Lightning Lane Premier Pass

[Vegas Disney Fan]

I think if you want to have a smooth full park day at MK there is great value with a LLMP, even for the non headliners. EPCOT/AK aren't worth it but there is an argument for DHS where you can use it to get what you want and hop to EPCOT mid day for more fun.

This will be our first WDW trip since they added Genie/LL, more than anything it was FOMO that got us to buy it, we decided we’d rather spend a couple hundred more (and maybe not need it) than save a few bucks on what’s already a multi thousand dollar vacation and regret it.

The risk of this is if the standby lines are short, or the LL lines are still long, we’re going to feel like we got completely ripped off.

 

[JD80]

This will be our first WDW trip since they added Genie/LL, more than anything it was FOMO that got us to buy it, we decided we’d rather spend a couple hundred more (and maybe not need it) than save a few bucks on what’s already a multi thousand dollar vacation and regret it.

The risk of this is if the standby lines are short, or the LL lines are still long, we’re going to feel like we got completely ripped off.

You'll easily save time in lines which allows you to do other things like relax and sit down and have a meal, take more pictures, do the shopping you want to do, go take a break and still do what you want to do.

Not having LLMP you can still get everything done, however you're spending more time in lines and not doing other stuff.

 

[Disstevefan1]

This will be our first WDW trip since they added Genie/LL, more than anything it was FOMO that got us to buy it, we decided we’d rather spend a couple hundred more (and maybe not need it) than save a few bucks on what’s already a multi thousand dollar vacation and regret it.

The risk of this is if the standby lines are short, or the LL lines are still long, we’re going to feel like we got completely ripped off.

Very much looking forward to your report. No judgment here. There is part of my brain that loves the idea of getting in the express line Universal style at Disney.

I do need help with the math. You said we and a couple hundred, again no judgment, but how much in total do you plan to spend on LLPP for all the days and for the total party?

 

[HauntedPirate]

Wait... so you geniuses are actually trying to tell us that Disney would be willing to give away a minimum of a $450/day profit (figuring a family of 4) by including LLPP with a room stay so they could gain, at best, $300/night selling a deluxe room at rack rate?

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

Very much looking forward to your report. No judgment here. There is part of my brain that loves the idea of getting in the express line Universal style at Disney.

I do need help with the math. You said we and a couple hundred, again no judgment, but how much in total do you plan to spend on LLPP for all the days and for the total party?

Just 2 of us which helps, for 2 people for the 3 park days it was $250 total.

$100 combined for our MK day with MP for Space, HM, and PoTC and SP for Tron, $75 for our EP day with MP for Frozen, LwtL, and SE and SP for GGCR, and $75 for our AK day with MP for Safari, Navi, and EE and SP for FoP… it’s nice knowing we’ll have 3 or more major rides guaranteed each day with relatively short lines, which was why we were previously huge FP+ fans.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Just 2 of us which helps, for 2 people for the 3 park days it was $250 total.

$100 combined for our MK day with MP for Space, HM, and PoTC and SP for Tron, $75 for our EP day with MP for Frozen, LwtL, and SE and SP for GGCR, and $75 for our AK day with MP for Safari, Navi, and EE and SP for FoP… it’s nice knowing we’ll have 3 or more major rides guaranteed each day with relatively short lines, which was why we were previously huge FP+ fans.

Oh I thought you were buying LLPPs

 

[Disstevefan1]

Wait... so you geniuses are actually trying to tell us that Disney would be willing to give away a minimum of a $450/day profit (figuring a family of 4) by including LLPP with a room stay so they could gain, at best, $300/night selling a deluxe room at rack rate?

This post can’t be directed to me because I am no where near a genius.

My (non genius) thinking that could be all wrong is you have a family who would normally not consider staying at a deluxe resort nor would they ever pay for LLPPs and and maybe we’re not considering a vacation at WDW and see this kind of package and go for it because of the “free” vapor ware LLPPs.

Sort of like the “free dining” packages (also with minimum stays at rake rate, tickets with park hoppers required etc. ) except for the free dining Disney actually has to make and serve food to folks where when giving away “free” LLPPs they need to do……….. nothing.

 

[Splash4eva]

This post can’t be directed to me because I am no where near a genius.

My (non genius) thinking that could be all wrong is you have a family who would normally not consider staying at a deluxe resort nor would they ever pay for LLPPs and and maybe we’re not considering a vacation at WDW and see this kind of package and go for it because of the “free” vapor ware LLPPs.

Sort of like the “free dining” packages (also with minimum stays at rake rate, tickets with park hoppers required etc. ) except for the free dining Disney actually has to make and serve food to folks where when giving away “free” LLPPs they need to do……….. nothing.

Just like the dining plan its simple math…

Im back after yet another suspension!!! Happy New Year everyone!!!!!

 

[DoubleSwitchback]

LLPPs are vapor and costs them ZERO.

