Miceage Update 12/1/2015

[Phroobar]

LOL. Okay, please, I'm sincerely asking why you hate Frozen so much. Set aside the hype and the ridiculous overuse of "Let it Go" in every show and parade in the parks. Set aside the Maelstrom thing--that's not the movie's fault. I'm just curious as to why some people actually despise the film. Not just "don't care for it," but actually hate it and get angry about it.

From my point of view, it was a lot of fun and a very solid film. The characters were likable, and one--Sven--was wonderful. One of the songs was great, three were good, two were meh, one was atrocious. (Spoilers) It's a movie with two princesses where NO ONE gets married at the end. That's awesome. It had a great, unexpected plot twist that pulled the rug out from under the Prince Charming stereotype.

My only real complaint about Frozen (the film) is that it has no real visual style--it looks about as generic "Disney" as you can get. Oh, and the story does not stand up to any kind of close inspection, but that's true of Snow White, Pinocchio, Dumbo, Cinderella, Jungle Book, Tangled and many more. Within the context of a fast-paced animated fairy tale, it works.

Believe me, I can't stand being surrounded by 20,000 people singing "Let it Go," a great song which has unfortunately become the responsibility-shirking teenage self-pity anthem for a whole generation. But how does this sweet, funny little fairy tale deserve to be hated so much? To the point where you "Wish it had never happened?" What? Really?

It's a band wagon thing. It's cool to hate everything Disney has done in your lifetime and wish for a time you never experienced. At the same time frequent the parks all the time and spend money there but still hate it all. Grumpy cat-syndrome.

 

[SSG]

It's not silly at all. You probably don't understand the Richard Scarry reference, but Zootopia has unlimited potential if they build out other characters while Frozen is self-contained to a sequel or two. I wasn't suggesting they drop Zoo on top of Fantasyland village, it was an example of other things they could do besides Frozen. Also, Frozen is not even 3 years old, and yes it's over saturated, whether you love it or not, that's many people's feelings. They also just opened a Broadway Frozen show at DCA if you haven't head.

To be fair over-saturated is in the eye of the beholder. I agree that there is way too much Frozen stuff in the parks, but that is because I don’t like Frozen and would be happy if it went to zero profile. A lot of people think Star Wars is overdone in the parks. I don’t because I mostly like the Star Wars offerings.

 

[Phroobar]

People use to say there is too much Little Mermaid in the parks. She is in every parade, water show, fireworks show, m&g and has her own ride. Frozen just dethroned her.

 

[Andrew C]

People use to say there is too much Little Mermaid in the parks. She is in every parade, water show, fireworks show, m&g and has her own ride. Frozen just dethroned her.

Where does Frozen (Anna and Elsa) appear independently from other characters? the ride in EPCOT at WDW, the sing-a-long at both resorts, and a M&G at both resorts...am I missing anything?

 

[Rich T]

I don't think I hate Frozen, I mainly hate the hype. It was mediocre, at best.

What really annoyed me were the critics. Someone, somewhere, gave the opinion that Frozen was the best Disney animated feature since The Lion King, which is COMICAL. I can think of multiple films that were released during that 20-year period that were better than Frozen. Tarzan, Mulan, Huncback of Notre Dame, Tangled, The Princess and the Frog...come on now.

I was not impressed with Frozen's music at all. The only song I enjoy from that film is "Reindeer(s) are Better than People," or whatever it's called, and it's probably not even a minute long. I knew Hans was a villain from the moment he appeared on the screen. The previews had pretty much established Kristoff was Anna's love interest. Two serious love interests? I couldn't see that happening. Speaking of Anna, I find her annoying. I was much more interested in Elsa, and the writers refused to give her a backstory or enough screen time in general. Olaf is annoying, Hans is annoying and makes a terrible villain, the trolls, eh.

Everyone likes to mention Anna and Elsa's bond and how they're each other's true love and all that. I found Lilo and Stitch tackled the theme of sisterhood much better than Frozen, as Lilo and Nani actually struggled and suffered through real-life issues.

Frozen is not good, but because it made so much money, we get to see it pop up everywhere. Yay.

Okay, thank you. I think Frozen's a much better film that you do (I'd put it above Mulan, Hunchback (mostly great films hampered by out-of-place comic relief) Tangled (I CAN"T STAND the Snugly Duckling gang but Maximus is the best thing ever), or Princess and Frog (love it but the villain's scheme is way too complicated), but that's my personal taste. Your reasons make sense and all the films you mentioned are excellent.

Olaf made me laugh. The trolls were awful--possibly my least favorite element in any Disney animated film ever. I agree the reindeer song was the best one in the film, but you have to admit "Let it Go" is one of the most perfect pop songs ever written. (And "Fixer Upper" is one of the worst things I've ever heard.)

Bad films don't make tons of money (except for Twilight films)...at least not past the opening weekend. Word of mouth is everything. Frozen really hit home for a lot of people. I do wish Disney would give "Let it Go" a rest for a while (along with "Under the Sea" which should have been given a rest twenty years ago), but what ya gonna do?

