Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

Missing20K

Well-Known Member
You assume Disney will open all alotments at once and let them go until they are empty...

It doesn't have to be that way.

We have to wait and see how they manage LL availability.
So we just button mash many times throughout the day to see when the next allotment is released?

It's called crying over spilled milk man... It's done, it's not changing, you either accept that baseline or walk away. When looking at what changed yesterday, we have more options then we did the day before.
Not crying but I appreciate your concern. Last I checked this is a discussion forum and I was merely contributing to the discussion. If you don’t care for my comments feel free to mute me. (Though I’d prefer you didn’t, we have nice convos in the past)
This is

And if you had been unable to get a VQ for Rise yesterday you would not be able to ride. Once this is in place, if you do not get a VQ you will not be able to ride.

Those two are the same- no difference. The difference comes that you have a new option 'available' you did not have to jump the VQ and get on board for a fee. Today you have no way to solve the lack of a VQ for Rise, when this is in place you will have an 'option' to decide how much you want to ride It that you do not have today. You are not forced to pay the extra for rise if you do not get a VQ slot you do not ride- exactly as it is today.
Yes. The current RotR (edit: queue system) sucks. This is *appears* to be a continuation of the suckage.
 

DisneyDodo

Well-Known Member
Remember... if Disney is gonna sell this $15 option to the majority of the guests... Disney does NOT want the situation where the majority of guests pay, then get frustrated they didn't get any use out of it because there was no LL availability. That is worst case scenario for Disney.

Rather than open all availability at once and let it be depleted, Disney will be motivated to use more rolling availability. Remember, Disney controls the flow of information to you via MDE/Genie and it's signboards. Through the magic of push, Disney can let you know that XYZ ride now has availability an hour from now... do you want in?? And not only that, Disney can manipulate who it tells when... based on your inputs and past actions.

This is not going to be the scenario like boarding groups where everything is booked out in 1 minute. Disney only serves to LOSE in those kinds of situations. If the product can't return value - Disney will have a hard time selling it. So it's in Disney's interest to keep LL availability open more frequently.
What matters is how much total capacity they allocate for LL. How and when guests go about booking it doesn't really matter on a macro level. If they make it easier to book LL (e.g. you can book earlier, or more at a time, etc.), it will run out faster. If they want it to last longer, they have to take measures to prevent guests from booking too many too quickly (e.g. withholding some initially, not letting you book another until you use the one you have, requiring you to wait a certain amount of time between bookings, etc.). Either way, if the total number of LL passes remains constant, Genie+ guests will get to use the LL the same number of times, on average.
 
That is a dumb comparison unless you were able to afford a Lambo last year.
Obviously I was being over the top, but the point stands. And the poster above said it better than I. Going to Disney isn’t some right. It is a product like any other. You can choose to pay or not. And actually in this case you can choose not to pay and still go and wait in lines for every ride they have.
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
I have a question about the new DAS system not sure if I should ask in this thread?
From the sound of it if you register in advance you get to choose a couple attractions a day... and that's it?
Where as if you choose to register upon arrival you can book as many as you want each day one at a time subject to availability?
Also I assume you can choose ANY attraction?
I feel like Disney is being EXTRA generous with DAS when here I thought they were "cracking down" because I've heard a lot of people saying everyone is now abusing it.
Well jeez what's gonna happen when the new system is put in place. They are essentially giving those with a disability a better system and for no additional cost than they are giving those who pay money.
Not begrudging anyone that uses DAS but rather just noting it.
My understanding:


If you register for DAS the day you show up: No changes except that you can sign-up for an attraction using Genie/MDE and not have to go to the ride and get a return time (which is the current standby line length, e.g., 30 Minutes).


If you register ahead of time (at least 2 days in advance) then...
  • you can skip checking in with customer service when you arrive
  • the return times work as they normally do via app (see above)
  • AND... you get to pre-schedule 2 attractions per day by pre-registering.
 

mightynine

Well-Known Member
I know we're all kinda just throwing our thoughts and questions into the void here... but I wonder what this does for attractions that never really needed FP+? Will Nemo just return to standby only or will that still be a Genie+ option ??

I doubt anything that had FP+ that never really needed it will lose a lightning lane. Again, the main point of all of this is crowd management. They're going to have to send people somewhere with Genie+, you don't want to take away options.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
Which was also the case with FastPass+, which is why that system had more attractions than FastPass, regardless of how they mucked up operations, and increased the ratio of FastPasses offered.

FP+ wasn't an adhoc paid add-on... so no one (ok, most) were not going to be demanding Disney give them their money back because there was no availability. G+ will not have that luxury. One you charge a la carte for something, customer expectations change - they will want to see a return for that purchase.

I'm specifically talking about the idea of depletion early in the day. With moving to basically full MDE driven experiences... Disney can be even more dynamic. Heck, don't be suprised if take down the 'FP Return Time' type signs entirely and just have 'Lightning Lane Entraces' with no other info but the current time.
 

Disney Analyst

Well-Known Member
Outside the Magic Kingdom, FP+ also released new times throughout the day.

Right.

