer. If you think the BB stage show should be in the MK, then why not design a theater inside the castle? Afterall there's never much inside the exisitng Disney castles except shops and a resturant.

I thought about that at one point, but I think that combined with the ride, it would just be overload since both the ride and the show eccentially tell the film's story. I would do the ride insteed of the show just because it is something different than the other parks already have and it's really a wonderful concept.

 

[KentB3]

Originally posted by meeko_33785
Cinderella would be great, but I've found it a bit hard to convert into a musical show. It's a great movie, but I have never been abele to work it into a broadway style stage show to my satisfaction. You can try though. I think it would be interesting.

I instead decided on a show similar to the one on the Disney Cruise Line for Hyperion Theater at Disney Studios. Can't remember the name of the show, but I've heard a lot of great things about it!

I thought about that at one point, but I think that combined with the ride, it would just be overload since both the ride and the show eccentially tell the film's story. I would do the ride insteed of the show just because it is something different than the other parks already have and it's really a wonderful concept.

See above. Also, for the castle stage show, I'll have something similar to Cinderella's Surprise Celebration, with a little of B&TB thrown in. Belle and Vincent (her prince) host the show, along with supporting roles by various other Disney characters (Mickey, Minnie, Donald, Goofy, Pluto, Snow White, Cinderella, Aladdin, etc.; for example). The elements from the B&TB stage show will include the Be Our Guest musical number and appearances by characters (animatronic?) such as Lumière, Mrs. Potts, etc.

Actually, even though Cinderella's castle is my favorite of all the Disney castles and Cindy is tied with Pinocchio as my favorite fairy-tale type Disney cartoon, I think that this would turn out to be a better castle stage show than Cinderella's Surprise Celebration. The Be Our Guest musical number would really help set the stage for the arrival of the non-B&TB Disney characters onstage!

Any thoughts so far?

 

[DisneyPan]

OK, adding to what Meeko said about the Wicked Witch from Snow White- Ariel is seen both in her mermaid form and human form in MK. Human in day parade and mermaid in her grotto. You can tell guests that Tinkerbell helped THe Beast change to Prince Vincent so he wouldn't scare the kids, or something like that.

I really love the castle from DLP. The colors are so beautiful and the architecture is very french. I know it's the Sleeping Beauty castle, but you can change the name of it.

A B&B stage show should be at the Studios, but have a show with the B&B characters host it. THe opening song could be BE Our Guest and then stray from the movie songs and be creative.

This is only the first and most recent post that I've read of yours, so I'm off to read some more!

 

[KentB3]

Originally posted by DisneyPan
OK, adding to what Meeko said about the Wicked Witch from Snow White- Ariel is seen both in her mermaid form and human form in MK. Human in day parade and mermaid in her grotto. You can tell guests that Tinker Bell helped The Beast change to Prince Vincent so he wouldn't scare the kids, or something like that.

That's a cute story! BTW, doesn't Tinker Bell change Pinocchio from a puppet into a real boy in the Share a Dream Come True parade at WDW? It seems like I heard/read this somewhere.

I really love the castle from DLP. The colors are so beautiful and the architecture is very french. I know it's the Sleeping Beauty castle, but you can change the name of it.

Sounds like a great idea! That was so of what I was planning for the castle-- while incorporating some important features of B&TB castle, such as the domed ballroom on the left side of the castle; a very important feature of Belle's castle.

As for myself, Cinderella's Castle is my personal favorite, with DLP's Sleeping Beauty Castle ranking a very close second!

A B&B stage show should be at the Studios, but have a show with the B&B characters host it. THe opening song could be BE Our Guest and then stray from the movie songs and be creative.

Actually, since B&TB have the castle, I planned on having this show on the castle stage similar to Cinderella's Royal Celebration with features of the B&TB stage show such as the Be Our Guest musical number; which would be great for the non B&TB characters (ie: Mickey, Donald, Goofy, Pluto, Snow White, Cinderella, Aladdin, Peter Pan, etc.) making their arrival onstage. Also from B&TB will be appearances from Lumière, Mrs. Potts, etc. (not sure if these are actual characters or animatronics).

For Disney Studios, at least upon its opening, I was leaning towards a show similar to the show on the Disney Cruise Line (not exactly but very similar). I have in fact heard a lot of good things about that show!

This is only the first and most recent post that I've read of yours, so I'm off to read some more!

Well, welcome aboard to Imagineers, DisneyPan! Hope you enjoy reading many more!

 

[stitchcastle]

What I did with my proposed park way back when it was originally designed to be solely a Beauty And The Beast Castle before I decided to mix all the castles was to have the domed ballroom be indoor theater for the show and people would go through a long queue from the side of the castle where when they would look at the castle the treatment of the paint at that side would be gloomy compared to the over-all grandeur of the castle as a whole think about it, the turrets and the outer wall of the castle is grey while the towers are white. The Grey walls offers a facade with a forced perspective cursed castle for the main entrance of the theater.

 

[KentB3]

What I did with my proposed park way back when it was originally designed to be solely a Beauty And The Beast Castle before I decided to mix all the castles was to have the domed ballroom be indoor theater for the show and people would go through a long queue from the side of the castle where when they would look at the castle the treatment of the paint at that side would be gloomy compared to the over-all grandeur of the castle as a whole think about it, the turrets and the outer wall of the castle is grey while the towers are white. The Grey walls offers a facade with a forced perspective cursed castle for the main entrance of the theater.

I'm quite surprised that my nearly year-old thread has been brought out of retirement, but you do have some great ideas, as usual! As for mine, I modeled the castle largely after the Disneyland Paris castle, along with features of the (post-transformation) castle from the movie Beauty and the Beast (1991); as well as a number of features from Mad Ludwig's Castle in Neuschwanstein, Germany, such as the top window pane on the front. Sleeping Beauty Castle at Disneyland was almost directly modeled after Mad Ludwig's Castle, and many of this castle's features were incorporated into Cinderella Castle at WDW and Tokyo Disneyland!

A drawing of my Beauty and the Beast Castle can be found at the following URL: http://photoalbums.wdwmagic.com/showphoto.php?photo=10260

Just thought you'd like to know! :animwink:

 

[stitchcastle]

Oh my gosh! I know that castle! You're a member of TalkDisney as well aren't you? That is an AMAZING castle you created and i love how you took elements from the best castles out there including the B&tB dome. What's the color scheme of the castle?

you are awesome

 

[KentB3]

Oh my gosh! I know that castle! You're a member of TalkDisney as well aren't you? That is an AMAZING castle you created and i love how you took elements from the best castles out there including the B&tB dome. What's the color scheme of the castle?

you are awesome

The color scheme is basically the same as the Disneyland Paris castle. Here is a link to a photo:
http://photoalbums.wdwmagic.com/showphoto.php?photo=168


BTW, I'm glad you liked my castle drawing! :sohappy:

 

[stitchcastle]

I just checked out your original thread with the original unveiling of the castle, And i agree that the rectangular windowpane you said you were planning would make it a lot more distinguishable from the Chateu De la Belle Au bois Dormant in Paris (I just loooove typing/saying that, sounds so darn classy) Have ever thought of creating the backside of the castle?