 

[Californian Elitist]

Where does Frozen (Anna and Elsa) appear independently from other characters? the ride in EPCOT at WDW, the sing-a-long at both resorts, and a M&G at both resorts...am I missing anything?

Yes.

The musical at DCA.

Let's count the integrated Frozen offerings.

1. Arendelle in Storybook

2. Main Street window

3. A float in Paint the Night

4. All of "Let it Go" in WoC: Celebrate, which doesn't make sense

5. Frozen segment in Forever

TOO MUCH.

 

[Andrew C]

Yes.

The musical at DCA.

Let's count the integrated Frozen offerings.

1. Arendelle in Storybook

2. Main Street window

3. A float in Paint the Night

4. All of "Let it Go" in WoC: Celebrate, which doesn't make sense

5. Frozen segment in Forever

TOO MUCH.

hmmm....I don't see that as much more than any other of the classic Disney princesses have received over the years...

 

[Rich T]

Yes.

The musical at DCA.

Let's count the integrated Frozen offerings.

1. Arendelle in Storybook

2. Main Street window

3. A float in Paint the Night

4. All of "Let it Go" in WoC: Celebrate, which doesn't make sense

5. Frozen segment in Forever

TOO MUCH.

I agree. I like the film, but among points 3, 4 & 5... two of 'em should go. I'd keep the float ('cause all floats are awesome just by the virtue of being floats) and ax Let it Go from the Fireworks and WoC.

 

[Californian Elitist]

hmmm....I don't see that as much more than any other of the classic Disney princesses have received over the years...

Frozen currently has more representation than the majority of the other Disney princesses. I don't recall Mulan, Jasmine, Pocahontas, Merida, etc. having this much representation at one time at the DLR.

 

[Andrew C]

Frozen currently has more representation than the majority of the other Disney princesses. I don't recall Mulan, Jasmine, Pocahontas, Merida, etc. having this much representation at one point at the DLR.

Because all of those princess (with maybe the exception of Jasmine, although she really wasn't the lead in her movie) didn't come close to the popularity of Frozen's two princesses. I understand you don't see it...but that is the bottom line.

 

[Californian Elitist]

I agree. I like the film, but among points 3, 4 & 5... two of 'em should go. I'd keep the float ('cause all floats are awesome just by the virtue of being floats) and ax Let it Go from the Fireworks and WoC.

Agreed. All of "Let it Go" in WOC: Celebrate is absurd.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Because all of those princess (with maybe the exception of Jasmine, although she really wasn't the lead in her movie) didn't come close to the popularity of Frozen's two princesses. I understand you don't see it...but that is the bottom line.

That's not what you said. You said all of the other Disney princesses have gotten the same amount of exposure over the years, which is most-likely false.

I see it.

 

[Andrew C]

That's not what you said. You said all of the other Disney princesses have gotten the same amount of exposure over the years, which is most-likely false.

I see it.

Reread what I wrote...I said classic princesses. But it is fine...you see overexposure...I don't.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Okay, thank you. I think Frozen's a much better film that you do (I'd put it above Mulan, Hunchback (mostly great films hampered by out-of-place comic relief) Tangled (I CAN"T STAND the Snugly Duckling gang but Maximus is the best thing ever), or Princess and Frog (love it but the villain's scheme is way too complicated), but that's my personal taste. Your reasons make sense and all the films you mentioned are excellent.

Olaf made me laugh. The trolls were awful--possibly my least favorite element in any Disney animated film ever. I agree the reindeer song was the best one in the film, but you have to admit "Let it Go" is one of the most perfect pop songs ever written. (And "Fixer Upper" is one of the worst things I've ever heard.)

Bad films don't make tons of money (except for Twilight films)...at least not past the opening weekend. Word of mouth is everything. Frozen really hit home for a lot of people. I do wish Disney would give "Let it Go" a rest for a while (along with "Under the Sea" which should have been given a rest twenty years ago), but what ya gonna do?

I also dislike the Snugly Duckling scene, but not as much as the "Fixer Upper" scene, which is unbearable.

I didn't mind the trolls as characters, though they kind of came out of nowhere. But that darn song is so terrible that is kind of overshadows that.

The Little Mermaid is another one, though I actually like that movie (hate Ariel, though). Disney suddenly decided to put Ariel/TLM everywhere.

 

[Phroobar]

Where does Frozen (Anna and Elsa) appear independently from other characters? the ride in EPCOT at WDW, the sing-a-long at both resorts, and a M&G at both resorts...am I missing anything?

They also appear in Disneyland Forever fireworks show, Paint the Night parade, World of Color Celebrate, Frozen section in the animation building. Granted there are other characters in those shows but that is still a lot of Frozen.

 

[BrianLo]

You probably don't understand the Richard Scarry reference

(sic)

They also just opened a Broadway Frozen show at DCA if you haven't head.

