Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Completely agree with that….but do we have any numbers on the crowds now vs the crowds then or what is closed or consuming less people now vs what was then?

It makes sense but there have also been things added since Fp+ along with park reservations limiting people plus international travel isn’t back where it used to be yet so I just wonder how close or off it may be to know if we are comparing apples to apples or apples to oranges

Either way it’s a poison apple Disney has placed on a platter for everyone and we are taking the bait

The aggregate travel to central Florida has increased on a consistent, Predictable trajectory since 1970…it is temporarily interrupted by recessions, but it always has recouped temporary losses and climbed higher.

It’s the ease of travel particularly air, the increase in spending more on disposable and leisure, the climb of consumer debt and decline in savings practices, movement of the larger baby boomers generation to Florida to follow their gone parents, and a net increase when all the competitors for leisure add…rising tide lifts all boats.

What didn’t happen at Disney is they didn’t stay ahead of it…they analyzed the flex capacity they had in the early 00’s and decided it had no value as extra/overflow space…so they used it up and exceeded it by not investing more, sooner, quicker.

Built timeshare blocks to house a program that wasn’t designed for “large crowds” in parks 300+ Days a year.

That’s the tale of the tape.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I salute you for your self-awareness, but then what’s the point of all your admonitions? Are you trying to bring about change (and if so, what exactly?), or just blowing off some steam about a situation that you, too, are helping to sustain?

Like a March to “kill the beast?”

…I had considered it

I struggle with washing my hands of the place the same as many of the long timers do…and even many of the Praets now openly grumble about (including on this thread)

I don’t consume as I once did…but it hasn’t slowed the tide much for my part.

So at some point I’ll break. I’m almost at my “goal” on the board anyway…and I’ll shuffle off.

You won’t have to deal with me…someone else will answer the “why can’t they just go back to fastpass+?!?” Rants…
They will lie to you though…I give the courtesy of not doing that.

 

[Chi84]

I salute you for your self-awareness, but then what’s the point of all your admonitions? Are you trying to bring about change (and if so, what exactly?), or just blowing off some steam about a situation that you, too, are helping to sustain?

As far as I can tell it’s okay to give Disney money as long as you understand and freely admit that you are not being smart and you feel bad about yourself for going there. Seems odd to me, but as I said people are different.

 

[TheGuyThatMakesSwords]

We have bailed. Cancelled NOV2022 trip (a lot of this has to do with flakey Air Travel and running disease).
Doing a gratuitous transfer of DVC points to my eldest son.

We are done. No more cash for Disney. Not fun anymore, for us. $12K per year will buy us a LOT of Home Improvements .

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

As far as I can tell it’s okay to give Disney money as long as you understand and freely admit that you are not being smart and you feel bad about yourself for going there. Seems odd to me, but as I said people are different.

You’re getting warmer…

 

[LittleBuford]

You won’t have to deal with me…someone else will answer the “why can’t they just go back to fastpass+?!?” Rants…
They will lie to you though…I give the courtesy of not doing that.

With all due respect, I’m not looking for some great “truth”, whether from you or anyone else. Some of us liked FP+ and want it back, while some of us didn’t and don’t. Nothing you say is going to change how I, personally, feel about FP+, because my feelings are based on my own lived experiences. Nor is there much sense in your trying to convert me given that FP+ is gone and (my own wishes notwithstanding) never coming back.

We’re just a group of WDW fans sharing thoughts and opinions, not philosophers or ethicists.

 

[crazy4disney]

Here here…

And I think that’s what Lazy is trying to say in the end…

Every suggestion of “simple…just do ____” is a declaration that won’t work because it’s not understanding the fundamental math problem that they can get by with ops tricks/direction. That is what these queuing systems are: misdirection to try and balance the load.

What’s disappointing is Disney was EXCELLENT at that…they practically invented it. They’re so bad at it now. Just lost the edge because they decided theme park realities don’t have to be adhered too any longer as money priorities changed.

In 2000 all the hotel rooms were filled and they estimated 44,000,000 gate clicks
In 2019 all rooms were not filled and they estimated around $55,000,000

Disney has attempted to tell themselves that a “missing component” isn’t the issue…because it will cost them more money to make money. Blue sky.

