News Lou the manatee and three dolphins being relocated from EPCOT

P

plutofan15

Well-Known Member
DisneyCane said:
Slightly off topic but is there really that much difference between dolphins in captivity and dogs or cats living inside a house or apartment? Those pets are restricted to an area that is a lot smaller than their natural territory and don't have the freedom to do much that they would do naturally.
Click to expand...
What is the natural territory of a poodle?
 
LittleBuford

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
DisneyCane said:
Slightly off topic but is there really that much difference between dolphins in captivity and dogs or cats living inside a house or apartment? Those pets are restricted to an area that is a lot smaller than their natural territory and don't have the freedom to do much that they would do naturally.
Click to expand...
Domesticated dogs and cat are, as their name suggests, different from their wild counterparts. They have been cohabiting with humans for millennia in a mutually beneficial arrangement, one that they themselves may well have initiated by cosying up to our early ancestors for food and shelter.

Friendly though they may appear, dolphins are wild animals and cannot be domesticated. There is absolutely no evidence that they enjoy being in captivity or benefit from it. Even the National Aquarium in Baltimore has acknowledged as much and is sending its community of dolphins to a sort of retirement home carved out from the ocean.
 
W

wdwfan4ver

Well-Known Member
Cliff said:
I have to wonder what the daily, monthly or yearly operational costs are for the entire Seas pavilion. "If" Burbank's goal is to reduce overall park operations costs to improve bottom-line revenue, maybe cutting the entire pavilion could be beneficial. How many people does it draw in a day vs how much does it cost to show that attraction to each guest?

A long-time insider (who I will not name) once told me that Burbank has calculations for how much an attraction costs them to show each guest every day. It goes like this:

Attraction X =

Cost to build + cost to operate and maintain every day versus how many people visit that attraction every day.

In other words: If Attraction "X" Costs $100 dollars a day (simple number) and 100 people use that attraction, this means that Disney spends $1 per customer to provide it to them. If it cost a guest $10 to get into the park, that attraction "X" absorbed $1 dollar of "profit" away from that customer. The calculations are FAR more complex than this, but you get the rough idea.

If attraction "X" has a very high operations cost and a low attendence, this produces bad "cost per guest" ratio. I had also heard that HarmonioUS specifically had a very bad "cost per guest" ratio.

Yes, I was very surprised to hear that Burbank calculates these "per-guest" cost consumption numbers like this.

I REALLY love the Seas pavilion but given the need for deep daily operational cuts, maybe it's time to bulldoze it to the ground? I dunno. I certainly hope not and hope it has favorable ratio numbers.

2025-2026 parks attendance numbers and Disney quarterly earnings reports are going to be FACINATING to watch in the next couple of years. "If" business divisions are down, deeper parks cuts WILL be required.

Only time will tell....
Click to expand...
What you said about Living Seas also can be said about Rafiki's Planet watch. Also remember DAK's attendance numbers really decline since covid and Iger's answer is bringing more IPS to AK where Dinoland USA is going to be gone. I know the attendance numbers being down after Covid can be somewhat pointed operating hours being less compared to they were after Pandora opened.

If Dinoland USA isn't going to help Disney enough, the area at Rafiki's planet watch would be one of the big targets that can do since Disney don't want to use expansion pads if possible. What Said with Rafiki's Planet Watch would mean Wildlife Express would be gone too.

Disney has the motives to get a rid of animals AK such as being limited what they can do for night time shows and amount of money saved by not having animals.
 
JoeCamel

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
wdwfan4ver said:
What you said about Living Seas also can be said about Rafiki's Planet watch. Also remember DAK's attendance numbers really decline since covid and Iger's answer is bringing more IPS to AK where Dinoland USA is going to be gone. I know the attendance numbers being down after Covid can be somewhat pointed operating hours being less compared to they were after Pandora opened.

If Dinoland USA isn't going to help Disney enough, the area at Rafiki's planet watch would be one of the big targets that can do since Disney don't want to use expansion pads if possible. What Said with Rafiki's Planet Watch would mean Wildlife Express would be gone too.

Disney has the motives to get a rid of animals AK such as being limited what they can do for night time shows and amount of money saved by not having animals.
Click to expand...
So if you take the animals out of Animal Kingdom what are you going to call it?
 
HauntedPirate

HauntedPirate

Park nostalgist
Premium Member
Can they just use projections and fool people into thinking there are fish and other creatures in the water? The 'ooo's and 'ahh's would be huge. The Living Seas rockets to the top of the GSAT numbers because the rubes many guests love projections SO much.

What?
 
C

Cliff

Well-Known Member
I would love to see the books on how much big cats, chimps and all the animals on the tour cost. I can only guess that the food, vet care, labor, monitoring and pharmaceuticals costs are extremely expensive.

I have to guess that Burbank financial analysts look at Animal Kingdom's books very hard. I wonder if they are happy with the ROI ratio in recent years.
 
C

Cliff

Well-Known Member
HauntedPirate said:
Can they just use projections and fool people into thinking there are fish and other creatures in the water? The 'ooo's and 'ahh's would be huge. The Living Seas rockets to the top of the GSAT numbers because the rubes many guests love projections SO much.

What?
Click to expand...
It's not a bad idea. There are probably a few more things Burbank could do to get operations costs down at The Seas.

Maybe they could turn off the "Nemo" shell dark-ride part and just make it a back-door, walk-in attraction only. Shutting off the moving ride and not having to maintain those show mechanics could save a few dollars at the end of the year and you won't need to staff that anymore either. That could maybe get a dozen people off their books too and of course cut down on the power bill too.

Getting the dolphins and manatees out probably means they can cut down on constant veterinarian staff too. Having just fish to maintain probably requires minimal, less skilled staff for simple scheduled feeding. If a manatee or dolphin dies, it's a huge PR scandal and the state would investigate. Too much liability. Were those dolphins insured? If a jack, tarpon, shark or ray dies, nobody cares or even notices.

Maybe water filtering, PH balance checks can be outsourced to a once a week checkup? Also, anything paid to contractors or to a 3rd party company is an added tax write-off too. So, that's a good thing for Burbank.
 
Tha Realest

Tha Realest

Well-Known Member
Cliff said:
I would love to see the books on how much big cats, chimps and all the animals on the tour cost. I can only guess that the food, vet care, labor, monitoring and pharmaceuticals costs are extremely expensive.

I have to guess that Burbank financial analysts look at Animal Kingdom's books very hard. I wonder if they are happy with the ROI ratio in recent years.
Click to expand...
That, and the competition has gotten a lot better. Back in the mid to late 90’s I don’t recall there being as many world class zoos around. Now? The theming and wildlife variability in many mid to large size city zoos is quite impressive.
 
Mr. Sullivan

Mr. Sullivan

Well-Known Member
DisneyCane said:
Slightly off topic but is there really that much difference between dolphins in captivity and dogs or cats living inside a house or apartment?
Click to expand...
Quite a significant difference yes.

Oceanic creatures can travel thousands of miles in their lifetimes. They move constantly. This is why a lot of marine animals, especially the exceptionally intelligent ones, tend to get very restless when in captivity. They’re smart enough to recognize they’re enclosed.

Your dog or cat thinks of it as a chore to move from the living room to the bedroom.
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom