New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

[Splash4eva]

Did you mean to quote someone else’s post?

I don’t see any way that your response has anything at all to do with what I said.

My response was geared towards the fact it seems like you feel if someone doesnt look or act autistic they will get denied. Point im making is. Not all autistic/spectrum children will show any signs of the disability so does that mean they will be denied bc there is no clearly visible issues?

 

[Splash4eva]

To be fair, waiting on transportation isn't really an option. DAS doesn't apply for Disney's transportation services. Whether talking about a Disney bus, a shades bus, a ride share service, etc - how long anyone has to wait is out of their control (and simply driving themselves isn't an option for all for a multitude of reasons).

Another reason ill rent a car to avoid issues like this.

 

[Joel]

To be fair, waiting on transportation isn't really an option.

Yet an awful lot of people who swear they're unable to wait more than a few minutes for anything manage to do it multiple times a day. And somehow the post-apocalyptic scene of queues littered with bodily waste and fainted bodies that some claim awaits us if they can't have this specific accommodation has never materialized at the Magic Kingdom bus stop after Happily Ever After.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Yet an awful lot of people who swear they're unable to wait more than a few minutes for anything manage to do it multiple times a day. And somehow the post-apocalyptic scene of queues littered with bodily waste and fainted bodies that some claim awaits us if they can't have this specific accommodation has never materialized at the Magic Kingdom bus stop after Happily Ever After.

no one in my family has the particular needs you're referring to.

That said, my child does struggle with queues each day for reasons unique to her disability. And she still struggles when waiting for transportation as well, but for very different reasons. For queues we have an accommodation option, and it helps tremendously. For transportation there isnt an option and our stress level rises significantly. As does hers, which impacts her in other ways. So, no, nothing about it is just "fine". It just is. Which is why we are grateful for the accommodations we do get during the day, as they make the trip possible for all of us. If every day was high stress all day like that, we would not go. Accommodations doing what they're intended to do -provide access where it otherwise may not exist.

 

[Comped]

While this isn't aimed at you specifically, or anyone who legitimately needs the DAS; it doesn’t change the fact that there are many people who were able to obtain a DAS by embellishing a condition that may or may not exist or knew the proper code words to convince a cast member to grant them access to the program. In many of these cases of abuse, the sole purpose for wanting to be in the program is purely for the benefit of being able to use lightning lane at will without having to pay the fees associated with Genie+.

Difference with those lines vs attraction lines? I can sit! I don't have to stand in a spot (or two) for quite some time, which is generally where my cerebral palsy flares up. Standing in short lines is possible for me. But 45 minutes? An hour? Two hours? Nope!

 

[Indy_UK]

When you did the video call, did the CM see you were from the UK?

Someone I know from another site managed to get through using a vpn but the CM then said “Oh, I shouldn’t really be doing this. But seeing as you’ve waited all this time I’ll do it for you”.

They never even asked actually. If they get funny next time I will rejoin and put on an American accent

 

[lazyboy97o]

My practice is pretty far away from anything relating to the ADA, but I think they could definitely argue that the DAS abuse was fundamentally altering the nature of their G+/ILL business and their ability to serve regular guests -- especially if they have significant data/evidence to back this up (and @lentesta has suggested they do).

But how does that usage compare to the baseline prevalence within the general population? If 1% of the population represents a single disability and then most are traveling with a party of four, you’ve now jumped to 4% of park visitors. Then you get into issues of such as self selection towards different attractions and the division between Stand-By and Lightning Lane which will push up those percentages.

We also know that Disney seems to attraction people with disabilities at a rate greater than the general population. It is not unusual to see Disney having to create overflow accessible parking space (and shame on Disney for not using their data to exceed minimum parking and room counts). While Disney has been trying to move physical disabilities out of DAS this still shows the greater rate of visitation than other venues.

 

[lazyboy97o]

That's probably not accurate.

Fundamentally altered, within the context of the ADA and reasonable accomodations is akin to making the Disneyland Submarines wheelchair accessible. It can't be done without completely changing the nature of the attraction. So they get pass and another reasonable accomodation was created instead.

"I had to wait longer" would not be an unreasonable accomodation or speak to the overall experience being fundamentally altered.

The alternate experiences at Disneyland are not due to the ADA but California’s state specific legislation.

