Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[CAV]

"Everyone loves it" - Bob Chapek
"33% of guests are using it" - Bob Chapek

"Spots running out early for many, many rides, and Disney apparently re-thinking things less than 3 months after it was unleashed" - Reality

Somewhere, there is a denizen of the Disney executive crew saying, "I told you so."

 

[CAV]

Tell me what happens in that ride?

Seriously…what does it do?

It breaks down.

 

[hopemax]

Disney did you a favor. It's a short, mediocre (at best) attraction that's not worth more than a 10-15 minute wait; it's certainly not worth paying extra to ride.

I have ridden it. But not as often as other rides. I am a Winter Solstice baby, so I enjoy Frozen more than most. Plus, my normal entry ticket is a CM guest pass, which means I don’t pay a $139 “cover charge.” So me paying $7-$11 once is not that big of a deal. Disney and guests probably don’t think I’m “paying my way” already. (I collect pins so I am, but it goes in the wrong profit “bucket” apparently) But when I brought it up, I told my Dad and DH they could wait for me and not pay for them to ride. Because as you say it’s not worth the normal 50+ minute wait. Which is now my only option again, as it was with FP+, which meant no ride for us.

 

[MurphyJoe]

I'm of the opinion that DHS should have multiple theaters to act as pseudo black box stage show venues. New movie comes out, it gets a 5-7 year run. Then if there's one deserving of a larger scale do that (looking at you Aladdin the Musical).

They used to in the 90s.

Vintage Walt Disney World: Inside the Backlot Theater at Disney’s Hollywood Studios

Today, in 1993, the Backlot Theater opened on New York Street at Disney’s Hollywood Studios. This 1,500-seat theater was home to two major productions – The Spirit of Pocahontas and Disney’s The Hunchback of Notre Dame - A Musical Adventure.

disneyparks.disney.go.com

And from what I recall, BatB was never meant to be permanent. But, as usual, Disney went cheap in O-town.

 

[Jrb1979]

Th

Thing is, Disney want it both ends....More people in the park for more money, but try to limit G+ numbers.

The ONLY way of sorting the system out is to have LESS people in the parks. Otherwise all you are doing is finding a system to shepherding the same number of people round but in different ways...end result is always the same.

They need to either raise entrance prices by $80 (or charge $80 for genie) that may reduce numbers enough to make things more manageable. But the top dogs at Disney won't like that as it will reduce the number of Mugs inside their parks buying overpriced food and buying $30 ears that cost $2 to make.

Limiting skip the line availability is what EVERY OTHER PARK DOES.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Th

Thing is, Disney want it both ends....More people in the park for more money, but try to limit G+ numbers.

The ONLY way of sorting the system out is to have LESS people in the parks. Otherwise all you are doing is finding a system to shepherding the same number of people round but in different ways...end result is always the same.


They need to either raise entrance prices by $80 (or charge $80 for genie) that may reduce numbers enough to make things more manageable. But the top dogs at Disney won't like that as it will reduce the number of Mugs inside their parks buying overpriced food and buying $30 ears that cost $2 to make.

Problem is their park business will collapse if they try to do that.

they are in the end amusement parks targeted to American families…crap aside..

they are not boutique enclaves for “whales”…
…it’s silly - even on a Disney board - for people to think so much of themselves to think that’s what they’re buying.

they were built for the masses…the customers need to stay in their lane.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Isn't that what they are doing? In their mind, why add anything, people are still coming. I have been told many times new attractions don't draw people to Disney like the do at other parks.

I guess that’s another way of looking at it…

 

[matt9112]

I think it's a simple move to try to add more inventory to the Genie+ pool... they know G+ is struggling.

I agree there legitimately giving up profit to try and save genie plus. Its a dramatic change...its not just because there feeling generous.

 

[MrPromey]

I agree there legitimately giving up profit to try and save genie plus. Its a dramatic change...its not just because there feeling generous.

And based on the business model, the opposite should be happening, right? With the LL variable pricing, those attractions shouldn’t be going into the Genie+ bucket but should be skyrocketing in price over this period as individual options.

So pay extra for Space Mountain, on a busier day pay even more extra but on a super busy day, it gets included in a $15 package?

This is clearly not about Disney finding their heart.

 

[flynnibus]

And based on the business model, the opposite should be happening, right? With the LL variable pricing, those attractions shouldn’t be going into the Genie+ bucket but should be skyrocketing in price over this period as individual options.

No - that's the thinking if ILL was the one that was struggling and you wanted to improve ILL access. Genie+ is the giant in the room.. that's the one with the highest visibility and greatest potential.

This looks to be a move to bolster the viability of Genie+ and reduce post-sales grief.

 

[doctornick]

No - that's the thinking if ILL was the one that was struggling and you wanted to improve ILL access. Genie+ is the giant in the room.. that's the one with the highest visibility and greatest potential.

This looks to be a move to bolster the viability of Genie+ and reduce post-sales grief.

And it’s not surprising. It’s pretty obvious that they don’t have enough ride capacity to remove 2 rides from G+ in each park. They should have just gone with 1 ILL in each park from the start to make Genie+ more tolerable/successful.

