Miceage 12/5 Kevin Yee:Declining by Degrees

[culturenthrills]

Miceage 12/5 Kevin Yee: Declining by Degrees

http://www.miceage.com/kevinyee/ky120506a.htm

I don't know if you have read Kevin's latest article but I think he really puts into words what is going wrong with WDW while also mentioning things they are doing right.

Al's recent article on his visit to Walt Disney World sparked a lot of discussion on MiceChat and in emails. I did some soul-searching as a result. Have I been too "easy" on Disney World? Not really—I shared pretty much all of Al's beliefs in the staleness of parts of Disney World, and have said so from time to time. But I don't point them out week after week. My first mental protestations were that it would make for boring reading online to read the same thing over and over. What I've realized is that I was missing a metaphor, a way to symbolically capture what's been going wrong at parts of Disney World, even while other things are progressing swimmingly.
Then it hit me. There was a PBS special on higher education in 2005 called "Declining by Degrees." The pun about diplomas aside, the point was that expectations from professors were decreasing steadily over time, as a consumer-mentality begins to dominate the entire educational spectrum, and "grade inflation" becomes increasingly common. I see a lot of parallels to the modern era at Disney World. Tourists, by far the largest type of visitor to the Orlando parks, have been subjected to a steadily decreasing emphasis on excellence from Disney for some time.

I think that Declining by degrees in my opinion really describes what has been going on at WDW. I hope he really keeps up with what he says about putting a more critical eye. WDW has really lacked from having someone in the Disney website community pointing out the serious problems going on with the parks. While he may not be Al Lutz a spotlight really needs to be pointed at WDW to point out the things that are wrong but at the same time praise Disney when they get it right.

 

[Empress Room]

Miceage 12/5 Kevin Yee: Declining by Degrees

http://www.miceage.com/kevinyee/ky120506a.htm

I don't know if you have read Kevin's latest article but I think he really puts into words what is going wrong with WDW while also mentioning things they are doing right.



I think that Declining by degrees in my opinion really describes what has been going on at WDW. I hope he really keeps up with what he says about putting a more critical eye. WDW has really lacked from having someone in the Disney website community pointing out the serious problems going on with the parks. While he may not be Al Lutz a spotlight really needs to be pointed at WDW to point out the things that are wrong but at the same time praise Disney when they get it right.

Before supporting or advocating either Al Lutz or Kevin Yee's observations, I would suggest that you do a little research on the types and kinds of articles each has written over the recent past (particularly the former). They clearly have an agenda and, some theorize, dislike Disney and are motivated by this dislike. Kevin, IMHO, is disingenuous. He authors the above "Declining By Degrees" article while at the same time pushing the sale of his very friendly, happy and pro-Disney books in the same blog.

Anyone who frequents Disney's theme parks (or these types of message boards for that matter) want the best for Disney and clearly, like all other companies, there is room for improvement. I'm just afraid that the very negative slant that each of those authors use paints WDW in a very unfavorable and very unfair light.

 

[joel_maxwell]

yey, i read it yesterday.... i guess i agree with some of it. on the other hand, i think some of the issues (photo and caption) are a bit picky that 90% of the average guest would never notice.

his observation of the Innovations booths are accurate in a way, but IMHO, what else are you going to bring in there. I think that it (as a concept all together) is outdated since technology advances to fast to sustain interest. plus, with the new generation, the new technologies that would interest them are on the shelves at Best Buys etc etc.

the churros cart is disturbing. that thing is ugly. it is themed to match a state fair vendor.

 

[wannab@dis]

There's always been a few that are picking out small problems and putting a magnifying glass on them. But, overall, most people will finally see that those that do cannot see the forrest for the trees. They are not able to see the magic around them because they focus so intently on problematic minutia.

We had someone like that around here for a while... he even started his own site and actually put together a following. It just didn't take long to go away because they just couldn't get past a few faults. Many Disney fans see more than a burned out bulb or some chipped paint and they tire quickly of those that want to dwell only on the negatives.

