News Passholder Benefits Shifting

[spock8113]

As a customer that has been to every park for years (3872 visits since opening of DW) the decline of new attractions, the dirty trashy conditions of all the parks except for Epocot, and the unbelievably long lines for the experiences you do have that are worthy, made me decide on my recent visit to never return. I was there and stayed on property also ran down as well. The avatar ride a 4 hour wait was old technology used from Disney Quest and Soar not much that makes Disney stand out with exception of a family tradition. Some one needs to think about this. It isn’t about magnets. So sad Disney has lost it’s thinkers and technology people.

So sad Disney has lost it’s thinkers and technology people. This is all their problems in a nutshell!
There is some management illusion that just because you can own a theme park doesn't mean you can operate a theme park.
Clearly they've bitten off much more than they can chew so they rely on the old technology and the recently purchased franchises to briefly appeal to the masses. Raising prices on everything makes more profit giving the illusion of success. This formula is everywhere in the business world and permeates the political scene. How it looks, not how it really is.
And I do agree that there is time-manipulation going on with lines for crowd control and the appearance of extreme busy-ness.
I think, though, that all this will be short lived, relatively speaking.

And remember, these are attendance "Projections", a made up hypothetical attendance count from crystal ball executives.
Please, no mission statements!

I think the cable-car "Skyway" while retro, is one of the best things so far.
While Disney did promote his movies, he also promoted innovation outside his realm.
Rides that teach or rides having subject matter having nothing to do with superpowers.

A theme park for everyone is slowly disappearing in subject matter and price.
SAD...dot,dot,dot.

 

[Brad Bishop]

30 years ago, it would be UNHEARD OF to have any negative comments about ANYTHING Disney...

That's not quite true. The only negative thing I ever heard people say 30 years back was, "It's too expensive! They charge you $2 for a Coke!" Outside of the expense you never heard anyone talk about how crappy/run down parts of it were. Even the folks who complained about the price knew is was pretty nice.

 

[tagguy]

Any thoughts to why attendance isn't up to projections? Is this Epcot specific or resort wide?

Could it be price increases/parking charges/etc finally having some impact?

Any thoughts to why attendance isn't up to projections? Is this Epcot specific or resort wide?

Could it be price increases/parking charges/etc finally having some impact?

My extended family (11 adults & kids,4 rooms) were lucky enough to vacation at Disney for the last five years. This year we won't be there, because of the continued price increases and now paying for parking at resorts. I know the parking charge is small compared to the total cost of a Disney stay, but charging for parking when you're paying almost $300 per night for a room is insulting.

 

[GlassHalfFull]

I know of 3 different families who moved their vacations from may/june until August/September because of the announced Toy Story Land dates.. so I think part of the issue is people who aren't DVC or regular visitors want to wait until TSL is opened.. there is a reason these dates magically end when the TSL opening is. I am just hoping the same happens with SWL and they actually do AP previews during that down time.. my kind of WDW visit..

 

[geekza]

I think what we're seeing is reminiscent of the 90's, when building exploded throughout the property in anticipation of huge crowds and then the bottom fell out after 9/11 and the recession.

People will pay for an experience, but with a vacation at Disney having become a major investment in the past decade, those who are able to continue to pay top dollar expect a level of engagement and service that matches their monetary outlay. That isn't happening right now. There is a tipping point beyond which a large group of people can either no longer afford to go to WDW or don't feel that they're seeing a return on their investment and will vacation elsewhere.

Also, WDW is currently in flux, with so much of DHS under construction and an already-ailing Epcot just starting its big building push. I'm sure some people are holding off going right now in anticipation of going after SW:GE opens and also the 50th celebration.

 

[Cado603]

That's not quite true. The only negative thing I ever heard people say 30 years back was, "It's too expensive! They charge you $2 for a Coke!" Outside of the expense you never heard anyone talk about how crappy/run down parts of it were. Even the folks who complained about the price knew is was pretty nice.

Oo

I know of 3 different families who moved their vacations from may/june until August/September because of the announced Toy Story Land dates.. so I think part of the issue is people who aren't DVC or regular visitors want to wait until TSL is opened.. there is a reason these dates magically end when the TSL opening is. I am just hoping the same happens with SWL and they actually do AP previews during that down time.. my kind of WDW visit..

Ok so I first went 30 yrs ago and then didn't go much until 2000 bought DVC and have been back multiple times a year since then. I never heard the expensive thing especially on forums (as a matter of fact until the meal plans started) I thought food and drink reasonable? for Disney but then Iger took over and everything changed. I remember the first shock for me was when he jacked up the price of a stroller to $17 a day( I didn't need it and when we had grandkids we brought strollers) but that annoyed me that they would charge families that outrageous price and then the yearly some times 2X a year ticket price increase and then on and on and this last $20 a day parking fee at resorts(again doesn't effect me) but I feel bad for others and am getting a bitter taste for Disney period. Iger has slowly ruined all of Disney for me , something I never ever would have thought I would say.

 

[MattM]

So you have a lot of great info. Any idea why if stays are not down, why the parks are noticeably less crowded?

Im not denying that parks are less crowded. I am denying that you can make long term predictions on a "trend" that is a couple of weeks old at most, and all indicators point to a very busy summer in Orlando.

