News New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

[Angel Ariel]

Almost as though this was a forum for people wanting to discuss WDW!

I'm all about discussion, but some of this just feels like a dead horse at this point. No side is going to change mind of the other (not referring to new people coming in and asking questions).

I could sit here and demonstrate that there are reasons that an "entire party" (which may be as small as 2 or 3 people) do actually need to be able to stay with the disabled person - but we've covered all of that before, so it's not really discussion at this point

 

[jennab55]

I'm all about discussion, but some of this just feels like a dead horse at this point. No side is going to change mind of the other (not referring to new people coming in and asking questions).

I could sit here and demonstrate that there are reasons that an "entire party" (which may be as small as 2 or 3 people) do actually need to be able to stay with the disabled person - but we've covered all of that before, so it's not really discussion at this point

I think the actual answer is “it depends”. There are situations when it might be needed and some when it might not. I feel like most can agree that it is not always needed though….

 

[Angel Ariel]

I feel like most can agree that it is not always needed though…

It absolutely depends. But then the same could be said for rider swap too, right? There's no *need* to let the child ride a second time just so the other parent can ride. It's a perk. One that has also been lessened in recent years (down from a max of 3 people riding the second time to 2). I appreciate that Disney sees the value in not forcing people to experience attractions alone in order to have an accommodation. Even with the non-DAS accommodations, it doesn't force someone to wait alone.

 

[jennab55]

It absolutely depends. But then the same could be said for rider swap too, right? There's no *need* to let the child ride a second time just so the other parent can ride. It's a perk. One that has also been lessened in recent years (down from a max of 3 people riding the second time to 2). I appreciate that Disney sees the value in not forcing people to experience attractions alone in order to have an accommodation. Even with the non-DAS accommodations, it doesn't force someone to wait alone.

Right. If it’s a party of more than 2, someone could wait with the disabled person.

 

[Chi84]

I'm all about discussion, but some of this just feels like a dead horse at this point. No side is going to change mind of the other (not referring to new people coming in and asking questions).

I could sit here and demonstrate that there are reasons that an "entire party" (which may be as small as 2 or 3 people) do actually need to be able to stay with the disabled person - but we've covered all of that before, so it's not really discussion at this point

That’s all true, but need is not the end of the discussion. A person may need accommodations that a business is not obligated to provide for reasons that were discussed previously in the thread.

In any event, I think the mods have asked us to stay away from what “should” be required.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

In any event, I think the mods have asked us to stay away from what “should” be required.

@wdwmagic can you clarify this?

 

[Angel Ariel]

In any event, I think the mods have asked us to stay away from what “should” be required.

As well as not to rehash the same discussions

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

As well as not to rehash the same discussions

Speaking of…. Adventurers club should have never closed!!!! Kungaloosh!

 

[DisneyHead123]

That particular rationale doesn't make sense to me either. Accommodations under the ADA have to both necessary and reasonable, with reasonableness including an analysis of the impact on the business. Having entire parties avoid standing in line because one person is unable to do so would almost certainly fail the test of being a reasonable and necessary accommodation per the ADA.

Of course, as far as I can tell Disney's DAS program is not required by the ADA so they're free to run it as they like. I'm not aware of any challenges so far to their in-line accommodations.

Disagree with part of what you said but agree that since this isn’t an ADA issue (yet) it’s neither here nor there at the moment.

Will leave it at that for now. I haven’t kept up with the boards recently but if this is an issue that needs to be let go, fair enough.

 

[DoubleSwitchback]

As well as not to rehash the same discussions

Does complaining again about other people's discussions boring you count as "rehashing", too?

 

[Chi84]

Does complaining again about other people's discussions boring you count as "rehashing", too?

I don’t think either of us is complaining but the mods have been clear about not rehashing old arguments. See post #11,138. There were others also.

 

[jennab55]

I mean it does make sense to talk about it again after it’s been what, almost 9mo now. Like what people think has changed or what is or isn’t working. Speculation on what’s next.

