Rumor MK Space Mountain REVISED in 2026? (One track? side-by-side seating?)

[larryz]

gauruntee

 

[K&KDizFreaks]

Dlr space mountain basically has CMs yelling like militants at guests

100% True. We were there a couple of weeks ago and were surprised by the efficiency of their SM dispatch. They weren’t even using the unload portion. Load and unload at the same point. People were flying in and out of the ride vehicle, CMs were loudly “motivating” guests to exit and load quickly. It was impressive. As an older larger guy, I was not as nimble as the CMs would have liked, but I got a kick out of it. Great ride, fun experience, but would not want it to replace WDW. Single seat, tight tunnels, hairpin turns, and the lasting back pain make it memorable and a classic.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Dispatch interval absolutely must be known to calculate cycle time. You can’t know cycle time without knowing the minimum dispatch interval. You can’t know load time without knowing minimum dispatch interval.

The cycle time is designed. It is made up by the designers. They decide how long they want the experience to last. Even before ride design begins, someone working on the park or land program spreadsheet can just make up a number based on the types of experiences desired.

You are. Minimum dispatch interval is not an observation. It’s a limitation of the ride system. And your formula does not let you “work through” those limitations and constraints. That is the exact reason some times ride systems need to change.

Yes it does. With the process you have agreed is correct.

1) Capacity Goal: 1500 people per hour

2) Determine the Experience: Groups of 6 doing an experience that has a total cycle of 5 minutes

Put those into the formula
1500 = (60 min / 5 min) * (6 Seats per Ride Vehicle * Ride Vehicles)
Ride Vehicles = (1500 / (60 min / 5 min)) / 6 Seats per RV
Ride Vehicles = 20.83 which we'll round up to 21

3) Figure Out How

We now have Cycle Time and Ride Vehicles which means we can plug that into

Dispatch Interval = Cycle Time / Ride Vehicles
Dispatch Interval = 5 min / 21 RVs
Dispatch Interval = 0.24 min = 14.4 seconds

We can now take that number and see if the ride system is capable of meeting that demand. We can work with Operations to see if they can meet that demand. We can review the show intent to make sure there are no specifics of the show that cannot meet that demand. If the answer to any of these is "No" the design team can go back and review. We can look at other ride systems. We can look at changing the cycle time or seats per ride vehicle. We can explore a dual load situation. All-in-all have an experience goal and from that we derived an operational goal that can be assed outside of a vacuum of just what the ride system can technically achieve.

Yes, absolutely this. And the length of the track or cycle time doesn’t prevent your ability to “figure out how to achieve it”

If you agree this is the right process, and have admitted that dispatch interval isn't a starting point for design, then give us the right formula. What that can be used for tracked rides, flat rides and shows. One that can utilize and provide just as much data.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Additionally, DL’s Space Mountain is a notoriously high-stress attraction for CMs, with dispatch intervals as fast as 16 seconds when running at full capacity. While waiting to board, I’s not unusual to hear the alarm that the ride is starting “cascade” (back up due to slow loading), at which point a vehicle will be sent for a second trip without giving the guests and opportunity to unload, in order to try and clear the brake zones behind it. They have found a lot of ways to keep guests moving quickly at that attraction, but it requires everybody to pay attention in a way that WDW’s more tourist-focused crowds would likely struggle with. It seems like a lot of WDI’s recent loading area designs have had downright-leisurely load times (Rise, Tron, and especially Ratatouille), so it’s difficult to imagine a modern attraction require such rushed loading, or that WDW’s guests and CMs would be able to keep up.

This is a good example of why just because a ride system can do something it does not mean it should be chosen. In a sort of paradox maintaining Safety, Courtesy and Show requires actually prioritizing Efficiency over Courtesy and Show.

If Space Mountain was to be replaced by a single track, the larger dome could potentially hold a dual load configuration to meet tighter dispatch intervals. That though negates a nice chunk of your daily operational savings.