Disney loses ZERO dollars to offer a LLPP package like this, unlike "free dining" where they literally have to give out "free" meals/snacks whatever.

They launched LLPPs and created high value (albeit FAKE) for their vapor product LLPP.

Therefore, it costs them ZERO to offer LLPPs and in return they can sell deluxe rooms at rack rate, min 4 days, 4 days at park with park hoppers and folks still need to buy meals.

Its a win all around for Disney.

It's exactly that it has no hard costs that makes this plan a bad idea. People who are already paying for PP also need tickets and food. Even if it drives incremental club-level deluxe guests, why trade the free $2k/day for PP to gross less than that for a club-level res (which does have hard costs)? I may be missing something here. but the math ain't mathin' for me.

 

[LSLS]

Wait... so you geniuses are actually trying to tell us that Disney would be willing to give away a minimum of a $450/day profit (figuring a family of 4) by including LLPP with a room stay so they could gain, at best, $300/night selling a deluxe room at rack rate?

I think they would bank on more families staying. So, family of 4 were going to stay off property and only go say 4 days of their 7 day trip. BUT, including LLPP, they now decide to stay on property, and since they get the LLPP, they decide to add a few more days at the parks as well. So, you may lose out on some money if they were to buy LLMP, but added hotels and possibly an extra day or two. I can tell you personally, we are considering trying Universal this summer (the ticket price is still making it a tough sell), and we are absolutely considering getting a deluxe hotel there for that free add on. If that was not a thing, I think we most likely stay outside the resort where I can get/use points. Now, would the additional people justify the loss of revenues from people who would buy the perk and are otherwise getting it for free? That I'm not sure about.

 

[Disstevefan1]

It's exactly that it has no hard costs that makes this plan a bad idea. People who are already paying for PP also need tickets and food. Even if it drives incremental club-level deluxe guests, why trade the free $2k/day for PP to gross less than that for a club-level res (which does have hard costs)? I may be missing something here. but the math ain't mathin' for me.

In my opinion, this is assuming the family that would purchase the "Free LLPP package" would purchase LLPPs if the "Free LLPP package" did not exist. In my mind that is a massive no.

Disney has brought back "Free Dining packages". We all know at the deluxe level you DO NOT save money on dining on the "Free dining package" because of the rack price of the room, the ticket and park hopper requirement, minimum stay, etc.

Take the "Free dining package" and replace the Free dining with LLPPs; one for each park.

It costs Disney ZERO, they DO NOTHING for the "Free LLPP package and these folks STILL need to purchase food, more money for Disney.

There is no guarantee folks on the "Free Dining" package will purchase LLPPs AND Disney has to make and give folks "Free" meals.

My math says giving guests someone that costs the company ZERO and require guests to pay rack rates with minimum stays, ticket packages with park hoppers etc. is getting folks to book, makes the company money (for no additional costs) AND the guest feels they are getting value with the "Free LLPPs" that is actually vapor and costs the company nothing.

In my opinion, the real reason Disney will never do this is NOT to lose sales of LLPPs; they really do have to control the number of LLPPs given out to make the LL queue bearable, if the LL queues start to creep into the 20 min range its a bad guest experience for folks purchasing LLMPs, LLSPs and LLPPs.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Just like the dining plan its simple math…

Im back after yet another suspension!!! Happy New Year everyone!!!!!

Yes, swap the free dining for one free LLPP for each park with one tweak, deluxe resorts only. All other requirements apply; rack rate, minimum stays, park tickets with park hopper and guests feel they are getting a value in LLPPs which are vapor and costs the company ZERO and they do ZERO to supply "free" LLPPs.

 

[HauntedPirate]

I think they would bank on more families staying. So, family of 4 were going to stay off property and only go say 4 days of their 7 day trip. BUT, including LLPP, they now decide to stay on property, and since they get the LLPP, they decide to add a few more days at the parks as well. So, you may lose out on some money if they were to buy LLMP, but added hotels and possibly an extra day or two. I can tell you personally, we are considering trying Universal this summer (the ticket price is still making it a tough sell), and we are absolutely considering getting a deluxe hotel there for that free add on. If that was not a thing, I think we most likely stay outside the resort where I can get/use points. Now, would the additional people justify the loss of revenues from people who would buy the perk and are otherwise getting it for free? That I'm not sure about.

I agree, for this to make any sort of sense it would have to either draw in guests planning to stay outside WDW for a full week or else upgrade a cheap value stay.

But… We need speculate on this no further - No announced additional enticements next summer.

 

[JD80]

In my opinion, this is assuming the family that would purchase the "Free LLPP package" would purchase LLPPs if the "Free LLPP package" did not exist. In my mind that is a massive no.

Disney has brought back "Free Dining packages". We all know at the deluxe level you DO NOT save money on dining on the "Free dining package" because of the rack price of the room, the ticket and park hopper requirement, minimum stay, etc.

