Magic Kingdom going FP+ only on 1/14/14

[JimboJones123]

I get that this issue does not impact 'most' of you but constantly seeing so many decide that since it's not an issue for them, others do not have the right to be bothered by it is part of what is heightening the frustration.

For me personally, the only issue I've been bothered by is that Disney did not deliver on their commitment of April 2013 (see link in my earlier post) to allow non-resort guest Passholders to reserve FP+ in advance (9 months ago). Without that, our ability to fully experience the parks has continued to be reduced with each passing month. And when combined with Disney's refusal to communicate anything on the topic we can only assume that what they publicly told us when we purchased our AP's was not true. They took our money with the commitment of a park experience that they are not delivering.

If you are a Passholder staying at a resort, you are not impact by this specific issue but do not have the right to dismiss the impact on others such as local Passholders who are.

It did make the holidays especially difficult this year.

Since MM+ started, I simply cannot wait in line for much if any of the key attractions. I walked out of a 30 minute line for Test Track after 60 minutes once. Sorin after 60 minutes in a 50 minute posted line. Peter Pan is virtually untouchable (even though the standby line "should" be less than 15 minutes). If I do not get in line for TSM the last hour of the day, it is simply impossible.

 

[seafoodbuffet]

Of course. Which is why Disney sends quarterly newsletters, emails and the like, to not build that customer bond and loyalty....

It's not unreasonable to expect some modicum of loyalty to be a two-way street. Simply saying one is SOL because Disney is a business is a tired argument. Disney tries to build this loyalty, practically from birth. As such, they are (and should be) expected to show a little loyalty in the other direction....

Unfortunately, I guess we simply don't agree on that point. I think you should expect from a company exactly what they say they're going to do, but no more. A company is never going to think "boy those people really helped me through tough times, I should appreciate them", they are going to think "What can I do to motivate that same group to continue spending money with me, because even during tough times, they were willing to open their wallet?". Perhaps the resulting actions on the part of the company may be the same (benefits to APs, fan appreciation newsletters, etc), but don't confuse that with some sense that the company "likes" you.

Believing otherwise is the same as believing that the hot bartender/watron/exotic dancer really likes you.

 

[disney4life2008]

Why shouldn't guests who stay on site get an advantage. They are giving Disney more money, Disney is giving them more access. I think it makes sense. In any industry and market if you choose to buy a cheaper product, you get less features. So yes, staying off-site means you have to make your selections day of, but you also saved a butt-load of money. What drives me crazy about this discussion is that it seems like everyone wants the system to be designed to benefit their own particular situation the most, and the only one here who gets that privilege is Disney.

Furthermore, to all of those who preferred the old system, I hear you, but it's gone and won't come back and Disney doesn't OWE us anything in that regard. The old system certainly benefited smart guests who did their research and planned ahead, but that isn't the majority of park guests, by a long shot. The new system may not work AS WELL for us in the know, but I think in the long run it will work a LOT better for the general visitor.

Finally, to those who say they hate lines? "Effie, we all got pains." Is there a single person on this board who actually enjoys waiting in line? I don't mean appreciating the details or playing the games or what have you, but is there anyone who would wish for longer waits to get on rides? We all hate lines, EVERYONE hates lines, so keep in mind that one of the goals (whether it will be met or not is to be determined) is that this new system will reduce the total time spent waiting in for EVERYONE, yes individuals may see an increase, but in general the wait time should be reduced.

Don't get me wrong, there are parts of this new system that I like and parts that I don't, but I think the passion some people are exhibiting is a little much.

Sorry - what about Annual Passholders who have paid a premium to disney for year round admission? Obviously we are at the bottom of the scale

 

[wm49rs]

Unfortunately, I guess we simply don't agree on that point. I think you should expect from a company exactly what they say they're going to do, but no more. A company is never going to think "boy those people really helped me through tough times, I should appreciate them", they are going to think "What can I do to motivate that same group to continue spending money with me, because even during tough times, they were willing to open their wallet?". Perhaps the resulting actions on the part of the company may be the same (benefits to APs, fan appreciation newsletters, etc), but don't confuse that with some sense that the company "likes" you.

Believing otherwise is the same as believing that the hot bartender/watron/exotic dancer really likes you.

