News Magic Kingdom July 2020 reopening reports

[Touchdown]

I love your idea of a digital version of the legacy fastpass. That has long been my idea but I never knew who to really put it in to words. I think one of the biggest problems with FP+ is that you can make them when you aren't even in the park. How many passholders or guests back at their resort make FP and then never use them! So not only are you dealing with the actual park crowd you are dealing with park crowd plus whoever wants to make a FP.

If they use the DL model then you can still make reservations when not in the park, provided you were there earlier, also you can boom DCA passes in DL and visa versa (but you can only book one pass in either park per time slot.)

 

[disneyworlddad]

If they use the DL model then you can still make reservations when not in the park, provided you were there earlier, also you can boom DCA passes in DL and visa versa (but you can only book one pass in either park per time slot.)

DL is a little different. I'd be ok their with booking passes in both parks since you can literally walk from one to the other. I think you still need to get rid of making reservations when you aren't in the park. Dont know if it will ever happen since this is a huge (value add) to booking on resort is you have better access. They don't want to take away that extra value.

 

[Touchdown]

DL is a little different. I'd be ok their with booking passes in both parks since you can literally walk from one to the other. I think you still need to get rid of making reservations when you aren't in the park. Dont know if it will ever happen since this is a huge (value add) to booking on resort is you have better access. They don't want to take away that extra value.

It also makes hopping pointless. If I want to hang around in early afternoon at MK doing things like CBJ, CoP, TTA before going to DHS that evening I should have the option to book a 5pm ToT FP at noon if I want to.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I have 2 neck gaiters, 1 with a filter, 1 without. I won't wear the non-filter one in public right now because it doesn't do anything. They both look basically identical from out the outside.

I don’t know what the official policy is, but the gaiters with filters and has no aggressive graphics should be allowed in my opinion. But how can you tell if the filter is there? If a “mask inspection” procedure would start, that would cause chaos.

 

[lilypgirl]

No gaiters of any kind are allowed now, ear loop or otherwise.

Has Disney put out anything more official about that? Is there a link to this new directive?

 

[disneyworlddad]

It also makes hopping pointless. If I want to hang around in early afternoon at MK doing things like CBJ, CoP, TTA before going to DHS that evening I should have the option to book a 5pm ToT FP at noon if I want to.

I can see that. And I can could agree to that. I still think having people who aren't in a park and maybe dont intend to be making FP is a bad idea. How many locals snag afternoon/evening FP thinking they can go and then don't and never cancel them or cancel them last minute. IT be interesting to know how many FP go unused, rebooked, etc. But maybe we should discontinue this talk here and let it get back on to about reopening.

 

[BlackCauldron]

Has Disney put out anything more official about that? Is there a link to this new directive?

As of yet, no. I am only seeing the same guidelines - close fitting, ties or ear loops, etc. But I am also seeing multiple reports across livestreams and opening blogs that cast members are asking people with gaiters to swap them out for masks.

 

[disneygeek90]

Current waits at 12:15-

 

[Mainahman]

Current waits at 12:15-
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WOW! hope this trend continues! We can ride everything many many times in a day, let alone the 2 days we have planned for MK.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Everyone just needs to accept that and not be yet another entitled guest that tries to push against the rules.

Questioning a policy is not entitled or pushing back.

The neck gaiters are being accepted pretty much everywhere as a “face covering” aren’t they? This isn’t some rebelious “i won’t wear a mask” thing. The hipster baristas at my coffee shop - who are all for masks, social distancing, safety, etc. have the neck gaiters.

I’m personally guessing it has to do with on-ride safety - that’s why they were allowed at Disney springs.

 

[Purduevian]

I don’t know what the official policy is, but the gaiters with filters and has no aggressive graphics should be allowed in my opinion. But how can you tell if the filter is there? If a “mask inspection” procedure would start, that would cause chaos.

Mask inspections would be a nightmare. I think Disney is doing the Simple and Easy thing by just making it gaiters not allowed, however I do think they should put out an official statement saying such so no one comes to the park with a gaiter only.

 

[Mainahman]

days until were packing.

till im arriving for a cocktail by the pool at our resort after a long 11 hour drive.

 

[donsullivan]

Mask inspections would be a nightmare. I think Disney is doing the Simple and Easy thing by just making it gaiters not allowed, however I do think they should put out an official statement saying such so no one comes to the park with a gaiter only.

The problem with doing that is the minute they publish anything that says 'except xxxx', the same people will read the precise wording of that and find some other variation like a scarf wrapped around their face or a really long turtleneck t-shirt that then needs to be added the list. It would be an endless nightmare. Then they get caught in the well "you didn't say that was excluded" silliness.

Just wear a mask as they ask people and all will be fine.

 

[donsullivan]

Sounds like normal labor negotiations to me.

Yeah, They are using the locked-out language when they (the union) actually said they don't want to go back to work under the current protocols.