Company refuses to just build some simple solid attractions that will eat up people… its still baffling to me that Stitch is still vacant. Still baffling to me we still have an empty pavilion in Epcot. Still baffling how after all the money they have spent HS & AK is still under built. Again the list is endless. They have created a system where they can literally get their investment back literally in no time with them charging for all these new rides not even counting the additional people and upping ticket prices. What other theme park can say that yet somehow they are missing this…. If anything they should be building fast and furious. Listen dont get me wrong im not a fan of paying additional fees to ride an attraction ive technically Aready paid for but they are easily getting away with it so how they arent striking while its hot i have no idea… again sadly i truly think they are just looking to “survive” with what they are building now opening soon. Use Tiana as another ad to get people in and then take whatever sloppy seconds they can get from Uni when they open up their new park. Then figure out what big thing they have have built say in 2026/2027…

 

[Chi84]

(Flying home economy cattle )

Wanna bet? Start saving for the upgrade lol.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

With all due respect, I’m not looking for some great “truth”, whether from you or anyone else. Some of us liked FP+ and want it back, while some of us didn’t and don’t. Nothing you say is going to change how I, personally, feel about FP+, because my feelings are based on my own lived experiences. Nor is there much sense in your trying to convert me given that FP+ is gone and (my own wishes notwithstanding) never coming back.

We’re just a group of WDW fans sharing thoughts and opinions, not philosophers or ethicists.

Why are you on a discussion board not looking for discussion?

Prebooked fast passes are gone as you knew them. Doneski.

Now we can move on and do more productive things. Sorry for my confusion as to where I am?..,it happens all the time.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

And then there's me.

We are just so darn excited about our 50th B-day (while we are still 49) Disney Deluxe Bonanza trip that I just upgraded to first class on the flight there! (Flying home economy cattle )

I hope it’s not on JetBlue

 

[GhostHost1000]

Don’t worry guys….Disney will announce some things at D23 to get us all excited and then cut half of the budget before they begin and the others will never even happen

 

[dreday3]

Don’t worry guys….Disney will announce some things at D23 to get us all excited and then cut half of the budget before they begin and the others will never even happen

When is it?

 

[LittleBuford]

Why are you on a discussion board not looking for discussion?

I see a big difference between discussion and being preached at (and I say that as someone who's done a fair bit of preaching himself in this forum).

 

[dreday3]

I'm holding out hope that @disneyglimpses is going to give us resort guests some spectacular news come 2023!

 

[GhostHost1000]

When is it?

Sept

 

[Chi84]

With all due respect, I’m not looking for some great “truth”, whether from you or anyone else. Some of us liked FP+ and want it back, while some of us didn’t and don’t. Nothing you say is going to change how I, personally, feel about FP+, because my feelings are based on my own lived experiences. Nor is there much sense in your trying to convert me given that FP+ is gone and (my own wishes notwithstanding) never coming back.

We’re just a group of WDW fans sharing thoughts and opinions, not philosophers or ethicists.

There’s a great deal of (completely unwarranted) arrogance being displayed in some of the posts here. I’m not a fan of it either. I suspect that responding is just feeding the beast so maybe it’s best to move on.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Completely agree with that….but do we have any numbers on the crowds now vs the crowds then or what is closed or consuming less people now vs what was then?

It makes sense but there have also been things added since Fp+ along with park reservations limiting people plus international travel isn’t back where it used to be yet so I just wonder how close or off it may be to know if we are comparing apples to apples or apples to oranges

Either way it’s a poison apple Disney has placed on a platter for everyone and we are taking the bait

Not sure if any public info is out on crowds now compared to before, beyond Chapek saying they are still capping things (but the parks vere basically never at 100% full anyway - so capping vs what?)

As for what is open/closed now vs then, there is the Disney Comeback Index which has tracked everything comparing it to what was open prior to the pandemic

It sits at 88.11% so still over 10% to go (biggest gap remains in entertainment)

 

[LittleBuford]

There’s a great deal of (completely unwarranted) arrogance being displayed in some of the posts here. I’m not a fan of it either. I suspect that responding is just feeding the beast so maybe it’s best to move on.

Agreed!

 

[lazyboy97o]

Completely agree with that….but do we have any numbers on the crowds now vs the crowds then or what is closed or consuming less people now vs what was then?

It makes sense but there have also been things added since Fp+ along with park reservations limiting people plus international travel isn’t back where it used to be yet so I just wonder how close or off it may be to know if we are comparing apples to apples or apples to oranges

Either way it’s a poison apple Disney has placed on a platter for everyone and we are taking the bait

Crowding is relative. 10 people in a 10’ x 10’ room is crowded but 15 people in a 100’ x 100‘ room is not crowded. Lower attendance can be more crowded.

Virtual queues throw the design of a park completely out of whack. They’re designed that some many people are in a queue. Take a person out of a queue and you need somewhere to put them. Just having an extra table at a restaurant is not enough because that may not be where that person wants to be, so you need space at multiple restaurants, multiple gift shops and even other attractions to accommodate this one person you have removed from a queue. Now close one of those places and you compound your problem because you need space to accommodate not only the person you removed from the queue but also all of the people no longer in the now closed venue. Starting off with adequate capacity it’s very easy to fall into a problem, and it’s all made worse with virtual queues. Disney though did not have adequate capacity to start with so everything is even worse.

 

[crazy4disney]

I hope it’s not on JetBlue

Whats wrong w JetBlue?!?