News New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

DoubleSwitchback

Well-Known Member
If the argument is that it's always up to an individual to decide what an appropriate accommodation is, then it shouldn't matter, right? Someone with a physical disability should have the same right to say that a wheelchair isn't appropriate for them as someone with anxiety has to say that return to queue isn't appropriate.
 

jennab55

Well-Known Member
If the argument is that it's always up to an individual to decide what an appropriate accommodation is, then it shouldn't matter, right? Someone with a physical disability should have the same right to say that a wheelchair isn't appropriate for them as someone with anxiety has to say that return to queue isn't appropriate.
Is that the argument? Is it really fully up to the individual? I doubt it. I’m not going to be able to buy concert tickets in the back row, then say due to my disability I must sit in the very front row and I won’t accept anything else. My guess is they would offer me an accommodation, but not the one I’m requesting in this case.
 

Chi84

Premium Member
It'll be interesting to see how the arbitration bit plays out.

But I fully expect they'll be required to sever the parties from the class action. Actually I'm not sure if that means drop the class action suit and refile as individual suits. Yes it's costly to the individuals but the previous DAS/GAC case was required to sever. Individual accommodations are individual. Disney is likely very solid on this stance.
They haven’t been certified as a class action yet. I expect Disney will raise the waiver issue in response but who knows.
 

Purduevian

Well-Known Member
The Irony of this suit focusing on Physical disabilities today, when Disney more or less pushed them aside when switching to DAS is not lost on me. Where was this firm since 2013 and why didn't they have issues with the DAS system originally from GAC and how it's been handling physical disabilities all along?
Disney mostly eliminated MOBILITY DAS accommodations with the switch to DAS by making all the lines wheelchair/ECV accessible.

However, many physical disabilities were recently covered by DAS until the change such as the Tik-tok woman with the daylight sensitivity, or IBS.
 
Disney mostly eliminated MOBILITY DAS accommodations with the switch to DAS by making all the lines wheelchair/ECV accessible.

However, many physical disabilities were recently covered by DAS until the change such as the Tik-tok woman with the daylight sensitivity, or IBS.
I guess my question is, why limit it to physical disabilities, when it seems anxiety, PTSD and other non physical disabilities are also not gaining access consistently? I know you can't answer that as you aren't the firm who moved this forward, but it's just something I've been questioning. I guess narrowing it to one subset, makes it easier to try and gain traction on the class action side of things, as that will be the first hurdle they have to clear. Just seems like in a suit where the primary argument is this subset is being discriminated against and violating unruh laws, that they are themselves discriminating against other subsets that also are not being given access.
 

Purduevian

Well-Known Member
I guess my question is, why limit it to physical disabilities, when it seems anxiety, PTSD and other non physical disabilities are also not gaining access consistently? I know you can't answer that as you aren't the firm who moved this forward, but it's just something I've been questioning. I guess narrowing it to one subset, makes it easier to try and gain traction on the class action side of things, as that will be the first hurdle they have to clear. Just seems like in a suit where the primary argument is this subset is being discriminated against and violating unruh laws, that they are themselves discriminating against other subsets that also are not being given access.
My guess, agree with it or not, physical disabilities are treated as more "real" than mental disabilities for some people.

Most people understand someone has physical pain if outside in the sun too long or someone having the uncontrollable need to use the restroom in the next 2 mins.

Unfortunately, many people think of Anxiety or PTSD as something someone can just tough out, suck it up, or calm down.

FYI this is not my viewpoint. Anxiety, PTSD, ect can be just as debilitation as most physical disabilities, I'm just saying not everyone thinks that way.
 

Splash4eva

Well-Known Member
The biggest issue imo is Disney has not truly conveyed how the system works for single or adults with minors regarding the rtq… allowing people who were denied das access to meet up with your party at any point or walk to front from what was explained to me seems to be more than fair. Not ideal but again provides an alternative method for the person in need. And i know legally they cant say it and i know someone should not be forced to but if its that much of an issue again not ideal just purchase genie and use that as well. Yes i know it cost money but if you are denied das and offered an alternative method and you still dont like it its your next best option and should help ease some pain while on vacation.
 

Tigger&Pooh

Active Member
The biggest issue imo is Disney has not truly conveyed how the system works for single or adults with minors regarding the rtq
Disney has not actually given specific instructions about how the alternative accommodations work for anyone. That's because it varies by attraction, time of day, crowds/queue length, party-size, make-up of party, etc.
 

jennab55

Well-Known Member
Disney has not actually given specific instructions about how the alternative accommodations work for anyone. That's because it varies by attraction, time of day, crowds/queue length, party-size, make-up of party, etc.
And if they did, then some people would use that to get what they want. A party of 4 who couldn’t get DAS May show up as party of 2 (adult and minor) to get a return time. Sadly if the details were posted people would find a way to work it to their advantage.
 

Splash4eva

Well-Known Member
Disney has not actually given specific instructions about how the alternative accommodations work for anyone. That's because it varies by attraction, time of day, crowds/queue length, party-size, make-up of party, etc.
Yes im fully aware and there was a reason for that specifically for solo/single parents but if you are denied access for DAS during a call you can get some clarification or sending an email and get some type of idea on how it will be handled if you not act like a child and throw a tantrum…
 

jaklgreen

Well-Known Member
Outside of Disney not being force to provide GAC, I don't think the courts have decided what a "reasonable accommodation" is for a theme park attraction/line.