 

[Happyday]

Are there restrictions to what attractions you can use your specific DAS for based on your individual disabilities? Certainly once Disney is made aware of any triggering issues they should take responsibility and steer that guest away from experiences that would leave them open to any possible discomfort no matter the queue time.

No there are no restrictions however think about it, do you really think a family member is going to continue to bring their loved one on an attraction that would trigger them? Personally I don't want to upset them nor do I want to deal with a meltdown. This is why they have DAS, not to mention rider swap works great for this as well so those family members that want to can ride it, and before you ask no the family member can not use the DAS unless the person with DAS rides, they are very strict on that.

 

[Happyday]

While this isn't aimed at you specifically, or anyone who legitimately needs the DAS; it doesn’t change the fact that there are many people who were able to obtain a DAS by embellishing a condition that may or may not exist or knew the proper code words to convince a cast member to grant them access to the program. In many of these cases of abuse, the sole purpose for wanting to be in the program is purely for the benefit of being able to use lightning lane at will without having to pay the fees associated with Genie+.

It is hard for me to sincerely believe the argument that people who claim they desperately need the DAS service because they cannot wait in a long line for an attraction but can wait in a long line when it is convenient for them and their needs. Whether it is waiting for a concert, waiting in line for merchandise, waiting on transportation, or waiting on food, there are many instances of abuse that have been noticed and documented by Disney to the point that they know there are contradictions in the claims coming from those people and know there is a problem with abuse.

I think it is an insult to the intelligence of all park goers to say that everyone in the DAS program legitimately has the disability they claim and needs the accommodation they request. It is also unrealistic to say all who apply for DAS all stay strictly within the parameters of their medical specific needs that they told Disney when they requested their DAS. Someone who legitimately needed the DAS would not be able to cherry-pick when their disability prohibits them from waiting in a line and when it doesn’t. People with serious medical conditions usually cannot turn it off when it becomes convenient.

If someone is able to wait in a long line for something where DAS accommodation is not offered and chooses to do so anyway despite telling Disney that it is not possible for them to wait in line for attraction queues citing medical reasons, then it is only fair and correct for others to question and challenge the validity of their need for the DAS pass.

Desperately needing DAS accommodation for theme park attractions but being able to miraculously recover from their condition when it comes time to do an activity where that accommodation did not apply is a big part on why this program needs revisions. Disney has admitted there is a large amount of people enrolled in the program who simply do not belong. They have also admitted they have evidence that there has been more than a small amount of documented abuse of the program. If the amount of abuse was insignificant, they wouldn't be changing the program and the requirements so radically. While I feel for the people who truly need this accommodation, it’s hard to ignore the blatant disregard for the rules. It is a shame that those who abuse the program are now causing hardships for the people who need the program for the reasons it was intended.

Okay but you can't lump it all together as well. Some people have legitimate anxiety in some situations and not others.

 

[Happyday]

So exactly like how people can wait in line and go on whatever ride the want. Which is what DAS is supposed to be the alternative for, not Genie+. Some seem to forget that DAS people still wait however long the standby wait time is to get on the ride. Not only that, they have to then wait however long the LL is.

And when Disney pads the wait time they don't get to save that time.

 

[Happyday]

I feel like a simpler first step in “cracking down” could simply be switching to virtual application only, no premade ride selections, and party members only immediate family or part of your booking. That would weed out the tour guide abuse and free up some confusion by taking out preselects.

Personally we do not do preselects we tried that once we didn't make half of them. That is the plus for us with DAS sometimes the DAS member isn't able to go to that ride in the allowed time frame we have returned to a ride over 1 hour after our "return time".

 

[Happyday]

But how does that usage compare to the baseline prevalence within the general population? If 1% of the population represents a single disability and then most are traveling with a party of four, you’ve now jumped to 4% of park visitors. Then you get into issues of such as self selection towards different attractions and the division between Stand-By and Lightning Lane which will push up those percentages.

We also know that Disney seems to attraction people with disabilities at a rate greater than the general population. It is not unusual to see Disney having to create overflow accessible parking space (and shame on Disney for not using their data to exceed minimum parking and room counts). While Disney has been trying to move physical disabilities out of DAS this still shows the greater rate of visitation than other venues.

Because Disney is extremely better at accessibility on rides. Short list of rides you can stay in a wheelchair...Small world, Jungle cruise, Finding Nemo, Little Mermaid, Living with the land, Kilimanjaro Safari, Remy's Ratatouille I could go on but...

