Prince Charming Carousel Lawsuit

[UNCLEROY]

SOME PEOPLE SHOULD JUST NOT LEAVE THE GROUND.

 

[Goofyernmost]

so you are discussing a real stirrup for a real horse vs topic of a pretend stirrup that isn't even shaped anywhere near what you are posting. The carousel stirrup does not enclose one foot and the horse does not leave the deck like it does in Mary Poppins.

I spoke to the material inside my horses stirrups being similar to the original Cinderella faux stirrups. The notion that a flat step on with a non slip surface on a carousel would cause a guest to be dragged by a faux horse is commical. It is the Prince Charming carousel not Mary Poppins nor is the topic real stirrups for live horses though in my 40 years of riding your scenero is far fetched also.

Back to topic at hand.

I don't think it was about being dragged, it was about getting a foot caught and falling backward, sort of upside down while the foot stayed in the stirrups. But, I don't guess they have had that kind of stirrup on carousels since I was a kid, so it isn't really relevant to this story. It is amazing that I am still alive. All those deadly things that I was exposed to should have done me in.

 

[flynnibus]

It's easy -

Sole Of shoe at angle upper catches on top of stirrup, Sole is held in by friction material bingo foot locked in and you can't break it free without outside assistance and if ride starts you WILL be dragged.

It's WHY stirrups on real saddles are smooth so the riders boot can slip out if rider falls, English tack frequently has a embossed smooth diamond shape to shed mud but the points of the diamond are rounded so the boot does not catch on stirrup.

Dragged where? The horse and ground move together... the horse only moves up and down.

Some stirrups DO have friction materials but these are generally intended for barrel racing and roping where there is assistance immediately available and holding the rider's position outweighs the risk of a fall and drag event.

On the side view you can see the diamonds used for removing mud from boots

That photo is just of the iron - and is missing the stirrup pad... which is where the grip material is. They are all gripped with bars or patterns. You avoid the drag situation not by removing the grip, but they make breakaways so your foot comes out of the stirrup.

They also have designs intended for your foot to slip out by shaping the outside edge of the iron differently. All english tack I've ever seen have grip/tread.

 

[flynnibus]

so you are discussing a real stirrup for a real horse vs topic of a pretend stirrup that isn't even shaped anywhere near what you are posting. The carousel stirrup does not enclose one foot and the horse does not leave the deck like it does in Mary Poppins.

Exactly - they are pedestals.. and frankly I'm suprised by them. I never ride the Disney carousals and had not noticed that before this thread. I'm sure they hold up better over time, but what a disappointing facsimile of riding a horse and other classic carousals.

 

[note2001]

Dragged where? The horse and ground move together... the horse only moves up and down.

Am I a bad person to imagine a woman with her foot caught in a traditional stirrup being smacked against the ground by a carousel horse with an evil grin on its face?

SOME PEOPLE SHOULD JUST NOT LEAVE THE GROUND.

I believe it was the ground (meaning platform in this case) that was the problem. Had it not been there, she would not have hit anything.

 

[ford91exploder]

Dragged where? The horse and ground move together... the horse only moves up and down.



That photo is just of the iron - and is missing the stirrup pad... which is where the grip material is. They are all gripped with bars or patterns. You avoid the drag situation not by removing the grip, but they make breakaways so your foot comes out of the stirrup.

View attachment 76203

They also have designs intended for your foot to slip out by shaping the outside edge of the iron differently. All english tack I've ever seen have grip/tread.

I ride both english and western tack - The people I ride with just use the iron itself the pad not so useful it ices up in winter and is typically seen in use by novices who think it makes them more secure, And no one I know uses the breakaway systems except for carnival pony rides as you really don't want your foot coming adrift when executing a jump.

 

[ford91exploder]

Am I a bad person to imagine a woman with her foot caught in a traditional stirrup being smacked against the ground by a carousel horse with an evil grin on it's face?



I believe it was the ground (meaning platform in this case) that was the problem. Had it not been there, she would not have hit anything.

Interesting perhaps a Carosel supported by the legendary Skyhook - no ground to hit head on...