 

[MattM]

Apparently that’s an illusion according to our friend...

If thats what you gathered from our conversation, then I apologize for talking over you. Thought I was keeping it fairly simple. Please accept my apologies.

 

[Brad Bishop]

How could attendance be down when two new fair rides are about to open?!!
Aren't people excited to wait 100 minutes to ride Alien Teacups?!?!?!?

It won't be quite as bad as Dinoland. Still, while I know you were trying to be sarcastic, it could be said that the crowds are down for a few, rather obvious reasons, which actually include the alien teacups:
- DHS is a mess.
- DHS is getting new things
- Epcot is getting new things
- 50th Anniversary

It could be that people are simply holding back because of each of these and WDW will see a huge glut in a few years as each of these comes to pass.

 

[larryz]

(3872 visits since opening of DW)

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

If thats what you gathered from our conversation, then I apologize for talking over you. Thought I was keeping it fairly simple. Please accept my apologies.

I don’t think that at all...

I think that due to experience, you might just be equating too much of a direct correlation of the overall Orlando market - which is very good...to the situation in disneydom.

Granted they are cousins...they’re just not decessarily always brother and sister

 

[MattM]

I don’t think that at all...

I think that due to experience, you might just be equating too much of a direct correlation of the overall Orlando market - which is very good...to the situation in disneydom.

Granted they are cousins...they’re just not decessarily always brother and sister

We are in a time where facts, data, etc don't mean anything, so....ok.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

We are in a time where facts, data, etc don't mean anything, so....ok.

It’s really not a facts/data/etc argument (though i’m on that team)...it’s reports indicating the attendance is lighter than normal - the exact reason tbd - and sure enough: Disney is doing promotions during their blackout periods. Blackout periods are 100% about crowd control...so there ain’t much of a crowd to control.

And Disney isn’t real “Team Orlando”...they aren’t exactly gonna give any hint of issue to the tourism board.

I can’t figure out why that is...I’m sure it’s NOT because they’re juggernaut competitor is much more tied in these days...the one that appears to have snaked them on iger’s biggest career deal?

Again...I’m not there....at least right now. But I know how the rat thinks (I was one) and they don’t do unneeded discounts or hooks. They sure as hell don’t under iger. Something unusual is up for June. Many valid Takes have been presented here. It may pass. But you do seem to reject it based on your 9 to 5.

Do you think this is standard operating procedure?

 

[floridagirl57]

I see they are offering half off single day tickets if you are brought by annual pass holders with gold level or higher. They even included park hopping on the 1 day ticket. Deal ends the 29th of June. Must really be hurting to start cutting deals on 1 day tickets.

The same deal was offered last year for passholders family and friends but it was in August (when the blackout dates were also lifted). This year its restricted to passholders above Gold, which was really disappointing.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The same deal was offered last year for passholders family and friends but it was in August (when the blackout dates were also lifted). This year its restricted to passholders above Gold, which was really disappointing.

August has been slow for years now...June shouldn’t be.

Soft at 32830 this year...a couple of weeks of toy story bump In July and pretty light otherwise

 

[LSLS]

Im not denying that parks are less crowded. I am denying that you can make long term predictions on a "trend" that is a couple of weeks old at most, and all indicators point to a very busy summer in Orlando.

Ah ok. So the Orlando data suggests it is a slow time right now then?

 

[MattM]

It’s really not a facts/data/etc argument (though i’m on that team)...it’s reports indicating the attendance is lighter than normal - the exact reason tbd - and sure enough: Disney is doing promotions during their blackout periods. Blackout periods are 100% about crowd control...so there ain’t much of a crowd to control.

And Disney isn’t real “Team Orlando”...they aren’t exactly gonna give any hint of issue to the tourism board.

I can’t figure out why that is...I’m sure it’s NOT because they’re juggernaut competitor is much more tied in these days...the one that appears to have snaked them on iger’s biggest career deal?

Again...I’m not there....at least right now. But I know how the rat thinks (I was one) and they don’t do unneeded discounts or hooks. They sure as hell don’t under iger. Something unusual is up for June. Many valid Takes have been presented here. It may pass. But you do seem to reject it based on your 9 to 5.

Do you think this is standard operating procedure?

I don't reject it. Something could be happening. I can't make a long term projection on a short term trend. Nothing good comes from that. If the facts (data) change, I'll change my mind. Simple as that.

Don't I wish it was just a 9-5....

 

[MattM]

Ah ok. So the Orlando data suggests it is a slow time right now then?

The numbers lag by about 14-21 days (meaning we should get May numbers any day now). We don't get real-time numbers.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't reject it. Something could be happening. I can't make a long term projection on a short term trend. Nothing good comes from that. If the facts (data) change, I'll change my mind. Simple as that.

Don't I wish it was just a 9-5....

Fair enough

 

[zengoth]

The benefits of being a passholder seem to be fluctuating. Crowds out of control tend to make us “shoppers/eaters/attractions every now and again” so disney is still getting $$ from us. But the company will always cater to those staying on property who get the best fast passes as well as early entry.. we were at ropedrop at AK today hoping to get on FoP. It was already a 2 hour wait at 9 in the morning. Figure we will never get to ride it unless we commit to hotel reservations first.