Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Splash4eva]

Its not that it's hard, it's that most don't do the parks that way. Most people aren't there to get 11 rides in each day. Most want 3-4 that fit their schedule.

Genie kinda did that for you tho when you think about it

 

[Jrb1979]

Genie kinda did that for you tho when you think about it

Yeah but the benefit of this new system is for hopefully get guests to fill their empty rooms. The other is to hopefully get people dining in at TS again.

IMO this change wasn't really for guest benefit. It was to give a perk to fill rooms and get people back to spending money in the parks. Many dismiss it but I really do believe they are panicking cause the things that used to fill the resorts aren't doing it. Free dining and discounts hasn't moved the needle liked they hoped. I wouldn't be surprised when this doesn't either.

They have a pricing problem that they refuse to fix.

 

[Splash4eva]

Yeah but the benefit of this new system is for hopefully get guests to fill their empty rooms. The other is to hopefully get people dining in at TS again.

IMO this change wasn't really for guest benefit. It was to give a perk to fill rooms and get people back to spending money in the parks. Many dismiss it but I really do believe they are panicking cause the things that used to fill the resorts aren't doing it. Free dining and discounts hasn't moved the needle liked they hoped. I wouldn't be surprised when this doesn't either.

They have a pricing problem that they refuse to fix.

I cant see anyone who truly needs to save money decide to come on property… listen ive always felt value was all that is needed i know ill duck and hide but in all reality they are not that bad and best way to save money while staying at the House of Mouse

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

It wasn't a perfect system but neither is this new one. I still believe they needed to make it a better balance. Let those who want to plan and not get up at 7am book their first one ahead of time.
Leave the rest the way it was.

It's let people stack rides if they choose, let's the ride pounders still able to ride 8-9 a day.

Maybe I'm in the minority but we go to parks to ride rides all day.

The perfect system will never exist until they have enough desirable ride capacity to go around and everybody can use it to facilitate their own idea of their best Disney day.

I’m pretty confident in saying Disney probably considered all the ‘better’ suggestions people have made in here, and for one reason or another opted not to go that route. That they’ve gone back to this magic 3 system twice now makes me think they’ve got some data that shows 3 pre scheduled rides is something desirable for some large target of guests.

Congrats, you were in a tiny fraction of the Genie+ population that knew the drop times. And if more than that tiny fraction had known about them, you almost never would have been able to grab them.

That’s what keeps getting lost here. ‘People should have just researched better and worked harder’, no, I don’t think people actually want that lol. As soon as that happens on any large scale and the tips that make the system function at the optimal level become widespread practices they no longer work as well. There too little capacity. Not everybody can have a successful day if we’re defining it by number of desirable LL booked.

And that tiny fraction of us who did some extra leg work and did some research had that pay off for us… you literally just proved my point.

If everyone does it it doesn’t work the same. Disney didn’t change this system because people were reluctant to use Genie+ the way you do and then complained. Disney knows not everybody can use the system in that maximizing way as there’s not enough seats to go around, so they’re going back to the days where they give their resort guests a leg up, as well as setting up each guest who uses it with a base of 3.

Doing research will absolutely pay off with this new system too. It always has. A base of 3 experiences may slightly shift what the pay off is but until Disney puts a hard cap on LLs booked the ride focused will be fine.

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

I don't go all day.... Rope drop to lunch which is at 11:30..... Back to the pools... Last trip early hours were 830 so it was in three hours we did 11 rides at the MK.... Once again, what is so hard about that....

FWIW, I think this kind of touring works nicely with the LLMP style system. It’s basically the ideal style of touring for it (a midday break). Move through your first 3 quickly in conjunction with rope drop attractions, maybe grab 1-2 more before you leave, and have 3 booked somewhere for your evening with the bonus of having your afternoon break to refine things using drops and such.

I’d argue it’s better than Genie+ for that (Genie+ does better with a late entry to the park or no exit at all IMO) but YMMV.

 

[tonythetigerasn]

How.... I don't understand this at all.... We rode every single ride we wanted using Genie Plus and rope dropping... It wasn't hard at all so I have a hard time believing your post.... It really wasn't hard at all......

I don't know what to say to this, except that was my experience. If you think I'm exaggerating or lying, maybe it makes you feel better to know I think the same about you. Describing it as not hard at all to ride every single ride you wanted is very far from my experience.

I was traveling with young kids in a 10-person group. We mistimed a breakfast reservation. We underestimated Disney transportation times. We booked at 7:02 instead of 7:00:01. If this all sounds like we are irresponsible idiots, fine. Before our trip, I read a lot and was already more familiar with the resort than most people. But it wasn't enough and nothing felt easy. I think it's unrealistic to call a very high level of planning, familiarity, and endurance "not hard at all."