 

[flynnibus]

I ride both english and western tack - The people I ride with just use the iron itself the pad not so useful it ices up in winter and is typically seen in use by novices who think it makes them more secure, And no one I know uses the breakaway systems except for carnival pony rides as you really don't want your foot coming adrift when executing a jump.

well we don't ride in snow and ice in the ring.. that's why we have indoor rings

Everyone uses the safety irons around here... and I'm in freakin Horse Country Virginia People lose their stirups all the time and has nothing to do with the breakaways... thats why they all train to jump without irons too

Speaking of which.. in 5mins I'm heading to the barn so talk amoungst yourselves .. heheh

Life is more fun with pictures...

 

[MinnieWaffles]

For goodness sake.

I once accidentally slipped when getting off a carousel as a child. But it was a ACCIDENT and no way would my parents dream of suing the ride operator for something that was my fault.

People need to gain more personal responsibility. And some common sense wouldn't go amiss either.

 

[Gabe1]

I don't think it was about being dragged, it was about getting a foot caught and falling backward, sort of upside down while the foot stayed in the stirrups. But, I don't guess they have had that kind of stirrup on carousels since I was a kid, so it isn't really relevant to this story. It is amazing that I am still alive. All those deadly things that I was exposed to should have done me in.

Thank you, my previous point times many, I didn't like the drag element either, this is a carousel not the horses at Ft Wilderness. If you look at the Cinderella Pedestal and the Prince Charming photo I posted getting your foot caught in it is not physically possible, my point. Real horses and and real stirrups have nothing to do with these faux carousel horses anymore than implying an insurance underwriter would want the Disney to make the pedestals slippery. Absurd.

The issue in the lawsuit is the old pedestal faux stirrup on the Cinderella Carousel had a slip resistant surface. Upon a refurbishment a new pedestal faux stirrup with smaller square inch for foot didn't have a non slip surface to place the foot on while balancing on one foot mounting and dismounting. What none of us know at this time is how a judge or jury will view the removal of slip resistant pad and if that action could reasonably contributed to the fall caused by slipping. Same with the adult woman that apparently broke her hip after the refurbishment.

Dragged where? The horse and ground move together... the horse only moves up and down..

Amen, someone else that gets it!!!

Exactly - they are pedestals.. and frankly I'm suprised by them. I never ride the Disney carousals and had not noticed that before this thread. I'm sure they hold up better over time, but what a disappointing facsimile of riding a horse and other classic carousals.

You have your thinking cap on! Thank you. I posted pictures of the before and after pedestal faux stirrups that don't even really look like a stirrup, I thought that would have put that getting your foot caught or being dragged to bed, no such luck.

If you want to see a better facsimile you have to visit the carousel at Disneyland. Last time I was there anyhow.

 

[Gabe1]

I haven't ridden in a couple of years, but weren't there seat belts? If so, how could a properly belted rider fall off....

I went back and looked at photos when my kids were small and they are in their 20's now. They were there, been replaced but almost identical. They are the same type as a carnival ride and really not noticeable if not in use. They kinda go around the neck and fall down by the horses chest and they are not required to be used or not at least earlier this year on my trip. I reposted some of Jack Spences photo's/all ears.

credit jack spence

I used them for my kids because the saddle area is adult sized so when a little one sits on it their little legs don't drop to the side of the horse for balance and they tend to slide. The belt goes around the little child mid chest so they don't slide to either side. Me, I used the belt and stood next to my kid.

Yes, I know... still think it is a little bit of overkill for a carousel. But, I guess I shouldn't expect that parents would take care of their children to make sure that no harm comes to them. Old time thinking, I guess.

Funny, that's what I thought parents were for. Silly me.

Sometimes I think parents get a bad rap, now they are blasted for using a seat belt Disney supplies? Yet if they didn't and the kid fell they would be chastised for not using the seatbelt.

This picture I posted the Mom is there and the kid has a seatbelt on. But sometimes a family doesn't have a parent for each kid to stand that close to both or all as some families have twins,triplets etc., so I see no harm in Disney offering a seatbelt to keep children safe, that is a far fall for a toddler to a hard surface. To me using the seatbelt with small kids is good parenting not bad.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I went back and looked at photos when my kids were small and they are in their 20's now. They were there, been replaced but almost identical. They are the same type as a carnival ride and really not noticeable if not in use. They kinda go around the neck and fall down by the horses chest and they are not required to be used or not at least earlier this year on my trip. I reposted some of Jack Spences photo's/all ears.

credit jack spence

I used them for my kids because the saddle area is adult sized so when a little one sits on it their little legs don't drop to the side of the horse for balance and they tend to slide. The belt goes around the little child mid chest so they don't slide to either side. Me, I used the belt and stood next to my kid.

