New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

[Happyday]

The problem here needs to be addressed analytically; feeling bad isn't going to solve anything. I'm frustrated because much of what has been said here about the ADA requirements is not true - it's nothing more than wishful thinking which helps nothing. Maybe it's the frustration that sounds harsh. People often believe the law protects them to a much greater degree than it actually does.

Disney simply cannot continue with its current policies. As noted earlier, the ADA does not address line accommodations. Disney tried GAC and then DAS and both were unsustainable, not only because of abuse, but also because of an aging population and more persons coming within the ADA definition of disabled.

Disney's between a rock and a hard place. If the statistics set out earlier in this thread are even close to accurate (and I believe they are because they are in line with the type of evidence presented in A.L. v. Walt Disney World Resorts), Disney's going to lose not only its disabled guests but everyone else as well if it doesn't handle this problem.

It seems that Disney is trying to get many of the people who had DAS back into lines with another, lesser accommodation that - even if it's not DAS - might work for them. We don't know, and it's possible Disney doesn't want to say too much too soon to avoid tipping off potential abusers.

Emotions can run high in a thread like this one and one thoughtless response (of which I am guilty) can lead to more of the same.

I agree, my thoughts as I read this though was about the tipping off potential abusers (just to be clear I have said the same thing) Unfortunately as soon as this goes into practice those abusers are going to be tipped off.

 

[Happyday]

Those 3 and Test Track. And occasionally Soarin’

Thank you I knew I was forgetting some

 

[DisneyCane]

I believe it just says that they need a "reasonable accommodation".

So certainly some gray area there. But if you can show that your disabled guests are able to experience just as much in a day as your non-disabled guests, then that must mean that they are being reasonably accommodated.

The actual wording is that they can't discriminate against people with disabilities and that they have to provide equal access as someone without a disability.
The way it is worded leaves it very open to interpretation by the judiciary about what they actually have to do with respect to accommodate people with autism or similar developmental disabilities.
The origins of the ADA were to allow disabled people to participate in society by doing reasonable things to provide access to employment and public accommodations.
An airline doesn't have to give free upgrades to first class because an autistic person gets triggered by being too close to a a stranger.

 

[Splash4eva]

Well that’s always the risk with using gift cards. Disney is great about giving people refunds outside of their refund windows if you give them a good reason, but all they can really do is refund it to the original payment. It’s not like those gift cards have no value.

Yes agreed and they have value understood. Just if i choose not to go i am sitting on a good amt of money

 

[Hockey89]

It’s funny how compassion seems to only work one way. Compassion does not equal “give me everything I want no questions asked, damn how it affects anyone else”.

I would say the people who have family members who can wait in queues without an issue, qualify for DAS, but don’t apply for it, are showing compassion for the people who actually really need it.

The parks simply can’t continue to operate with the current policy in place and accommodate EVERYONE.

Correct. What I need to try to get a job while on welfare. The horror. Non DAS people are getting screwed by this and the DAS only want their special treatment. Do some need it. You bet and they should have it. 100%. The rest that don’t actually need it will still go to Disney.

 

[DisneyHead123]

Oh yeah I know... the numbers that were shared before about DAS usage in Lightning Lane absolutely makes sense and I'm not at all disputing that. The problem is the claim that there is widespread abuse occuring when people with DAS are joining standby lines while waiting for their DAS return (basically double dipping). There is no real evidence to suggest this is as big an issue as anyone here makes it out.

If there is no real abuse occuring, the only thing any potential DAS change will do, is force people from the Lightning Lane to the standby. Which effectively means the wait times will not change. So no one really ends up ahead.

I agree, I think any changes to DAS primarily help Disney make more money, there will be pretty much no benefit to standby users.

I also question the claims of rampant cheating. Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure it happens, maybe substantially. But I also think part of the rise in DAS use is just a very different mindset regarding accommodations in younger people. I don’t see that changing, and I think Disney will get a ton of pushback from younger Millennials and Gen Z on these upcoming changes.