Take the "Free dining package" and replace the Free dining with LLPPs; one for each park.

It costs Disney ZERO, they DO NOTHING for the "Free LLPP package and these folks STILL need to purchase food, more money for Disney.

There is no guarantee folks on the "Free Dining" package will purchase LLPPs AND Disney has to make and give folks "Free" meals.

My math says giving guests someone that costs the company ZERO and require guests to pay rack rates with minimum stays, ticket packages with park hoppers etc. is getting folks to book, makes the company money (for no additional costs) AND the guest feels they are getting value with the "Free LLPPs" that is actually vapor and costs the company nothing.

In my opinion, the real reason Disney will never do this is NOT to lose sales of LLPPs; they really do have to control the number of LLPPs given out to make the LL queue bearable, if the LL queues start to creep into the 20 min range its a bad guest experience for folks purchasing LLMPs, LLSPs and LLPPs.

Here's the math::

A $900 room with 4 adults (no kids under 10) your discounts are:

25% Rack Rate Discount: $1,350
Free DDP Value: $2,352
Free LLMP for each park value: $4,184 (assuming average cost, one for each park)

From a cost perspective, the only thing they would do is say, for a stay of 4 nights or more at a deluxe resort, rack rate, you can get two LLPP for free to use at EPCOT, DHS or AK during your stay. Since the average cost for a family of four to buy a LLPP at EPCOT and DHS is about $2000 which is right inbetween the value of a rack rate discount and free DDP.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I think they would bank on more families staying. So, family of 4 were going to stay off property and only go say 4 days of their 7 day trip. BUT, including LLPP, they now decide to stay on property, and since they get the LLPP, they decide to add a few more days at the parks as well. So, you may lose out on some money if they were to buy LLMP, but added hotels and possibly an extra day or two. I can tell you personally, we are considering trying Universal this summer (the ticket price is still making it a tough sell), and we are absolutely considering getting a deluxe hotel there for that free add on. If that was not a thing, I think we most likely stay outside the resort where I can get/use points. Now, would the additional people justify the loss of revenues from people who would buy the perk and are otherwise getting it for free? That I'm not sure about.

I gave a thumbs up on this post. In my opinion, I do not think Disney is losing on money on these folks if they were to buy LLPPs, these folks WERE NOT GOING TO BUY LLPPs in the first place, but fold LLPPs (that are vapor and costs the company ZERO) into a package that requires them to stay at rack price, multiple days with park hoppers folks will go for it with a smile and think they got value!

Maybe its only me. It worked for me at Universal. We stayed deluxe BECAUSE OF FREE EXPRESS PASS. I will NEVER purchase Express pass at Universal.

Come to think of it, express pass costs Universal ZERO too, but got me to stay there

 

[RSoxNo1]

Im treating this as the active LL discussion as opposed to the LL Premier exclusive discussion. I don't stay on site anymore, so I'm not eligible for Premier Pass.

In general I hate the advanced booking of Lightning Lanes, but my booking window opened up this morning and all things considered, I did pretty well. The process is a little cleaner than Fastpass+ IMO, but at the end of the day it all comes down to availability.

• The one day that I didn't get exactly what I wanted was the first day of my trip (3 days out).
• On some days we will be joined by family members with APs. They cannot latch on to the Lightning Lane bookings of friends and family that have length of stay tickets. I was hoping that they could.
• I was able to get a Lightning Lane single pass for a different park than the Lightning Lane multi pass that I have.

On that first day, I still did get an early Lightning Lane for an attraction that I wanted. It was the secondary attractions that were the problem. Having said that, I still believe getting the singular marquee attraction is the biggest benefit of the system and three advanced selections is wildly unnecessary. My system changes would be as follows:

• Eliminate tiers
• Everyone can make one selection in advance of their trip. 7 days + length of stay for on site, 3 days + length of stay for offsite can remain unchanged.
• Once you've checked into the park, you get one or even two additional selection options and you will always have two or three rolling Lightning Lanes. To me, this is the best balance of all of the systems they've introduced thus far.
• Seven Dwarfs Mine Train needs to be looped into Multi Pass
• Something needs to be done about the disadvantage that APs have. Perhaps something that allows for treating them like offsite length of stay guests if they have Park Reservations. The metric can correspond with the Length of Stay window (i.e. f you have 5 Park Reservations in an 8 day window, you can book LLs for all 5 days once you're 3 days out of day 1).

Practically speaking, if you're rolling into the park with your guaranteed spot at say Tiana's Bayou Adventure, you've eliminated that concern and can then benefit from added day of availability for everything else. I know I'm not alone with the commentary that the advanced booking component adds an unnecessary layer of anxiety that simply doesn't exist in Disneyland.

 

[Basil of Baker Street]

I invite anyone to attend a park in the evening and hop in a line 1 minute before close and watch what happens to standby when no one is entering LL.