Sometimes I think parents get a bad rap, now they are blasted for using a seat belt Disney supplies? Yet if they didn't and the kid fell they would be chastised for not using the seatbelt.

This picture I posted the Mom is there and the kid has a seatbelt on. But sometimes a family doesn't have a parent for each kid to stand that close to both or all as some families have twins,triplets etc., so I see no harm in Disney offering a seatbelt to keep children safe, that is a far fall for a toddler to a hard surface. To me using the seatbelt with small kids is good parenting not bad.

First off, I don't think it is wrong for anyone to use the belts. They are there, they should use them. I just think that a lot of that carp is completely unnecessary if a parent is there and doing what they should be doing, taking care of their child and not relying on others to solve all their problems.

My kids rode carousels many, many times. Either my wife or myself rode with them when they were too little to hang on properly and held them in place. It was fun because it gave us the ability to ride on the carousel without looking like dorks. They never fell or had a problem because we took care of them. I see the picture with the little girl and the belt. What is that belt doing that the mother couldn't be doing. It's just yet another unnecessary complication because parents don't want to take responsibility for the safety and enjoyment of their children. However, that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be using them as long as they are there, but, I still feel that they shouldn't be necessary. But that is the world we presently live in. Never anyplace in my statement did I say that someone was a bad parent for using the belts. I merely stated that I didn't think it should be necessary and that the belts are doing the job that we used to automatically do without them.

 

[JoeCamel]

Velcro pants coming to a carousel in your future.. I am sorry that someone was hurt but please don't blame the operator of the device just admit you slipped take it as a lesson and move on.

 

[Gabe1]

First off, I don't think it is wrong for anyone to use the belts. They are there, they should use them. I just think that a lot of that carp is completely unnecessary if a parent is there and doing what they should be doing, taking care of their child and not relying on others to solve all their problems.

My kids rode carousels many, many times. Either my wife or myself rode with them when they were too little to hang on properly and held them in place. It was fun because it gave us the ability to ride on the carousel without looking like dorks. They never fell or had a problem because we took care of them. I see the picture with the little girl and the belt. What is that belt doing that the mother couldn't be doing. It's just yet another unnecessary complication because parents don't want to take responsibility for the safety and enjoyment of their children. However, that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be using them as long as they are there, but, I still feel that they shouldn't be necessary. But that is the world we presently live in. Never anyplace in my statement did I say that someone was a bad parent for using the belts. I merely stated that I didn't think it should be necessary and that the belts are doing the job that we used to automatically do without them.

So the Mom is wrong no matter what. Now that little girl is labeled by you as a dork because she has a safety belt on. I fail to see what the rag is on parents, the seatbelt is there, they use it. Mom is there doing what a good Mom does and still open season on Moms. She doesn't seem to be asking the World to Solve her problems.

How about good for Disney for going above and beyond on making safety belts available. How about a good for a responsible Mom for caring about her DD enough to buckle-up. How about a kudos to the Mom for standing next to her young child just in case.

Moms and parents are sure are getting beaten up a lot in your posts today for being responsible.

 

[Goofyernmost]

So the Mom is wrong no matter what. Now that little is labeled by you as a dork because she has a safety belt on. I fail to see what the rag is on parents, the seatbelt is there, they use it. Mom is there doing what a good Mom does and still open season on Moms. She doesn't seem to be asking the World to Solve her problems.

How about good for Disney for going above and beyond on making safety belts available. How about a good for a responsible Mom for caring about her DD enough to buckle-up. How about a kudos to the Mom for standing next to her young child just in case.

Moms and parents are sure are getting beaten up a lot in your posts today for being responsible.

Really, are you reading what is being written or just one word at a time. Seriously, I never said that at all. We liked to ride with the kids because back then an adult riding on a carousel was considered a dork. I'm not going to explain it any further, you obviously have not read the whole thing because you would have known what I was talking about. I repeated at least 3 times that they are there and they should be used. You have decided to run in a completely different direction then the intent of my post. So please do whatever you can to make it sound like I hate mothers and parents and take everything out of context. Have the last word, as I am not going to respond to this topic any further. I am pretty certain that at this point there is nothing I can say that will put this back on track.