 

[flynnibus]

DLR is such a great total experience for sure. You just can’t have guests act like they are on vacation

It doesn’t have the thrill element like wdw’s design… but it was so smooth and the sound was a great touch. I will miss the memorable elements like seeing the glowing stripes moving around above… the constant feeling like things are close… and the variety of path wdw’s ride had tho. Dlr is basically just diving curves over and over.

I just can’t see today’s disney focusing on those unique elements of the past.

It’s still mind boggling what toyko is doing… and hard to think that they can justify a new exterior build… and if wdw doesn’t…

 

[TrippedUp]

Id just love to see what RMC could do with this attraction and raptor track. Shame Disney wont touch them.

 

[BirdbyBird]

I love my single row purists in this thread! i had no idea

 

[larryz]

I love my single row purists in this thread! i had no idea

Darn tootin'! Give me snuggles or give me death!

 

[Epcot82Guy]

I actually was at MK last night (first time in a long time), and I got to ride SM in the first time in probably a year or so. Just a few thoughts walking away from it:

1. I truly don't personally understand the roughness claim. My whole party (including 2 people that visit often) all said it felt surprisingly smooth compared to other coasters nearing this age. Obviously, the ride experience is meant to toss you around kind of like a wild mouse coaster. But, that's part of the fun. It's not "rough" or "unrideable" like many other coasters - but perhaps that's because I'm more of a coaster enthusiast. So, rough may mean something very different to me.

2. I actually hope we don't get onboard audio. That's not to say I don't want music. I love the ambient music all around you, because it keeps the ride more dynamic. When you have onboard audio, your brain naturally starts to align the track with the song the more you ride. You start to expect the elements. While I know the layout of SM pretty well, the stars, ambient music, etc. help make the ride feel more unexpected. I actually hope they keep this aspect for WDW's SM. (I personally find DL's kinda boring, especially after the first go-round.)

3. I am on team single-rail - but not RMC. Several manufacturers are working on single rail coasters. The big, looping elements aren't needed. Having a more compact, graceful version of what we have today (which also would solve some clearance issues) would create a very unique upgrade to the current version. And, you could solve a lot of the Raptor issues with different trains/restraints. Having a somewhat wild, unpredictable ride in the dark is the hallmark of SM to me. This would be the best vehicle (literally) for that.

Just some musings to share.

 

[Bocabear]

There are clearance issues? I never heard of anyone hitting any of the bars or sets.... I love the parts of the ride that cross into the lift hill scene... exciting to be climbing to the top and see a car whiz by.... I loved the entire original track with it's criss-crossed design including a couple drops... If that could be remade almost exactly the same with the side by side seating and on-board audio it would pretty close to perfect.... Then add some new effects and more brilliant star field projections....then a completely new exit display that would be more extended and visible to the People Mover track...with a brand new speedramp.... Now that would be amazing

 

[gorillaball]

There are clearance issues? I never heard of anyone hitting any of the bars or sets.... I love the parts of the ride that cross into the lift hill scene... exciting to be climbing to the top and see a car whiz by.... I loved the entire original track with it's criss-crossed design including a couple drops... If that could be remade almost exactly the same with the side by side seating and on-board audio it would pretty close to perfect.... Then add some new effects and more brilliant star field projections....then a completely new exit display that would be more extended and visible to the People Mover track...with a brand new speedramp.... Now that would be amazing

Agree with you on all but one (single row) accounts.

Which is fine, it’s purely an objective different preference each of us has. Not like so many disagreements on the boards that are “my preference is the only right one”

 

[DisDude33]

Agree with you on all but one (single row) accounts.

Which is fine, it’s purely an objective different preference each of us has. Not like so many disagreements on the boards that are “my preference is the only right one”

That’s not how I feel about any of this! I’m going to use my next ten post to bring your intelligence into question and express my rage at your differences to me!!!

 

[Bocabear]

Agree with you on all but one (single row) accounts.