 

[sblank]

I also question the claims of rampant cheating. Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure it happens, maybe substantially. But I also think part of the rise in DAS use is just a very different mindset regarding accommodations in younger people. I don’t see that changing, and I think Disney will get a ton of pushback from younger Millennials and Gen Z on these upcoming changes.

There are multiple families in my kid's kindergarten class alone that have used an "online tour guide company" to book "fastpasses" for them while they're in the parks. I was very confused about how this was possible with the Genie+ system until I did some digging and it turns out they are really just selling DAS access. I had no idea this was a thing but it's become a huge problem, hence the changes.

 

[Splash4eva]

There are multiple families in my kid's kindergarten class alone that have used an "online tour guide company" to book "fastpasses" for them while they're in the parks. I was very confused about how this was possible with the Genie+ system until I did some digging and it turns out they are really just selling DAS access. I had no idea this was a thing but it's become a huge problem, hence the changes.

Its disgusting but explain to me how Disney could NOT easily sniff this out?

 

[Disstevefan1]

Disney has more levers in place to be able to manipulate Genie+ inventory to keep lines moving. They can control whether or not the system gets overwhelmed.

Lets see how it goes. The number one priority for Disney is MONEY. Lets see how they regulate Genie+ and ILL sales to ensure the queues do not balloon to what they are now with all the "DAS abuse".

 

[Disstevefan1]

There are multiple families in my kid's kindergarten class alone that have used an "online tour guide company" to book "fastpasses" for them while they're in the parks. I was very confused about how this was possible with the Genie+ system until I did some digging and it turns out they are really just selling DAS access. I had no idea this was a thing but it's become a huge problem, hence the changes.

As we know, Disney trespassed many, if not all, of these "tour guides".

They even trespassed legitimate third party tour guides who use Genie+ properly and did not use any front of the line tricks.

 

[StarBright]

It's really funny to me how money keeps being brought up as Disney's motivator. Like it's somehow a revelation no one else has thought about.

Because, duh.

If there are less DAS users unexpectedly going into the LLs, that means Stand-by lines move faster (note, this doesn't necessarily mean they will be shorter, or that instead of 1 hr they will take 40 min, just that the ratio of LL vs Stand-by will be less), and if Stand-by keeps moving instead of having guests stand still for 10 mins because there is suddenly 300 unexpected guests in LL then Stand-by guests are happier, happy guests spend money and book more vacations.

Less DAS guests in the LLs means Disney can control the amount of G+ it sells better. The better Genie+ works the happier Genie+ guests are. Happy guests spend money and book more vacations.

It's not rocket science. Its simply that having less DAS users is better for everyone, including guests who truly need DAS to be able to go to Disney Parks.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Given Disney’s clear bar on commercial activity on property or in the parks, I’m struggling to see how there are “legitimate third party tour guides”

This could be totally fake news, but I saw on YouTube a story about a long running third party tour guide who asked, and apparently got permission, from Disney to operate and over the years built a business, and all at once was trespassed.

This tour guide apparently played by the rules, never skipped and queues, did exactly what a regular guest would do, just did it for the guests that employed them.

But yes, in your view, and now in Disney's view, suddenly, this business is not allowed to serve their customers.

I get it, Now that the failed Genie+ system in place, Disney's tour guides CAN MAKE EVEN MORE MONEY and they don't want the these long running businesses (that costs less) cutting into Disney's business.

Remember, its all about MONEY.

 

[phillip9698]

It's really funny to me how money keeps being brought up as Disney's motivator. Like it's somehow a revelation no one else has thought about.

Because, duh.

If there are less DAS users unexpectedly going into the LLs, that means Stand-by lines move faster (note, this doesn't necessarily mean they will be shorter, or that instead of 1 hr they will take 40 min, just that the ratio of LL vs Stand-by will be less), and if Stand-by keeps moving instead of having guests stand still for 10 mins because there is suddenly 300 unexpected guests in LL then Stand-by guests are happier, happy guests spend money and book more vacations.

Less DAS guests in the LLs means Disney can control the amount of G+ it sells better. The better Genie+ works the happier Genie+ guests are. Happy guests spend money and book more vacations.