 

[brettf22]

I don’t know what the official policy is, but the gaiters with filters and has no aggressive graphics should be allowed in my opinion. But how can you tell if the filter is there? If a “mask inspection” procedure would start, that would cause chaos.

As others have speculated, I'm guessing it's a physical safety thing, i.e. a gaiter getting caught on something and causing a choking issue. I doubt it is a material issue since they do not specify the type of material an over-the-ear mask must be made out of. I could take a gaiter, cut the material into the shape of a small mask, add ear loops, and it would be acceptable, even though it is still made out of the same material and provides the same protection as an unmodified gaiter.

 

[DDLand]

This is an excellent write-up and I'm grateful for it.

However, since it was mentioned twice in the article and repeated by a forum user as part of the forum orthodoxy that FP+ is the cause of long lines, I'm going to go ahead and address this.

I've been to MK during those days of old in the Fall when it was 'dead' and, there was still FP+. And there weren't long lines on all the attractions. Why? Because it was dead. Except for the few headliners that always have a line, the FP line was no faster than the standby... because it was dead. FP+ didn't magically create backed-up lines, because there weren't enough people to fill backed-up lines.

Now, jump to a now typical day when the MK is getting twice the number of people it was designed for. Lines everywhere. And not because of FP, but because there's twice the number of people the park is designed for. The Peoplemover, which has no FP attached to it and has one of the highest throughputs of People per Hour winds up with an hour long wait. And that's because the park is past its tipping point.

You can sneer at spreadsheets, @tirian, but that's data. It's information. You can't hold an opinion that ignores or runs counter to actual reality. The attractions can only throughput a limited number of people. That's a hard fact that can be represented in a spreadsheet. And if you have more people in the park wanting to go on those attractions, you've passed a tipping point and lines will form and grow longer and longer.

The lengthening of lines everywhere happened at the same time the attendance kept climbing and FP+ was introduced. I don't know why or how anyone would blame the lines on FP+ rather than on the obvious reason: A ton more people in the parks.

When Smuggler's Run lost its FP+ line, it wound up with the same hour-long waits at the other headliners in DHS. Why? More people in DHS than it was designed for (thanks to RotR and then MMRR). People were excited to see Smuggler's FP coming to an end and they proclaimed, "NOW we'll see what happens when you take away FP!!" Nothing happened except continued long lines. And yet, the blind faith and orthodoxy of the boards is that long lines are attributed to FP and not to... you know... huge and packed crowds.

The article mentions over and over how there's hardly anyone in the park, but then attributes no lines not to the lack of people, but to the lack of FP+. Meanwhile, the article is delighted there are no crowds and lines at the eateries, but attributes that to... lack of people. How does a low crowd become the reason there are no lines at the eateries, but it is not the reason there are no lines at the rides?

I know that FP isn't perfect in the way it distributes its 'cut the line' perk. But on crowded days, it just shifts people in the long lines, it doesn't cause long lines. This forum orthodoxy regarding FP+'s ability to create lines has no logic to it. But let's say it did... If there was FP+ enabled yesterday, who thinks we'd be seeing 30 minute or more lines at the majority of the attractions?