Then if they say they're going to offer you a 20% merchandise discount, it shouldn't be reduced to 10%. If they say you can get free valet parking at the resorts, they shouldn't take it away. And if they say you're going to be part of the the program which will become the only way to get FPs, they shouldn't be vague or nebulous about when that will occur.

And when Disney blatantly chooses to act like that hot bartender, and get people to believe and buy into it, then yes, some of the responsibility lies with them. if they're trying to create these "lifelong" bonds with people from childhood, then it should be a two-way endeavor.

 

[seafoodbuffet]

I get that this issue does not impact 'most' of you but constantly seeing so many decide that since it's not an issue for them, others do not have the right to be bothered by it is part of what is heightening the frustration.

For me personally, the only issue I've been bothered by is that Disney did not deliver on their commitment of April 2013 (see link in my earlier post) to allow non-resort guest Passholders to reserve FP+ in advance (9 months ago). Without that, our ability to fully experience the parks has continued to be reduced with each passing month. And when combined with Disney's refusal to communicate anything on the topic we can only assume that what they publicly told us when we purchased our AP's was not true. They took our money with the commitment of a park experience that they are not delivering.

If you are a Passholder staying at a resort, you are not impacted by this specific issue but do not have the right to dismiss the impact on others such as local Passholders who are.

But in the link you posted, there was no promised timelines right? I get that they haven't yet delivered on it, but they've also not said they weren't going to honor that commitment. I suppose for me, if all the parks go FP+ only AND they still leave APs in the dark, then I'd be pretty annoyed.

Even though I am an out of state AP, this issue impacts me. I would like to stay at a cheap place and still derive MM+ benefits. I would LOVE to use my Marriott/Starwood/Hilton points instead of paying Disney resort prices ad still get MB and FP+ advanced reservations. I believe I understand why that's not possible at this point and rather than to be upset, I will either vote with my wallet by not going or decide to suck it up and pay.

 

[seafoodbuffet]

Then if they say they're going to offer you a 20% merchandise discount, it shouldn't be reduced to 10%. If they say you can get free valet parking at the resorts, they shouldn't take it away. And if they say you're going to be part of the the program which will become the only way to get FPs, they shouldn't be vague or nebulous about when that will occur.

And when Disney blatantly chooses to act like that hot bartender, and get people to believe and buy into it, then yes, some of the responsibility lies with them. if they're trying to create these "lifelong" bonds with people from childhood, then it should be a two-way endeavor.

I guess I would say that in my (admittedly short) life experience, every "loyalty" program has worked this way. Miles deflate in value over time, reward programs make it harder to get first-class upgrades, etc. Businesses work this way because in their calculus, it's the way to generate the most profit.

To put it concretely, yes Disney has promised MM+ benefits to APs. As an AP, I expect to receive that. However, given that there's no concrete timeline published and missed, I'm not going to be overly anxious that it's not yet happened.

In my thinking, I'm already pot-committed for upwards of $2,500+ dollars in AP costs. If I really wanted advanced FP+ res, I'd find the cheapest acceptable way of qualifying for it under current rules (a one-night stay at Pop perhaps) and just enjoy the benefit. Refusing to pay more out of principle and THEN complaining that it's not happening fast enough for your taste is the definition of impatience no?

 

[wm49rs]

I guess I would say that in my (admittedly short) life experience, every "loyalty" program has worked this way. Miles deflate in value over time, reward programs make it harder to get first-class upgrades, etc. Businesses work this way because in their calculus, it's the way to generate the most profit.

To put it concretely, yes Disney has promised MM+ benefits to APs. As an AP, I expect to receive that. However, given that there's no concrete timeline published and missed, I'm not going to be overly anxious that it's not yet happened.

In my thinking, I'm already pot-committed for upwards of $2,500+ dollars in AP costs. If I really wanted advanced FP+ res, I'd find the cheapest acceptable way of qualifying for it under current rules (a one-night stay at Pop perhaps) and just enjoy the benefit. Refusing to pay more out of principle and THEN complaining that it's not happening fast enough for your taste is the definition of impatience no?

And what if you have an upcoming trip planned, even within the next few months, and are unable to secure any FPs because you're locked out of the system? How is that Disney showing loyalty, but simply not providing the basic service you contracted for?