 

[Minnesota disney fan]

DHS needs moderate demand, high capacity attractions. Honestly, long term something like Ratatouille would have been perfect (I think it's properly placed in EPCOT, I'm speaking strictly on capacity vs quality).

The park is also hurting with its lineup of 30 year old shows.

The biggest thing through all of this though is that M&MRR absolutely should have been a new build with GMR receiving an update. That would have gone quite a long way to solve the capacity issues.

I don't think the park is hurting with 30 y/o shows. These are classics and people love to feel the nostalgia as they see them each time they go to disney. I am that way. I must see Lion King and BATB, for instance. It doesn't feel like a normal trip without these icons.
Nostalgia is one of the glues that keeps holding people to WDW. Without nostalgia, they just have some new IP's just like other parks.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

No - that's the thinking if ILL was the one that was struggling and you wanted to improve ILL access. Genie+ is the giant in the room.. that's the one with the highest visibility and greatest potential.

This looks to be a move to bolster the viability of Genie+ and reduce post-sales grief.

It’s also not that radical of a move. Frozen was most likely always coming off LL and going to Genie ++ in 6months or less with the opening of GotG. Same for space mountain which is likely going to Genie when Tron opens. This allows them a pop during a busy season for Genie plus

 

[MrPromey]

No - that's the thinking if ILL was the one that was struggling and you wanted to improve ILL access. Genie+ is the giant in the room.. that's the one with the highest visibility and greatest potential.

This looks to be a move to bolster the viability of Genie+ and reduce post-sales grief.

What you're saying is logical and makes sense. (and is reality) That's not how Disney usually pitches their offerings to guests, though.

I'm just saying that based on how they've advertised this all as working, this isn't how it's supposed to go.

As a consumer, to me, this looks like "We'll charge you extra just to ensure you can ride this one ride on any normal day and if you come on a busier day, we'll charge you more and if you come on an even busier day, we'll charge you even more but come on a really busy day and we're going to lump it in with this lower tier product."

To me, this just shows how flawed the whole setup really is.

It's like as if with their variable rate pricing for tickets, things keep going up until you hit holiday week and then suddenly those days drop to base pricing because Disney's admitting that with the parks as packed as they are, it's going to end up being a miserable experience for a lot of people and they shouldn't pay top dollar to be in the parks on the days when they are going to struggle the most to get around and have access to the fewest attractions through the day.

That's the reality but that's not how Disney typically markets so that they're doing that here seems to suggest they're really struggling with guest satisfaction for this new system.

 

[MrPromey]

And it’s not surprising. It’s pretty obvious that they don’t have enough ride capacity to remove 2 rides from G+ in each park. They should have just gone with 1 ILL in each park from the start to make Genie+ more tolerable/successful.

Or maybe only offered it on attractions that were in such demand that there was a point to doing it to begin with rather than deciding that each park needed a certain number for individual up-charges to begin with?

 

[flynnibus]

As a consumer, to me, this looks like

Meh. Most customers are not sampling at all those different points.. so it's not a comparison real customers are facing.

I think its more people will see it as 'things are still changing' and maybe question 'what will the system be when *I* go?" and the uncertainty that can generate.

 

[MrPromey]

Meh. Most customers are not sampling at all those different points.. so it's not a comparison real customers are facing.

I think its more people will see it as 'things are still changing' and maybe question 'what will the system be when *I* go?" and the uncertainty that can generate.

I'm just glad to see their scheme doesn't appear to be working as well for them as they expected.

 

[flynnibus]

I'm just glad to see their scheme doesn't appear to be working as well for them as they expected.

I think we're gonna see lots of iterations yet to come.

One of the advantages of a 'no advanced sales' model is they can reduce the advanced notice needed to implement change.

 

[mikejs78]

I think we're gonna see lots of iterations yet to come.

One of the advantages of a 'no advanced sales' model is they can reduce the advanced notice needed to implement change.

There is advanced sales. You can add it onto your ticket.

 

[BrianLo]

I don’t think this is temporary. I also expect Rat will join G+ (it’s new, but it’s not actually that low capacity and the sheen should wear off soon enough).

Genie Plus is marketed on the premise that a guest needs to be able to book AT LEAST 3 useful Lightening Lane a day. With low friction. Regardless of my personal experiences with the system, I can conclude easily from here that isn’t the case.

If you can’t book three based on how they’ve priced the product(s), it’s a rip off. I’m sure they even have data now that satisfaction is contingent on four.

Walt Disney Worlds biggest issue is capacity. Why anyone thought removing two of the most valuable attractions from each park and selling an iteration of their ride skip with less options than previously would be looked on favorably, is beyond me. Maybe they didn’t anticipate so much uptake. The biggest reason so many posters hate this is because of capacity. If there was no ILL I’d imagine significantly less dissatisfaction.

That said, I actually don’t think ILL is terrible if limited to one per park. There’s going to be less complaints about someone buying G+ with the expectation they can have the most popular attraction (only for it to sell out), versus not allowing them to specifically buy that a la carte option (because it is sold out).

Heck, G+ Might actually be worth it for Epcot eventually. It’s still not for AK.