 

[Gabe1]

Really, are you reading what is being written or just one word at a time. Seriously, I never said that at all. We liked to ride with the kids because back then an adult riding on a carousel was considered a dork. I'm not going to explain it any further, you obviously have not read the whole thing because you would have known what I was talking about. I repeated at least 3 times that they are there and they should be used. You have decided to run in a completely different direction then the intent of my post. So please do whatever you can to make it sound like I hate mothers and parents and take everything out of context. Have the last word, as I am not going to respond to this topic any further. I am pretty certain that at this point there is nothing I can say that will put this back on track.

"I just think that a lot of that carp is completely unnecessary if a parent is there and doing what they should be doing, taking care of their child and not relying on others to solve all their problems."

"Funny, that's what I thought parents were for. Silly me."


That right there! ^

As a parent I sat next to my kid in a high chair in WDW too and I still buckled the belt in the high chair and in the stroller too. I wasn't asking the World to Solve all of my problems I just had the brains to utilize safety measures.

 

[RAXIP]

Old, similar to diving board and water slide step grip material.

Credit Disney Ways

Here you can see the new stirrups have 2 different versions of step, one with a pad and one with a shiny flat surface.

credit mark warber

credit j spence

There were two versions of the tri-step stirrup?

I remember when they changed them (in late 2009, I think) from the old, classic stirrup design to the new tri-step ones, but I don't see any modifications beyond that.

Old on the left. New on the right.

via parkeology

 

[Gabe1]

There were two versions of the tri-step stirrup?

I remember when they changed them (in late 2009, I think) from the old, classic stirrup design to the new tri-step ones, but I don't see any modifications beyond that.

Old on the left. New on the right.

via parkeology

I'd have to go back and look at the photos when I was a kid and see if my Dad caught any of it on film. I know one of the pictures I looked at for seat belts was Disneylands photo. I could tell by the triple stirrups. To my eye, the Prince rehab does appear to already have had 2 different variations. I've looked at more carousel pictures today than I have in many decades and I've ridden these horses since the park opening and Disneyland before that. I noted that some of the just for fun bloggers are pulling stock photos while writing about the carousel and are unintentionally interchanging both WDW and DL photos, it is easy to do and until this lawsuit surfaced nobody really went looking. Now trying to piece together what happened it is getting more confusing.

Disneyland

 

[Siren]

No I saw this case when it was filed with the orange county courts… it's a four-page complaint. (I have a hard copy in my hands right now)


Nowhere does it say a severe head injury. The only times any injuries are referenced our paragraph 8 that simply says she was injured when she slipped and fell… And paragraph 10 that reiterates that. There's nothing here that specifies anything about her injuries, their extent or anything like that.

Paragraph 12 says the exact same thing that all slip and fall lawsuits do… And also mentions "and aggravation of a previously existing condition"

All of the language is identical to most every other slip and fall lawsuit that you see filed.

But for those playing the home game… The part where it says aggravating a previous existing condition is paragraph 12 on page 3 of the complaint.

People file slip and fall lawsuits in orange county every day. This is no different.

Wow!!! Thanks so much sharing this. I love how the article fails to mention that the brain injury was pre-existing. The only reason the story made a headline is because of that glaring omission. Ugh....

You can't… This is a shakedown for money. There is nothing that Disney needs to do to fix the ride. There's nothing wrong with the ride. There's nothing that needs to be done.

I tend to agree and that's exactly what it sounds like. Video cameras are so cheap these days, Disney should just install video camera's over every single horse and really every single ride.

In this particular case the plaintiff mentioned a new stirrup that was slippery and that was the cause of the accident. If that is found to be the case, they will simply have to fix this issue.

There are thousands of carousels that have been running in the US everyday for more than a century. The idea that they are somehow all death traps and Disney will have to shut this attraction down just does not hold water.

That's very true and I agree. Carousels are everywhere and I'm sure people fall from time to time, but this is the first I've heard of a lawsuit about it. Then again, Disney is held to a much higher standard and level of accountability than every other establishment, it seems.

There were two versions of the tri-step stirrup?

I remember when they changed them (in late 2009, I think) from the old, classic stirrup design to the new tri-step ones, but I don't see any modifications beyond that.

Old on the left. New on the right.

via parkeology

Great picture! There is nothing wrong with the old ones. But, I like the new stirrups, too.

 

[rsoxguy]

SOME PEOPLE SHOULD JUST NOT LEAVE THE GROUND.

Actually, some people should just not leave the womb. Lawsuit hungry vermin infest our society and should be forced to work for their money.