And the answer is that someone who has already purchased an Ap should buy a package (to include park tickets) on top of what they've already spent for admission?

Edit: And by the way, I don't know what programs you've been a part of, but the further you go up an airline's (such as Delta) loyalty scale, getting upgraded becomes vastly easier....

 

[seafoodbuffet]

And what if you have an upcoming trip planned, even within the next few months, and are unable to secure any FPs because you're locked out of the system? How is that Disney showing loyalty, but simply not providing the basic service you contracted for?

And the answer is that someone who has already purchased an Ap should buy a package (to include park tickets) on top of what they've already spent for admission?

That seems very unlikely. I WAS at the parks, during peak season, without being able to secure advanced FP+ and had no problems getting FP+/legacy FP for the attractions we wanted, at the times we want. Once all the parks go FP+ only, even if as an AP, I only had same-day FP+, I would be totally fine with that. Unless you've specifically experienced being locked out, that seems like a fear that's yet to be proven true.

 

[wm49rs]

That seems very unlikely. I WAS at the parks, during peak season, without being able to secure advanced FP+ and had no problems getting FP+/legacy FP for the attractions we wanted, at the times we want. Once all the parks go FP+ only, even if as an AP, I only had same-day FP+, I would be totally fine with that. Unless you've specifically experienced being locked out, that seems like a fear that's yet to be proven true.

If you currently have an AP and are planning a trip before you receive your MagicBand, what is there to link into the MDE system to allow you to schedule FP+ reservations?

 

[seafoodbuffet]

If you currently have an AP and are planning a trip before you receive your MagicBand, what is there to link into the MDE system to allow you to schedule FP+ reservations?

I believe the only way to schedule FP+ reservations is if you have an upcoming resort stay. I've also heard that if you are an AP, as long as you've completed a resort stay, you will continue to have access to FP+ reservations through MDE. During my last trip, wherein I didn't stay at a resort, I just walked into the park and approached one of the MM+ people and made same-day FP+ selections (at DAK, for example). If you have one of the plastic AP, it's already rfid enabled to work all the FP+ kiosks.

 

[donsullivan]

But in the link you posted, there was no promised timelines right? I get that they haven't yet delivered on it, but they've also not said they weren't going to honor that commitment. I suppose for me, if all the parks go FP+ only AND they still leave APs in the dark, then I'd be pretty annoyed.

Even though I am an out of state AP, this issue impacts me. I would like to stay at a cheap place and still derive MM+ benefits. I would LOVE to use my Marriott/Starwood/Hilton points instead of paying Disney resort prices ad still get MB and FP+ advanced reservations. I believe I understand why that's not possible at this point and rather than to be upset, I will either vote with my wallet by not going or decide to suck it up and pay.

The link I posted specifically used the words "in the coming months" and "later this year" in April, 2013. They have not delivered on that commitment. And they have refused to provide any update of any kind since that date.

I'm sorry but since you are not directly and immediately impacted by this 'right now' you don't have the same perspective. If I decide to go to any of the parks tomorrow (which I'm considering) or maybe meet up with friends at MK next Saturday, since I am not eligible for FP+ advance reservation, I am relegated to having access to what might be left-over when I get there. Since the vast majority of FP's for headliner attractions have been reserved in advance via FP+ and the balance are gone in the first 60 minutes after rope drop, a whole broad range of attractions will be continue to be unavailable to me without a far longer than posted actual standby line.

 

[wm49rs]

I believe the only way to schedule FP+ reservations is if you have an upcoming resort stay. I've also heard that if you are an AP, as long as you've completed a resort stay, you will continue to have access to FP+ reservations through MDE. During my last trip, wherein I didn't stay at a resort, I just walked into the park and approached one of the MM+ people and made same-day FP+ selections (at DAK, for example). If you have one of the plastic AP, it's already rfid enabled to work all the FP+ kiosks.

To be able to make advance reservations (which is the primary advantage for the FP+ system), you need to link some form of ticket media to MDE. I have no idea if current AP holders have that ability. But to have to arrive, enter the parks, and then try to obtain the best times available (after others have already reserved time slots in advance), isn't the most beneficial for those who are among your most loyal customer base.