For 90% of visitors (probably way more), a visit doesn't feel easy or simple or whatever synonyms you want to use. These LL changes at least get closer for a family like mine. I think they're a step in the right direction.

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

I don't know what to say to this, except that was my experience. If you think I'm exaggerating or lying, maybe it makes you feel better to know I think the same about you. Describing it as not hard at all to ride every single ride you wanted is very far from my experience.

I was traveling with young kids in a 10-person group. We mistimed a breakfast reservation. We underestimated Disney transportation times. We booked at 7:02 instead of 7:00:01. If this all sounds like we are irresponsible idiots, fine. Before our trip, I read a lot and was already more familiar with the resort than most people. But it wasn't enough and nothing felt easy. I think it's unrealistic to call a very high level of planning, familiarity, and endurance "not hard at all."

For 90% of visitors (probably way more), a visit doesn't feel easy or simple or whatever synonyms you want to use. These LL changes at least get closer for a family like mine. I think they're a step in the right direction.

This is exactly what I assumed would lead to the kind of day people are claiming is impossibly bad. It doesn’t take much. 30 seconds too late for 7 am means your very likely past 11 am for the most desirable LL. Even right at 7 can do that. That likely means you are already 1-2 LLs behind the maximizing guest by the time 11 hits. And despite what the conversation in here portrays, by 11 am return times for most of the big guys would be pushed far out if not sold out.

Then you have to consider the various issues that can pop up throughout the day, leading to missing times or knowing in advance that a return time simply won’t work. Too many people come at this from the perspective of years and years of experience with these parks, as well as experience with their own group in Disney parks giving them the ability to anticipate how they’ll move and behave throughout the day.

I’d say it’s pretty clear from this change Disney felt the inability to choose one’s own time and be at the mercy of the return times was a sticking point for enough guests they needed to address it.

 

[Purduevian]

2ish pm check

Ride	Normal return time	Best return time within the 5 refreshes
Big Thunder	Sold out
Buzz	5:55pm
HM	8:55pm
Jungle Cruise	Sold out
Pooh	9:05pm	6:20pm
Pirates	7:05pm	2:40pm
SM	Sold out
Tiana	Sold out
Frozen	Sold out
MS	Sold out
Remy	Sold out
MMRR	7:40pm	3:55pm
MFSR	6:15pm	4:00pm
RnRC	Sold out
SDD	Sold out
TSMM	Sold out	7:10pm
ToT	Sold out
EE	2:20pm
Kali	3:45pm	3:30pm
Navi	Sold out

 

[bwr827]

And that tiny fraction of us who did some extra leg work and did some research had that pay off for us… you literally just proved my point.

That’s not even the point. No one disagrees that power users had an advantage with Genie+.

The point is about Disney potentially levelling the playing field on this front.

 

[bwr827]

2ish pm check

Ride	Normal return time	Best return time within the 5 refreshes
Big Thunder	Sold out
Buzz	5:55pm
HM	8:55pm
Jungle Cruise	Sold out
Pooh	9:05pm	6:20pm
Pirates	7:05pm	2:40pm
SM	Sold out
Tiana	Sold out
Frozen	Sold out
MS	Sold out
Remy	Sold out
MMRR	7:40pm	3:55pm
MFSR	6:15pm	4:00pm
RnRC	Sold out
SDD	Sold out
TSMM	Sold out	7:10pm
ToT	Sold out
EE	2:20pm
Kali	3:45pm	3:30pm
Navi	Sold out

Multiple reports and YouTube videos have pointed out that “sold out” is not necessarily a final state at any given time of the day.

Playing the slots/refresh game has so far worked to get LLs for some rides that were showing as no longer available.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

I was directly referring to this line skipping situation whatever you wanna call it… listen i really have no issue them charging if the product is good (ive had great success) and if they used that money accordingly to improve the parks etc but as we have seen its not happening

But you used very general phrasing about how businesses should "stand up" to their customers and operate how they see fit. So are you really just saying that Disney should stand up to its customers when it suits your preferences? Either way, Disney clearly thinks this is the better choice, so they ARE operating as they see fit - because "as they see fit" = finding g ways to get customers to keep paying for things and filling resort rooms.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

And that tiny fraction of us who did some extra leg work and did some research had that pay off for us… you literally just proved my point.

And now people doing research and prep work in a different way will benefit. Why do you want to penalize the people who put out the effort to plan their trips in advance and give Disney extra money by booking WDW resort rooms? See how that argument can cut both ways?

 

[Chip Chipperson]

I don't know what to say to this, except that was my experience. If you think I'm exaggerating or lying, maybe it makes you feel better to know I think the same about you. Describing it as not hard at all to ride every single ride you wanted is very far from my experience.