 

[nickys]

Well yes, the UK patrons are probably use to DLP which you have to show proof be as long as you have prove you have their version of a DAS

No that’s not what I meant.

After all the existing system at WDW is the same in that the vast majority of UK guests get DAS when they get there.

But when they’re completely changing things and there’s doubt over who will qualify, it’s a massive risk for some to pay over €12k without knowing if they will qualify.

And bear in mind this still isn’t on the UK website either. Even if it was , most who are booked for this summer will have booked months ago. They might not even realise things are changing.

 

[nickys]

In case anyone was curious, Disney has posted an Accessibility Planning Guide &
Recommendations (you can see from the PDF file name it was finalized on 4/5/24)

https://cdn1.parksmedia.wdprapps.disney.com/vision-dam/digital/parks-platform/parks-global-assets/disney-world/guest-services/accessibility/page/WDW-Access-Planning-Guide-FINAL-4-5-24.pdf

This would seem to reaffirm that DAS is intended only for those with a “developmental disability like autism or similar.”

Physically navigating various queues is addressed in the Mobility Access Options at the bottom of the page.


View attachment 778529

The only real change there is the specific statement about DAS.

It doesn’t address the main issue which is all those who have been able to get DAS up until now but will apparently not qualify in a few weeks time.

Not even “we will be introducing a new procedure for guests who need to leave the line for medical issues”.

 

[nickys]

I think a large number of people who had no problem doing any of these things:

1. Telling the truth about a condition that would get them approved for DAS even though they didn’t really need it
2. Embellishing the severity of a real condition they had
3. Lying about a DAS qualifying condition that was not terribly severe and not easily proven false

Will have a much harder time getting on a video call and pretending to be autistic. Not all of them. But most of them.

You do know autism is classed as an invisible disability? You can’t tell by looking at them that they’re autistic. With some, sure. But not all of them.
And many will be kids. They won’t be “interviewing” them.

What the new virtual process does do is take away the burden on the CMs at GS for making the decision.

Of course they’ll still have to deal with irate guests who have been denied DAS.

 

[Splash4eva]

no one in my family has the particular needs you're referring to.

That said, my child does struggle with queues each day for reasons unique to her disability. And she still struggles when waiting for transportation as well, but for very different reasons. For queues we have an accommodation option, and it helps tremendously. For transportation there isnt an option and our stress level rises significantly. As does hers, which impacts her in other ways. So, no, nothing about it is just "fine". It just is. Which is why we are grateful for the accommodations we do get during the day, as they make the trip possible for all of us. If every day was high stress all day like that, we would not go. Accommodations doing what they're intended to do -provide access where it otherwise may not exist.

Exactly. Just because someone can deal, handle or get thru one wait or struggle and manage to get thru one line etc does not mean they can handle it each and every time over the course of an entire vacation. Thats what i think most people do not get or understand

 

[RamblinWreck]

You do know autism is classed as an invisible disability? You can’t tell by looking at them that they’re autistic. With some, sure. But not all of them.
And many will be kids. They won’t be “interviewing” them.

What the new virtual process does do is take away the burden on the CMs at GS for making the decision.

Of course they’ll still have to deal with irate guests who have been denied DAS.

I’m aware it’s invisible, yes.

I just think a large portion of people who have used DAS without truly needing it aren’t the kind of people to try to pass themselves off as autistic.

It’s a pretty big leap from exaggerating your IBS to looking someone in the eye and fabricating a mental illness.

 

[KDM31091]

Tell that to my Mom who literally passed out & fainted in MGM studios due to her condition & her initial stubbornness to not get a GAC at the time. I guess she shouldnt go & enjoy a vacation with her son & her granddaughter anymore. 3 bouts of cancer numerous other medical conditions but yea she shouldnt enjoy the rest of her life…. Comments like this just shows the ignorance of some. But hey. You do you.

I’m sorry about your mother. My point is simply that heat exhaustion can happen to literally all of us in the parks.

I also never said she shouldn’t enjoy her time, or anyone with a condition shouldn’t enjoy their time. However, being in the oppressively hot, crowded theme parks in the summer, is perhaps not ideal for certain conditions, whether you get DAS or not.

 

[KDM31091]

The peoplemover used to be a literal walk on almost at all times, and now has a permanent and constant queue of 15+ minutes. It does not have a lightning lane. It is constantly loading and moving and has high capacity. What’s causing the sudden longer wait, if not DAS? Yes, some is legitimate. But some is not.