 

[seafoodbuffet]

Since the vast majority of FP's for headliner attractions have been reserved in advance via FP+ and the balance are gone in the first 60 minutes after rope drop, a whole broad range of attractions will be continue to be unavailable to me without a far longer than posted actual standby line.

In my own experience over Christmas, this was simply not true. I was easily able to secure same-day FP+ for all of the E ticket attractions, fireworks, etc (modulo the tiering system) AND even highly popular rides like TSM, TT, Soarin' were all dispensing paper FPs well into the 11 o'clock hour. So far, at least based on what I've observed, this notion that "advanced FP+ reservations will snap up all the good stuff" hasn't proven to be the case.

 

[seafoodbuffet]

To be able to make advance reservations (which is the primary advantage for the FP+ system), you need to link some form of ticket media to MDE. I have no idea if current AP holders have that ability. But to have to arrive, enter the parks, and then try to obtain the best times available (after others have already reserved time slots in advance), isn't the most beneficial for those who are among your most loyal customer base.

You can link your AP to MDE (just add a ticket and enter the ticket number on your pass). But even without advanced reservations, it's not like you have to rush to a kiosk the moment you enter the park. We would enter at rope drop, ride rides while there was no line and they make day-of FP+ selections around 9 or 10am. Our selections were always for the afternoon (where I deemed FP+ would help me avoid the longest lines) and I never found that the attraction or time I wanted was unavailable.

 

[wm49rs]

You can link your AP to MDE (just add a ticket and enter the ticket number on your pass). But even without advanced reservations, it's not like you have to rush to a kiosk the moment you enter the park. We would enter at rope drop, ride rides while there was no line and they make day-of FP+ selections around 9 or 10am. Our selections were always for the afternoon (where I deemed FP+ would help me avoid the longest lines) and I never found that the attraction or time I wanted was unavailable.

Well, that was your experience. Unfortunately, it wasn't the same for others....

 

[seafoodbuffet]

Well, that was your experience. Unfortunately, it wasn't the same for others....

Do you have personal experience or can you link to another thread? I'm genuinely interested to hear circumstances where this didn't work for future visits.

 

[wm49rs]

Do you have personal experience or can you link to another thread? I'm genuinely interested to hear circumstances where this didn't work for future visits.

No, I did not renew my AP. And I'm sure you could search around some....

 

[donsullivan]

In my own experience over Christmas, this was simply not true. I was easily able to secure same-day FP+ for all of the E ticket attractions, fireworks, etc (modulo the tiering system) AND even highly popular rides like TSM, TT, Soarin' were all dispensing paper FPs well into the 11 o'clock hour. So far, at least based on what I've observed, this notion that "advanced FP+ reservations will snap up all the good stuff" hasn't proven to be the case.

I'm not going to waste any more of my time arguing this point with you. You've decided that your anecdotal experience over the holidays is the reality for all at all times and therefore nobody else's actual, weekly experience with the results of the system over the last 6 months has any basis. You've made it clear that I must have made up everything I've experienced and in your eyes have no right to be bothered by Disney not delivering on the service commitment they made when I purchased by AP in July.

I've dealt with the impacts of this transition multiple times a month since it started and you're experiences over the holiday is anecdotal at best and not how it actually feels for many others. Especially others who are limited on the days of the week when they can visit the parks. If I can only visit on the weekend because I have to work during the week, your experience on maybe a Tuesday has nothing to do with my experience on a Saturday or Sunday. You're experience in December has nothing to do with my experience in November or January.

You've made it your cause here to tell everyone who has a problem with Passholders not having access to Fastpass+ Advance Reservation that they have no right to complain. Just because you did not have a negative experience does not make that the fact for others.

I'm done debating with you because you've chosen that since you didn't experience any of these negative things we must all be making them up. You are incorrect.

 

[Fractal514]

Sorry - what about Annual Passholders who have paid a premium to disney for year round admission? Obviously we are at the bottom of the scale

You did not pay a premium, you got a discount, unless you visited less than ten days.

 

[Fable McCloud]

Then don't. Don't do any FP+ and just go into the parks and ride things that you want. If you don't want to wait in line, then don't.

Unless what you are really saying is, you don't want to plan ahead and yet you still want the ability to just walk right on the rides you want, when you want. That's just not gonna happen.

I wasn't whining or anything, just stating something. No reason to get aggressive.

I just meant I miss the paper passes.