 

[flynnibus]

When we talk about equal access, we want things to be as equivalent to the experience others have as possible. Just because an accomodation may "work" doesn't mean that it's equal access. And also, asking that your family stay with you on vacation is not unreasonable.

Remember.. the ADA doesn't provide you "equal access" or "equal experience" - It's meant to ensure you aren't --excluded or discriminated against--. It is intended to ensure you get --participation-- without being discriminated against.

The ADA isn't there to elevate someone's abilities... or make their constraints disappear from how they function. It's simply intended to ensure people aren't being systematically excluded or to make reasonable changes so that people can participate without being second class. Example: If someone has limited stamina, the ADA doesn't say you should have provide them with a ECV so they can do more. It says you should allow an ECV that someone needed. This is an important distinction. Just like someone with limited stamina isn't given line skips just so they can experience the same number of attractions as someone else. They would be given line skipping accommodations because they can't function within the constraints of the queing itself.

When it comes to how someone likes to travel (as a group or whatever) you're no longer talking about what someone needs for participation, but just preferences and guest satisfaction. It's within reason to limit someone's ability to function as a single group, especially when that request has operational consequences.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

It's within reason to limit someone's ability to function as a single group, especially when that request has operational consequences.

What is the operational consequence of other guests waiting with a disabled guest outside the of the que?

 

[NotTheOne]

What is the operational consequence of other guests waiting with a disabled guest outside the of the que?

It unnecessarily adds people to the LLs, which slow down the LLs and the standby lines.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

It unnecessarily adds people to the LLs, which slow down the LLs and the standby lines.

Would they not merge at the same point they are currently merging at?

 

[NotTheOne]

Would they not merge at the same point they are currently merging at?

Yes, but the idea is to cut down on the number of people waiting in the LL itself.

I've not been back to either park since the changes last year, but my understanding from what I've read is that clamping down on DAS, both by reducing the number of guests who receive it and reducing the number of people in their party, has had a noticeable positive effect on both LL and standby wait times.

 

[NotTheOne]

Remember.. the ADA doesn't provide you "equal access" or "equal experience" - It's meant to ensure you aren't --excluded or discriminated against--. It is intended to ensure you get --participation-- without being discriminated against.

The ADA isn't there to elevate someone's abilities... or make their constraints disappear from how they function. It's simply intended to ensure people aren't being systematically excluded or to make reasonable changes so that people can participate without being second class. Example: If someone has limited stamina, the ADA doesn't say you should have provide them with a ECV so they can do more. It says you should allow an ECV that someone needed. This is an important distinction. Just like someone with limited stamina isn't given line skips just so they can experience the same number of attractions as someone else. They would be given line skipping accommodations because they can't function within the constraints of the queing itself.

When it comes to how someone likes to travel (as a group or whatever) you're no longer talking about what someone needs for participation, but just preferences and guest satisfaction. It's within reason to limit someone's ability to function as a single group, especially when that request has operational consequences.

So well said, thank you!

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Yes, but the idea is to cut down on the number of people waiting in the LL itself.

I've not been back to either park since the changes last year, but my understanding from what I've read is that clamping down on DAS, both by reducing the number of guests who receive it and reducing the number of people in their party, has had a noticeable positive effect on both LL and standby wait times.

Sorry! I think we were talking about 2 different issues here.

I was referring to guests needing to wait alone while the rest of the party waits in standby. My point was… either way the same number of guests are going to be merging at some point to get on the attraction.

 

[NotTheOne]

Sorry! I think we were talking about 2 different issues here.

I was referring to guests needing to wait alone while the rest of the party waits in standby. My point was… either way the same number of guests are going to be merging at some point to get on the attraction.

We're not talking about different issues as far as I know; you think that disabled people shouldn't have to wait alone, so they should get a DAS even if another accommodation will work, such as waiting outside the line and meeting their party.