Unfortunately, it seems to be a growing fad to once again look at the negatives and focus only on a few problems. We've got prominent posters that haven't written a positive post in a long time. Guess they've grown bored again since the glory days of Eisner bashing and they need something else to complain about.

Of course, for extra reading, you should take a look at another article. I'm far from a fan of Jim Hill... but he really nails the spirit of the internet Disney fanboys... :lol:

 

[joel_maxwell]

Before supporting or advocating either Al Lutz or Kevin Yee's observations, I would suggest that you do a little research on the types and kinds of articles each has written over the recent past (particularly the former). They clearly have an agenda and, some theorize, dislike Disney and are motivated by this dislike. Kevin, IMHO, is disingenuous. He authors the above "Declining By Degrees" article while at the same time pushing the sale of his very friendly, happy and pro-Disney books in the same blog.

:lol: that has always made me laugh when his books are posted for sale at the end of his rants.

EDIT: maybe if mr yee would read WDWMAGIC then he would know what the clearing is for around Asia.

 

[wannab@dis]

:lol: that has always made me laugh when his books are posted for sale at the end of his rants.

The rants sell for some people. Look at MiceAge or Jim Hill Media and they are pushing their wares and popping advertisements as fast as they can. The "bash Disney" fad is running high right now and it will get them a few more page views and ad impressions.

 

[joel_maxwell]

The rants sell for some people. Look at MiceAge or Jim Hill Media and they are pushing their wares and popping advertisements as fast as they can. The "bash Disney" fad is running high right now and it will get them a few more page views and ad impressions.

well, not too take anything away from photoginit and suggest that he is this way, but perfect example since this article was picked out. Maliciously? i dont think so. probably just thought it was an interesting view, but none the less, it was quoted.

 

[Empress Room]

We had someone like that around here for a while... he even started his own site and actually put together a following. It just didn't take long to go away because they just couldn't get past a few faults.

Ah, who could forget the great critique of The Land rehab, complete with voluminous pictures of "the stale use of stainless steel?"

BTW, whatever happened to that website? ;-)

 

[Bravesfn1]

Before supporting or advocating either Al Lutz or Kevin Yee's observations, I would suggest that you do a little research on the types and kinds of articles each has written over the recent past (particularly the former). They clearly have an agenda and, some theorize, dislike Disney and are motivated by this dislike. Kevin, IMHO, is disingenuous. He authors the above "Declining By Degrees" article while at the same time pushing the sale of his very friendly, happy and pro-Disney books in the same blog.

Anyone who frequents Disney's theme parks (or these types of message boards for that matter) want the best for Disney and clearly, like all other companies, there is room for improvement. I'm just afraid that the very negative slant that each of those authors use paints WDW in a very unfavorable and very unfair light.

I totally disagree with your assesment on the miceage writers, and I regularly read their articles. I don't always agree with them, but most of the time they make fairly good points.

 

[joel_maxwell]

Ah, who could forget the great critique of The Land rehab, complete with voluminous pictures of "the stale use of stainless steel?"

BTW, whatever happened to that website? ;-)

hmmm, i guess they pulled the troops out.

 

[Empress Room]

I totally disagree with your assesment on the miceage writers, and I regularly read their articles. I don't always agree with them, but most of the time they make fairly good points.

I'm not sure I gave an "assesment (sic) [of] the miceage writers." I pointed out that *some* believe that each dislikes Disney and are therefore motivated by that dislike. I didn't say that I necessarily reached that same conclusion, hence my urging to research their articles for oneself.

I do stand behind my statement that Kevin Yee's decision to author negative articles about Disney in his blog immediately followed by promotions for his own pro-Disney books is disingenuous at best and thrwarts his credibility as a writer. IMHO, Kevin simply cannot have it both ways and, after reading several of his warm and fuzzy creations, it's apparent to me that he is trying to do so.

 

[wannab@dis]

I do stand behind my statement that Kevin Yee's decision to author negative articles about Disney in his blog immediately followed by promotions for his own pro-Disney books is disingenuous at best and thrwarts his credibility as a writer. IMHO, Kevin simply cannot have it both ways and, after reading several of his warm and fuzzy creations, it's apparent to me that he is trying to do so.