I was traveling with young kids in a 10-person group. We mistimed a breakfast reservation. We underestimated Disney transportation times. We booked at 7:02 instead of 7:00:01. If this all sounds like we are irresponsible idiots, fine. Before our trip, I read a lot and was already more familiar with the resort than most people. But it wasn't enough and nothing felt easy. I think it's unrealistic to call a very high level of planning, familiarity, and endurance "not hard at all."

For 90% of visitors (probably way more), a visit doesn't feel easy or simple or whatever synonyms you want to use. These LL changes at least get closer for a family like mine. I think they're a step in the right direction.

I agree. I also didn't find the randomness of G+ return times and needing to constantly check for return times and refresh the page over and over to be a fun day. I knew what to do but didn't enjoy it and it certainly didn't "always" work for me or others I know. I understand that others were fine with it, but Disney obviously heard from a large amount of guests that pre-planning is preferable.

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

MK is looking decent again in comparison to the first couple days. They must have tweaked something, it’s still looking pretty slow as far as wait times go, but it’s just past 3:00 pm and Buzz, HM, Pirates, and Space are not sold out and are holding through refreshes.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I’d say it’s pretty clear from this change Disney felt the inability to choose one’s own time and be at the mercy of the return times was a sticking point for enough guests they needed to address it.

I am definitely one of them, especially can mined with the 7am booking, it just made for stressful mornings. Not just having to do it at 7am but not knowing what you would be able to get and what time it would be for. And then then at times you would get whammies by clicking on it when it says one time, but by the time confirmed it was a lot latter

I was able to make G+ work really efficiently for us but was much more stressful and took up more brain energy than a FP+ type system - so hoping for similar with this system

 

[BrianLo]

I’m curious what MK does once Big Thunder closes. It feels overdue time for either SDMT or Tron to make the jump. Which of the two more consistently sells out the ‘single pass’/ILL?

The attraction tiers again just highlight that Epcot and DAK need the most help with more desirable attractions. DHS is surprisingly more robust than it should be.

 

[Purduevian]

Multiple reports and YouTube videos have pointed out that “sold out” is not necessarily a final state at any given time of the day.

Playing the slots/refresh game has so far worked to get LLs for some rides that were showing as no longer available.

100%, that's why when I'm posting these, I do a 5-refresh attempt (far right column). In the post you quoted TSMM came back, but nothing else did in 5 attempts. Obviously more could come back if I did more than 5, but I feel like 5 is pretty reasonable for a laid back, don't want to be on my phone all day Disney day.

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

100%, that's why when I'm posting these, I do a 5-refresh attempt (far right column). In the post you quoted TSMM came back, but nothing else did in 5 attempts. Obviously more could come back if I did more than 5, but I feel like 5 is pretty reasonable for a laid back, don't want to be on my phone all day Disney day.

I’ve been periodically keeping an eye out too. Refresh is IME more plentiful than it was with Genie (balanced out by the way Genie held availability longer through the day), and drops are similar. I think it will be possible to have a similar experience as Genie for the user focused on quantity.

 

[Splash4eva]

But you used very general phrasing about how businesses should "stand up" to their customers and operate how they see fit. So are you really just saying that Disney should stand up to its customers when it suits your preferences? Either way, Disney clearly thinks this is the better choice, so they ARE operating as they see fit - because "as they see fit" = finding g ways to get customers to keep paying for things and filling resort rooms.

Do they really think this is a “better choice” or as i said just putting more lipstick on the pig?!? I think we can all agree they need to add capacity. No matter what system they role out next and call it. In regards to “my preference” comment they removed DME i never used it once felt it was one of their worst decisions removing that…. Just like i did with FP/FP+ & Genie+ ill do some research and find the best way to utilize the system. Its worked so far and see no reason it should not in the future and those who follow suit will get great use out of it and the ones who dont will be once again complaining and criticizing the systems as they have had in the past systems

 

[Purduevian]

I’ve been periodically keeping an eye out too. Refresh is IME more plentiful than it was with Genie (balanced out by the way Genie held availability longer through the day), and drops are similar. I think it will be possible to have a similar experience as Genie for the user focused on quantity.

4ish pm check because work is slow right now

Ride	Normal return time	Best return time within the 5 refreshes
Big Thunder*	8:40pm	7:45pm
Buzz	6:55pm	5:50pm
HM	9:20pm	7:35
Jungle Cruise	Sold out
Pooh	Sold out
Pirates	7:30pm	5:55pm
SM	Sold out	7:20pm
Tiana	Sold out
Frozen	Sold out
MS	Sold out	4:40pm
Remy	Sold out
MMRR	Sold out	8:25pm
MFSR	6:20pm	5:45pm
RnRC	Sold out
SDD	Sold out
TSMM*	6:40pm	4:50pm
ToT*	4:35pm
EE	2:20pm
Kali	sold out
Navi	Sold out

*2 hours ago 5 refreshes showed 0 or almost 0 available... now they all are always available, must have been a big drop