You’re boiling down the legitimate complaints about FastPass into a stupid caricature. A couple points...
1) Lines are important for capacity. If things are crowded it seems intuitive to open new rides to alleviate crowding. But there’s a catch. Especially today, rides are relatively short with most under 5 minutes. That means a typical ride will only be able to hold a handful of guests at any given moment. So Disney ends up spending 100s of millions without meaningfully improving capacity. The REAL capacity improvements come from queue space. Queues can hold several thousand people in immersive places that are cheaper than an actual ride. An extra minute of rollercoaster is extremely expensive, whereas an extra 10 feet of queue is relatively affordable.
2) FastPass empties out queues. This forces guests back out into walkways. FastPass doesn’t let you “skip the line” instead it just changes the place where you wait. This sucks for guests and for Disney. Guests now get to walk through jam packed walkways and Disney has crowding concerns. Instead of improving capacity, it simply ends up dumping more people onto walkways making the parks more unbearable.
3) It means people don’t get to ride the attractions they want. Think of theme parks like a market. Your time at a theme park is your money. You can buy different experience at a theme park with your time. If a ride is worth two hours of your time, then you’ll be willing to wait that long. If a ride is worth less, then you won’t wait that long. The most popular rides will inevitably have higher waits. This is exactly how it should be, but FastPass distorts this. Suppose there are two guests called Jim and Jill. Jim loves Space Mountain and is willing to wait two hours for the ride. Jill only sort of likes Space Mountain and would wait no more than 30 minutes. In a typical theme park, Jim would ride Space Mountain while Jill wouldn’t. The person who wants the attraction more would get the attraction. This optimizes happiness. FP+ distorts this optimized status by throwing in availability of FPs. Suppose Jill was staying on property and was able to get some Space Mountain FPs whereas Jim was staying off property and was unable to get FPs. Suddenly Jill is able to ride Space Mountain even though she doesn’t really like it. Jim on the other hand may be unable to ride the attraction because people like Jill are draining capacity. In economics this is called a market failure. Jim is unable to get the good he wants while Jill gets a good that she didn’t really want. Happiness is not optimized in this case.
4) FastPass inflates queues for other attractions. Flight of Passage FPs are good examples of this phenomena. Suppose you get a Flight or Passage FP. Usually you would wait 2+ hours in line. But instead of waiting in the queue, you suddenly are dumped into walkways. What do you do? Shopping, dinning, and soaking in the atmosphere will only get you so far. When you’re in a theme park it’s all about rides. So all the people that should have been queueing end up searching for new rides to ride. This ends up inflating standby lines. It makes standby almost unbearable. This is less impactful on E Tickets. Flight of Passage will have long lines either way. But this ends up crushing rides like Triceratops Spin. Long lines = higher expectations and there is a good chance Primeval Whirl disappoints.
5) FastPass is terrible for guest psychology. Suppose you had the choice to wait in two lines. One is continuously moving and the other is stop and go. Which one will feel longer? Stop and go is simply soul crushing. FastPass makes stop and go standard throughout every attraction. Instead of the feeling of constant progress towards your destination while moving past interesting showrooms in queues, you stand in the same room for ten minutes, often within view of the FP line as they pass you by. It is soul crushing. It may take the same amount of time, but I’d rather move constantly. That’s how the queues are designed. It’s so much better!
6) FastPass is inefficient. Disney adds tons of complexity in queues with the FP lines. From confused guests getting into the wrong line to asking 4 year olds to tap “Mickey to Mickey” it can be deeply inefficient. Disney also has to employ gatekeepers who have to enforce draconian rules. Intuitive rides like omnimovers are made complex by having two lines and merge points. It’s really absurd. Disney ends up spending more and guests end up wasting time.
7) FPs create unnatural guest flow. How many of us have been enjoying a day in a certain land only to realize we need to race across the park. This takes us out of the story.
8) Attractions used to be so easily discoverable. You’d just walk on. Now it’s a complex process phone apps, hotel rooms, and months of planning. What a pain.

In summation, imagine if I had a way to save Disney money, improve satisfaction, reduce wait times, and increase capacity. Would Disney want to hear it? You’d think so, but Disney will stubbornly stick with a system that is daft. This is the definition of good intentions leading to bad consequences.

 

[Gillyanne]

As others have speculated, I'm guessing it's a physical safety thing, i.e. a gaiter getting caught on something and causing a choking issue. I doubt it is a material issue since they do not specify the type of material an over-the-ear mask must be made out of. I could take a gaiter, cut the material into the shape of a small mask, add ear loops, and it would be acceptable, even though it is still made out of the same material and provides the same protection as an unmodified gaiter.

And this may be what I end up trying for my step dad, he wears gaiter style face covers when we go out, and possibly at work (I don't see him at work, so I'm not sure if he wears only those or something else they provide). I texted him to let him know of this discussion and his response was just "I don't know how I would do in a hot mask in the middle of August). I did mention @lentesta (I think it was) mentioning trying multiple masks and finding the paper ones most comfortable, but if it really is the material of his coverings that he likes, we could take some and make some tie style ones out of it....

Do we know if they have any rules about the "earloops" b/c my mom has also made ones out of tshirts (as seen on some online videos) where she basically just cut the ear loops into/out of the fabric, no extra sew materials needed, potentially could just do that w/ the material too

::edited to add::

My mom also made gaiter style ones out of some old leggings. She just cut the leggings' legs into however many inches high bands, and they're wide enough/stretchy enough one can pull it over their head and up to their face to use, much like a gaiter, but it's usually up around the back of the head, and not on the neck much (when worn on the face) it's probably a good half the length of the gaiters I've seen since we didn't cut them to protect the neck from sun...

Which also makes me think, when my mom wears her gaiter from SA company, I think she cut it half, and then tends to fold it in half, so it's also not on her neck as much (if at all), and 2x as thick....

 

[SoFloMagic]

If Disney isn't paying for the front line CMs to be tested, there's no reason they should do so for Equity.

Disney is requiring all cast to wear masks (and in many cases, face shields).
Disney is forbidding equity from wearing any PPE.

It makes sense that there may be differences in testing between two groups having very different safety strategies.

 

[lilypgirl]

Current waits at 12:15-
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That is so awesome ! I hope it stays this way next week.

 

[vikescaper]

It feels really good being back in the park today and I feel that the cast members are doing a great job! To me, everybody seems to be in good spirits and are wearing their masks. I will admit that I am really enjoying not having to worry about fastpasses. It really reminds me of the days before fastpass.