Of course... The biggest thread on their forum is from the massively negative article that Lutz wrote. He saw the popularity and traffic that Lutz' article garnered, saw a chance at some publicity for his wares and jumped in with both feet.

 

[Empress Room]

Of course... The biggest thread on their forum is from the massively negative article that Lutz wrote. He saw the popularity and traffic that Lutz' article garnered, saw a chance at some publicity for his wares and jumped in with both feet.

Trying to make rational counter-arguments to the negative articles on that board typically results in a frenzied attack against any such rationality, as I've learned...

 

[culturenthrills]

There's always been a few that are picking out small problems and putting a magnifying glass on them. But, overall, most people will finally see that those that do cannot see the forrest for the trees. They are not able to see the magic around them because they focus so intently on problematic minutia.

We had someone like that around here for a while... he even started his own site and actually put together a following. It just didn't take long to go away because they just couldn't get past a few faults. Many Disney fans see more than a burned out bulb or some chipped paint and they tire quickly of those that want to dwell only on the negatives.

Unfortunately, it seems to be a growing fad to once again look at the negatives and focus only on a few problems. We've got prominent posters that haven't written a positive post in a long time. Guess they've grown bored again since the glory days of Eisner bashing and they need something else to complain about.

Of course, for extra reading, you should take a look at another article. I'm far from a fan of Jim Hill... but he really nails the spirit of the internet Disney fanboys... :lol:

Why is it that when anyone points out the problems at WDW they are being negative. I love WDW but I don't look at Disney as some kind of can do no wrong "figure". I think they do alot of things right but I know I am not the only one who has noticed the chipping away of many things over the years at WDW. Yes, it is great that WDW gets new attractions pretty much every year but how about taking care of the older attractions like HM and Space Mt. And it is not just us fanboys who notice these things. My mom goes to WDW about every 2 years and even she has noticed how the unthemed ODV carts have started popping up everywhere and that they are ugly. The fact that I enjoy WDW so much as why I would like it to be kept up to the standards Disney used to have. Many of my friends out in CA saw the slow decline of DL in the 90's and I don't want that to happen to the MK out here.

 

[T-i-doubleguher]

"Declining By Degrees"? I think not.

Yes, I also saw this article yesterday on MiceAge.

I know that maybe that looking through a perceptive and sharp eye may reveal Disney's flaws, but when I go to a Disney Park, I don't look at it like,"OMG, the churro carts are not themed!Lets rant!" I try to think of it as how lucky we are in the U.S to have a beautiful park like the Magic Kingdom, or any others belonging to Disney. If you have that much of a problem with Disney, don't go. I think these writers compare WDW way to much with Disneyland, though it's to be expected. I am not an authority by any stature on the subject, but the parts were made to enjoy, not to scrutinize, and maybe I'm just being a little igorant of how Disney is "Declining in Degrees", but if you can't be impressed at Walt Disney World, or even appreciate it, then

A. You aren't a good judge of a theme park.
or
B. You visit these parks WAY to often.

Just my two cents.

 

[Empress Room]

Why is it that when anyone points out the problems at WDW they are being negative. I love WDW but I don't look at Disney as some kind of can do no wrong "figure". I think they do alot of things right but I know I am not the only one who has noticed the chipping away of many things over the years at WDW. Yes, it is great that WDW gets new attractions pretty much every year but how about taking care of the older attractions like HM and Space Mt. And it is not just us fanboys who notice these things. My mom goes to WDW about every 2 years and even she has noticed how the unthemed ODV carts have started popping up everywhere and that they are ugly. The fact that I enjoy WDW so much as why I would like it to be kept up to the standards Disney used to have. Many of my friends out in CA saw the slow decline of DL in the 90's and I don't want that to happen to the MK out here.