Which is fine, it’s purely an objective different preference each of us has. Not like so many disagreements on the boards that are “my preference is the only right one”

Now I love the original ride it was...I remember going on it on it's opening year when the seating was more like a toboggan... sitting in the lap of someone behind you....and the safety belts that would literally fall off.... THe current seating is decidedly much better... Side by side is nice because it doesn't feel like you are on your journey alone....and the added audio is a wonderful thing...

 

[flynnibus]

I loved the entire original track with it's criss-crossed design including a couple drops... If that could be remade almost exactly the same with the side by side seating and on-board audio it would pretty close to perfect....

careful what you wish for... remember... a train twice as wide needs a wider path too..

 

[Serpico Jones]

Hopefully it’s completely torn down and rebuilt from scratch. To say that it’s showing it’s age is an understatement.

Just look at Tron right next door.

 

[Jrb1979]

I actually was at MK last night (first time in a long time), and I got to ride SM in the first time in probably a year or so. Just a few thoughts walking away from it:

1. I truly don't personally understand the roughness claim. My whole party (including 2 people that visit often) all said it felt surprisingly smooth compared to other coasters nearing this age. Obviously, the ride experience is meant to toss you around kind of like a wild mouse coaster. But, that's part of the fun. It's not "rough" or "unrideable" like many other coasters - but perhaps that's because I'm more of a coaster enthusiast. So, rough may mean something very different to me.

2. I actually hope we don't get onboard audio. That's not to say I don't want music. I love the ambient music all around you, because it keeps the ride more dynamic. When you have onboard audio, your brain naturally starts to align the track with the song the more you ride. You start to expect the elements. While I know the layout of SM pretty well, the stars, ambient music, etc. help make the ride feel more unexpected. I actually hope they keep this aspect for WDW's SM. (I personally find DL's kinda boring, especially after the first go-round.)

3. I am on team single-rail - but not RMC. Several manufacturers are working on single rail coasters. The big, looping elements aren't needed. Having a more compact, graceful version of what we have today (which also would solve some clearance issues) would create a very unique upgrade to the current version. And, you could solve a lot of the Raptor issues with different trains/restraints. Having a somewhat wild, unpredictable ride in the dark is the hallmark of SM to me. This would be the best vehicle (literally) for that.

Just some musings to share.

While other manufacturers are working on single rail coasters, RMC is the only one that has installed more than one. RMC can build it without the big inversions if many are against it. The bonus of going with RMC would be the ejector air time their coasters give. Why do you want a calm graceful version of Space Mountain

 

[lazyboy97o]

While other manufacturers are working on single rail coasters, RMC is the only one that has installed more than one. RMC can build it without the big inversions if many are against it. The bonus of going with RMC would be the ejector air time their coasters give. Why do you want a calm graceful version of Space Mountain

The risk of RMC is if they can deliver the required reliability.

 

[Epcot82Guy]

While other manufacturers are working on single rail coasters, RMC is the only one that has installed more than one. RMC can build it without the big inversions if many are against it. The bonus of going with RMC would be the ejector air time their coasters give. Why do you want a calm graceful version of Space Mountain

I don't, but the vast majority of people do. I would love a wild full-out Raptor experience myself. But, if current SM has its complaints, something with the forces of a typical Raptor (even without inversions) wouldn't work at MK given the audience. Tron and Guardians are viewed as thrilling. Leaving aside the rotation sickness on Guardians, RMC and Raptors are a whole other category.

Don't get me wrong, I think a "family Raptor" could be a slam dunk, and that's what I'm envisioning. I simply don't think RMC and Disney would be the best partners for that. Another collab to achieve the same result would simply make more sense given the players involved.

 

[Bocabear]

Hopefully it’s completely torn down and rebuilt from scratch. To say that it’s showing it’s age is an understatement.

Just look at Tron right next door.

yes just look at it..... It's the shortest ride in the park.
I think the Tron ride is fine...it would have been nice with it's own sort of miniland to expand the setting and give it a little bot of a storyline... or something... It just feels like a misplaced item... nothing about it feels grounded in it's location...

 

[Coaster Lover]

While other manufacturers are working on single rail coasters, RMC is the only one that has installed more than one.

Intamin has two operating with a third on the way...