Thanks for patronizing me twice. I even referenced the DCA show in the comment you quoted. I weirdly have been involved in halloween dress up in my adult life for Richard Scarry... Bunnies on a bus was the analogy for hemoglobin and respiratory physiology... don't ask.

I'm fairly neutral to Frozen all around, but there is a funny backlash where people (largely not of Frozen's demographic) absolutely despise the thing and hope for its demise.

That's what I was alluding to. Every time someone goes on about how Frozen will disappear at any moment into the nether I chalk it up to their personal vendetta against the film rather than sound logic. It's the social movement when something becomes too big, it is cool, and socially normative to begin hating it. People feel the need to balance the scales I guess. We've seen it happen with TFA too. They gave fans exactly what they were begging for, they loved it out of the gate, then it did too well and the bandwagoning begins.

I personally would love to see more done in the Zootopia universe, but I'm not letting my subjective feelings cloud the fact Frozen is currently and likely will continue to be the bigger franchise.

@GiveMeTheMusic had a great post about it a while ago.

 

[Deleted member 107043]

I never thought Walt Disney's Snow White and The Seven Dwarfs was a particularly good movie, yet according the Guiness Book of World Records the 1937 film has grossed $1,633,582,523, adjusted for inflation. *shrugs*

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

Bottom line is this.

In a Chapek/Iger world, big budget attractions can get greenlit for franchises that mint money. Not just at the box office, that's not enough. Frozen is a merch brand that rivals Disney's house of 11 princesses. Notice how Anna and Elsa have remained separate - they make more money on their own.

When Zootopia starts moving billions in merch, you can bet it will get its own expansion. That hasn't happened yet.

Chapek and Iger don't view themed entertainment as its own medium with its own merits, as @lazyboy97o has pointed out several times. The parks exist to support franchises now. So whenever someone whines about Zootopia and Big Hero 6 aren't getting theme park attractions/expansions, remind them of how Disney works in 2016.

On top of minting money in stores, the public genuinely likes Frozen. It's the Lion King hit of this generation, even bigger. An Arendelle expansion is a no brainer, even for the imagination-free leaders of the Walt Disney Company.

 

[Mike S]

Thanks for patronizing me twice. I even referenced the DCA show in the comment you quoted. I weirdly have been involved in halloween dress up in my adult life for Richard Scarry... Bunnies on a bus was the analogy for hemoglobin and respiratory physiology... don't ask.

I'm fairly neutral to Frozen all around, but there is a funny backlash where people (largely not of Frozen's demographic) absolutely despise the thing and hope for its demise.

That's what I was alluding to. Every time someone goes on about how Frozen will disappear at any moment into the nether I chalk it up to their personal vendetta against the film rather than sound logic. It's the social movement when something becomes too big, it is cool, and socially normative to begin hating it. People feel the need to balance the scales I guess. We've seen it happen with TFA too. They gave fans exactly what they were begging for, they loved it out of the gate, then it did too well and the bandwagoning begins.

I personally would love to see more done in the Zootopia universe, but I'm not letting my subjective feelings cloud the fact Frozen is currently and likely will continue to be the bigger franchise.

@GiveMeTheMusic had a great post about it a while ago.

I'm just happy we're getting more Wreck-It Ralph

Bottom line is this.

In a Chapek/Iger world, big budget attractions can get greenlit for franchises that mint money. Not just at the box office, that's not enough. Frozen is a merch brand that rivals Disney's house of 11 princesses. Notice how Anna and Elsa have remained separate - they make more money on their own.

When Zootopia starts moving billions in merch, you can bet it will get its own expansion. That hasn't happened yet.

Chapek and Iger don't view themed entertainment as its own medium with its own merits, as @lazyboy97o has pointed out several times. The parks exist to support franchises now. So whenever someone whines about Zootopia and Big Hero 6 aren't getting theme park attractions/expansions, remind them of how Disney works in 2016.

On top of minting money in stores, the public genuinely likes Frozen. It's the Lion King hit of this generation, even bigger. An Arendelle expansion is a no brainer, even for the imagination-free leaders of the Walt Disney Company.

With this logic it proves even more how much of a knee jerk reaction Avatar was. The land will undoubtedly be great but the movie didn't really move much merchandise AFAIK.

 

[BrianLo]

With this logic it proves even more how much of a knee jerk reaction Avatar was. The land will undoubtedly be great but the movie didn't really move much merchandise AFAIK.

WDW in particular has been one long line of ill timed moves after the next. Fantasyland was redone moments before their first out and out fairytale hit in years. Avatar was scooped up as an answer to Potter just before Disney snatched up Lucasfilm. Jungle Book hits big and Animal Kingdom is solidly dead last in order of needing a new attraction.

It's hard to remember that in 2011 Disney was still mostly floundering around at the box office.

It's no wonder Epcot is left holding the bag these days.