It's entirely possible that other than making the line wheelchair accessible, there is nothing else required by law.
I think that if anything, maybe this will force the ADA to come up a more comprehensive guideline for what businesses are required to offer. Nothing of significance has really changed with the ADA for a very long time. I think that it is past time for them to have a better outline of what is and is not required, like many other Countries do.
They also need to give attention to service dogs and come up with a certification for them.
 

jaklgreen

Well-Known Member
I'm guessing they're referring to stopping/slowing conveyor belts to load. Yes, that has an operational impact, but the impact is the product of individual impact times magnitude. IOW, if 40% of riders were wheelchair users like they were DAS party, it seems obvious to me there'd be more changes than stopping the conveyor belt for every single car
I for one would be curious to see how having to stop the omnimovers to load and unload has affected wait times. I think that we have all seen a dramatic increase in the amount of stops on rides like the Haunted Mansion these last few years. Those stop times DO add up to longer waits. One could argue that it has the same affect as DAS, making the wait longer for the average person.
 

jaklgreen

Well-Known Member
I think it's also going to come down to what constitutes "access" Is it purely physical barriers that are recognized, or do non-physical but just as real barriers fall under it as well. And at what point is Disney liable for providing that access? Does it start and end at things that Disney can control - for example physical queue design as cause of barrier-, or does it stretch to things it can't that are a by-product of it's success: for example queue length and barriers due to the time spent waiting. I think there is a distinguishment between those latter two that Disney is making in it's criteria, and that I have a feeling is going to be central towards Disney's defense against any lawsuits. I highly suspect that the new guidelines were created around what Disney's lawyers are interpreting to the be extent that the company is liable for accommodations under the ADA, and no further.
That would be impossible to quantify. How long is "too long" for someone? Everyone will have a different amount of time that they will consider "too long".
 

DoubleSwitchback

Well-Known Member
I for one would be curious to see how having to stop the omnimovers to load and unload has affected wait times. I think that we have all seen a dramatic increase in the amount of stops on rides like the Haunted Mansion these last few years. Those stop times DO add up to longer waits. One could argue that it has the same affect as DAS, making the wait longer for the average person.
Could be. But what i was responding to was the suggestion that if someone says, "hey, the combination of this accommodation and the frequency with which it was/is given out had/has too large an operational impact" means you're opposed to any accommodation with any operational impact.
 

jaklgreen

Well-Known Member
The biggest issue imo is Disney has not truly conveyed how the system works for single or adults with minors regarding the rtq… allowing people who were denied das access to meet up with your party at any point or walk to front from what was explained to me seems to be more than fair. Not ideal but again provides an alternative method for the person in need. And i know legally they cant say it and i know someone should not be forced to but if its that much of an issue again not ideal just purchase genie and use that as well. Yes i know it cost money but if you are denied das and offered an alternative method and you still dont like it its your next best option and should help ease some pain while on vacation.
I think that is what bothers me the most about this change. They are being so vague about accommodations. Saying "talk to the cast member at the ride" doesn't mean anything for someone wanting to plan a trip. No one wants to spend tens of thousands of dollars and use of their vacation time just to find out that whatever is offered isn't going to work for them.
A company like Disney should absolutely have a plan of action and have it spelled out clearly, like pretty much every other theme park does.
 

jaklgreen

Well-Known Member
Could be. But what i was responding to was the suggestion that if someone says, "hey, the combination of this accommodation and the frequency with which it was/is given out had/has too large an operational impact" means you're opposed to any accommodation with any operational impact.
I don't think that is what he meant at all. The way people on here are talking, ONLY DAS had an impact on ride wait times. But that is not true is it? It clearly does take time to load and unload those with mobility issues on most rides. The exceptions being ones like TSMM, which has a separate pull off. The omnimovers are the worst affected.
I have been on SSE that was stopped 5 times during the ride. And those stops are not short.
So you can't really claim that DAS is the only accommodation that affects ride operations. I think that is the point the other poster was making. He wasn't saying that Disney should not accommodate anything, quite the opposite in fact.
 

NotTheOne

Well-Known Member
I think that if anything, maybe this will force the ADA to come up a more comprehensive guideline for what businesses are required to offer. Nothing of significance has really changed with the ADA for a very long time. I think that it is past time for them to have a better outline of what is and is not required, like many other Countries do.
They also need to give attention to service dogs and come up with a certification for them.
I'd be careful what you wish for, as it could very well be that such changes could result in some conditions/disabilities for which there is no viable accommodation that doesn't include undue negative operational impact.
 

jaklgreen

Well-Known Member
I'd be careful what you wish for, as it could very well be that such changes could result in some conditions/disabilities for which there is no viable accommodation that doesn't include undue negative operational impact.
At least we would know then and people can plan their lives accordingly. It really was not that long ago that most people with these kinds of disabilities just stayed home. I would like to think that we wouldn't go backwards, but as Angel just posted, the current political environment is unpredictable.
 

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