It's not rocket science. Its simply that having less DAS users is better for everyone, including guests who truly need DAS to be able to go to Disney Parks.

I agree 100% with this. I enjoy a queue that is constantly moving but may be a bit longer than one that is empty until half way and then comes to a complete stop and doesn’t move for long stretches of time.

It defeats the purpose of all the work they put into the queue if you speed past half of it and then linger in one area for large stretches of time.

 

[Joel]

but I saw on YouTube

This should have been your first clue it wasn't true.

 

[el_super]

Disney knows and understands the level of abuse, and is taking steps to fix it.

You know this "Disney is always right thing" is pretty clever. I think I'm going to have to remember that for later...

It's really funny to me how money keeps being brought up as Disney's motivator. Like it's somehow a revelation no one else has thought about.

Of course it's about money... what's funny though is thinking that some additional G+ sales are somehow worth risking multi-million dollar class action lawsuits. The math will always work out to granting access and allowing a few cheaters in than denying someone who really needs it. It's not just the easy thing to do, but based on how the ADA was written it's the legally right thing to do. It's why stories like this exist:

 

[Disstevefan1]

It's really funny to me how money keeps being brought up as Disney's motivator. Like it's somehow a revelation no one else has thought about.

Because, duh.

If there are less DAS users unexpectedly going into the LLs, that means Stand-by lines move faster (note, this doesn't necessarily mean they will be shorter, or that instead of 1 hr they will take 40 min, just that the ratio of LL vs Stand-by will be less), and if Stand-by keeps moving instead of having guests stand still for 10 mins because there is suddenly 300 unexpected guests in LL then Stand-by guests are happier, happy guests spend money and book more vacations.

Less DAS guests in the LLs means Disney can control the amount of G+ it sells better. The better Genie+ works the happier Genie+ guests are. Happy guests spend money and book more vacations.

It's not rocket science. Its simply that having less DAS users is better for everyone, including guests who truly need DAS to be able to go to Disney Parks.

Lets see what happens in reality.

My guess there will be no significant change in queues.

It doesn't matter, Disney is changing the system, like it or not, and YES because MONEY.

As you say its not rocket science, but this silly return to line sounds like its gonna be a trainwreck.

 

[StarBright]

Of course it's about money... what's funny though is thinking that some additional G+ sales are somehow worth risking multi-million dollar class action lawsuits. The math will always work out to granting access and allowing a few cheaters in than denying someone who really needs it. It's not just the easy thing to do, but based on how the ADA was written it's the legally right thing to do. It's why stories like this exist:

And that's Disney's risk to take. I think that their army of lawyers are prepared.

FYI amputation is a mobility issue. IMO the only reason they gave the woman in the video a DAS was so that she would stop making a scene. Probably one of the reasons there are so many guests using DAS that don't need it.

 

[RamblinWreck]

Lets see what happens in reality.

My guess there will be no significant change in queues.

It doesn't matter, Disney is changing the system, like it or not, and YES because MONEY.

As you say its not rocket science, but this silly return to line sounds like its gonna be a trainwreck.

I don't think the return to line feature will work very well at all.

But the rider switch feature will, and it will accommodate people very well.

 

[StarBright]

Lets see what happens in reality.

My guess there will be no significant change in queues.

It doesn't matter, Disney is changing the system, like it or not, and YES because MONEY.

As you say its not rocket science, but this silly return to line sounds like its gonna be a trainwreck.

We shall see if Disney proves you right or wrong.

 

[DryerLintFan]

You know this "Disney is always right thing" is pretty clever. I think I'm going to have to remember that for later...




Of course it's about money... what's funny though is thinking that some additional G+ sales are somehow worth risking multi-million dollar class action lawsuits. The math will always work out to granting access and allowing a few cheaters in than denying someone who really needs it. It's not just the easy thing to do, but based on how the ADA was written it's the legally right thing to do. It's why stories like this exist:

This is user error. I’m not a pixie duster, but they can’t read your mind. How were they supposed to know she couldn’t sit for a long time either when she didn’t tell them?