I, for one, certainly agree that Disney, like all businesses, has room for improvement and certainly have personally observed things that I consider negative or less than stellar. (There is nothing wrong about a dialogue concerning the parks' room for improvement -- e.g. my past narrative on the unused pavillions at Epcot, upstairs at Imagination and (until recently) WOL.)The problem, as I see it, is committing the discussion of those flaws into a very negative article that belittles WDW to the level of one's local Six Flags or otherwise may disway a newbie from visiting one of the most amazing and wonderful places imaginable - particularly when the author(s) appears hypocritical and otherwise profits from the very place he finds so unappealing.

 

[IWalt]

Kevin Cry

I, for one, certainly agree that Disney, like all businesses, has room for improvement and certainly have personally observed things that I consider negative or less than stellar. (There is nothing wrong about a dialogue concerning the parks' room for improvement -- e.g. my past narrative on the unused pavillions at Epcot, upstairs at Imagination and (until recently) WOL.)The problem, as I see it, is committing the discussion of those flaws into a very negative article that belittles WDW to the level of one's local Six Flags or otherwise may disway a newbie from visiting one of the most amazing and wonderful places imaginable - particularly when the author(s) appears hypocritical and otherwise profits from the very place he finds so unappealing.

I can't agree more. Why is Kevin crying?

 

[joel_maxwell]

I, for one, certainly agree that Disney, like all businesses, has room for improvement and certainly have personally observed things that I consider negative or less than stellar. (There is nothing wrong about a dialogue concerning the parks' room for improvement -- e.g. my past narrative on the unused pavillions at Epcot, upstairs at Imagination and (until recently) WOL.)The problem, as I see it, is committing the discussion of those flaws into a very negative article that belittles WDW to the level of one's local Six Flags or otherwise may disway a newbie from visiting one of the most amazing and wonderful places imaginable - particularly when the author(s) appears hypocritical and otherwise profits from the very place he finds so unappealing.

nicely put

i think that we are all guilty at times of looking through a tunnel at the situation but if you step back.... a unthemed churro cart isnt the end of the world and isnt going to make my vacation undesirable..... i would just like to not see things that remind me of the Alabama State Fair grounds in Ensley. that is a trip in its own right.

 

[Madison]

I do stand behind my statement that Kevin Yee's decision to author negative articles about Disney in his blog immediately followed by promotions for his own pro-Disney books is disingenuous at best and thrwarts his credibility as a writer. IMHO, Kevin simply cannot have it both ways and, after reading several of his warm and fuzzy creations, it's apparent to me that he is trying to do so.

I've been saying this for quite some time.

Consider that, if Kevin were not writing articles that talked quite so much about how the parks have fallen into disrepair or how the standards have dropped, there'd be no incentive for his readers to buy books he's written about how things used to be in "the good old days." He sets an expectation of diminished quality among his readers and then profits from their nostalgia.

Of course, that all assumes that he's actually sold some of those books. I'd not be too surprised to learn that sales haven't exactly been brisk.

 

[jedimaster1227]

We had someone like that around here for a while... he even started his own site and actually put together a following. It just didn't take long to go away because they just couldn't get past a few faults.

Oddly enough...I remember that! What was his name again? :lookaroun

Of course, for extra reading, you should take a look at another article. I'm far from a fan of Jim Hill... but he really nails the spirit of the internet Disney fanboys... :lol:

Again...Anyone on here could be considered an "internet Disney fanboy." Were you hurt by his article?


Anyways, now that my playful rant is over here comes my more serious statement:

Kevin Yee, Al Lutz and Jim Hill run websites that express their opinions about Disney. Thus, by them running their own websites, they have the right to share their opinions on their sites. I do find it so interesting how some people can worship a website's (or a company's) leader until they do something that they do not like- but then again, this goes back to the whole Eisner conspiracy theory again...

I have said it before and I will say it again- Disney is something that is supposed to make people happy. If you aren't happy with Disney, then you need to figure out a way to look for something more positive, because negativity ruins the Disney Magic for you, myself and all others that come in contact with this negativity. Disney shouldn't be something that makes people unhappy...