But because of advanced bookings you might go into the park in the morning and could only get a 6PM slot for something.

In this case, as each day is fresh, I assume at 7am you’d only be selecting the early morning return times, as later times only open as earlier times fill or pass.

So the only way I could see someone being able to get a 6PM slot at 7 am is if majority buy into Genie+ and all book up one attraction right at 7?
 

wutisgood

Well-Known Member
Only thing is being able to buy the LL Select passes at 7 am, whereas offsite can only reserve those once the park opens (who knows if there will be any left at that point). Would have actually provided a decent advantage if it allowed for normal Genie+ LL reservations in the same manner.
I am afraid the real endgame here for Disney is to effectively cut off the parks from people not staying on site. They have so many rooms the parks as can fairly busy just on that capacity alone. It would be easy for them to add partner hotels make up the difference if they want to add to these numbers. Over time the genie system will allow Disney to slowly favor on site guests more and mine untill people with day passes and AP holders can effectively not ride any of the major attractions without paying for lightening lane or booking one of the sanctioned hotels.

At other resorts they simply don't have the hotel capacity to push this idea which is why they are becoming a better value.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I know we're all kinda just throwing our thoughts and questions into the void here... but I wonder what this does for attractions that never really needed FP+? Will Nemo just return to standby only or will that still be a Genie+ option ??
I would be surprised to see any FastPass+ not have a Lightning Lane. Fewer attractions decreases the perceived value of Genie+, especially at the non-Magic Kingdom parks.
 

pixarprincess

Active Member
I am afraid the real endgame here for Disney is to effectively cut off the parks from people not staying on site. They have so many rooms the parks as can fairly busy just on that capacity alone. It would be easy for them to add partner hotels make up the difference if they want to add to these numbers. Over time the genie system will allow Disney to slowly favor on site guests more and mine untill people with day passes and AP holders can effectively not ride any of the major attractions without paying for lightening lane or booking one of the sanctioned hotels.

At other resorts they simply don't have the hotel capacity to push this idea which is why they are becoming a better value.
The ironic part is they’re doing the opposite of that now. On site has basically no benefit and we know their IT infra is going to crash. You’re better off being the only person in your offsite hotel trying to book things at 7 am than being in the grand Floridian.
 

DonaldDoleWhip

Well-Known Member
should we also file a petition to fire the CEO of the Lamborghini company (pretty sure that is not the name of the company) because we all can’t afford lambos
I honestly see both sides of this argument. Yes, Disney is a business, and consumers have the right to make their choice to patronize it or not. Totally fair.

However, alienating your core supporters and repeatedly charging more for what was once a baseline expectation is unfortunate. Consumers are equally within their rights to express disappointment and react; it's not as simple as choosing to transact or not transact. See the Scarlett Johansson debacle; everyone's got an opinion on it, and in some cases, that opinion toward Disney isn't pretty.

Combine these separate headlines and to many, the Disney brand is being cheapened in a way we haven't seen since the early 2000s (flop films and direct-to-video sequels; theme park creative + maintenance disasters; nearly destroying the positive relationship with Pixar).

Like him or not, Iger helped Disney restore a lot of its goodwill and brand strength. There were some clear faults in his strategy (e.g. the live action remakes became more openly criticized, and many voiced their concerns over theme park pricing). Now, a lot of the negatives are being observed in full force, and people don't have to sit quietly and take it. They certainly didn't in the mid-2000s (e.g. "Save Disney").
 

Missing20K

Well-Known Member
For the new top tier rides (it seems to be 2 per park for now), like 7DMT, you have these options:
  • Standby
  • Purchase a LL$ (Individual Selection Lightning Lane) for some undetermined price for now
So no standby VQ for non-BG rides. So if they price LL$ low enough most people buy it ($4-$24 is low enough in my opinion) then would standby just revert back to the old FP+ lengths?

You couldn't do that with FP+ until your first FPs were consumed... now you can buy a LL pass to another park without being at that park nor being constrained to wait until your other LLs are used.
Attempting attraction capacity optimization across the entire property is quite the undertaking. Will certainly be interesting to see the result and the success or lack thereof.
 

Disney Analyst

Well-Known Member
I hope this is how it works.

It’s the only way I can imagine it working. Just like legacy fast pass.

The New York Times articles on this actually said “booking the next available time” - so I do think that is correct. And with Disney saying it’s basically based of MaxPass, I think it’s a safe bet.

Think of it like legacy Fastpass, but digital, you don’t need to run to machines to get your next pass, and once you scan your pass you can now book your next one while you are walking in the lightning lane.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
So we just button mash many times throughout the day to see when the next allotment is released?
Or get push notifications... that's why you're telling Disney your preferences up front.


Not crying but I appreciate your concern. Last I checked this is a discussion forum and I was merely contributing to the discussion.
But there's a time and place... hating on boarding groups is not related to G+, LL, etc. We get it, you don't like Boarding Groups - but that didn't change with this thread's topic except to add another option. Boarding Groups are table stakes at this point - don't muddy up G+/LL conversation with stuff that is already done...
 

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