Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[SirLink]

View attachment 581067

Nailed it.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

In perpetuity? There is no intersection between supply and demand? Demand forever outstrips supply? Again not arguing, just trying to understand your pov.

I mean if Disney built 12 gates, at some point they're going to hit a limit.

The way to alleviate perceived crowding is to add capacity that DOESN'T increase demand. The only thing I can think of that has fit the bill here would be Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy. It adds capacity to DHS, but nobody is booking a trip just to experience it. There's very little like that, that Disney can build without drawing new clicks through the gate.

 

[Myth Maker]

It is pretty interesting that a party ticket is now often more than a full-day admission. Sometimes a lot more. I believe the Christmas party tops out at $250 a person?

$20 an hour for park admission would be reasonable, especially if parades / street performers and fireworks are being performed.

8 hour day = $160
12 hour day = $240

Part of this as well is are you getting 1 good experience per hour? If you are then you will be very happy paying more up front. If not, or if asked to pay even more during that time, you won't be nearly as happy.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

I think it’s possible that all of the new headliner rides (tron, guardians) will be boarding groups or paid option, with no option to wait in line.

For a period of time, sure. But I don't think that's going to continue in perpetuity.

When Guardians opens, for example, I expect Rat to go to normal standby.

 

[DCLcruiser]

We'll have to agree to disagree on this.

I'll just say that I remember spending college in Boston. If it rained, the cabs seemed to disappear or be full. Uber would have given us a chance to get a ride bc some people would have said never-mind and walked.

 

[lentesta]

Fp and Genie is not to shorten lines, Disney never said that and no civil engineer would say that either(unless the park had less guests than saturation on that day). It is nothing more than some people getting shorter lines on some rides. Say whatever you want about the new system, like or hate it, it is not going to make the standby lines any shorter.

FP was definitely not made to shorten lines - Disney was willing to slightly increase waits if it meant higher guest satisfaction when using FP+.

There's some wiggle room in the Genie press release about exactly what it's trying to do:

Sometimes you may know exactly what you want to do, but may not know the best time or order in which to do it. You’ll be able to tell Disney Genie what you’d like to experience, and it will quickly evaluate millions of options to present you with an optimal day. And best of all, it’s flexible! If you change your mind for any reason, Disney Genie will re-optimize your day.

The definitions of "best time or order" along with "quickly evaluate millions of options" and "optimal day" are vague enough for the lawyers to be comfortable that nobody can pin Disney down on exactly what they're advertising.

 

[Missing20K]

I’d be surprised if Rat is still doing boarding groups by the time Tron opens. And certainly it will stop once GOTG opens in the same park

So it would be TT and GotG? I thought there always has to be two “high demand” pay per ride options not included in G+ per park at virtually all times.

I mean if Disney built 12 gates, at some point they're going to hit a limit.

The way to alleviate perceived crowding is to add capacity that DOESN'T increase demand. The only thing I can think of that has fit the bill here would be Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy. It adds capacity to DHS, but nobody is booking a trip just to experience it. There's very little like that, that Disney can build without drawing new clicks through the gate.

Stunt shows, M&G and the like. I can understand that reasoning. Why not both? Build a big E and a C/D like Pandora and GE but also add a show or three and maybe an A/B?? Well besides $$$

 

[doctornick]

I mean if Disney built 12 gates, at some point they're going to hit a limit.

The way to alleviate perceived crowding is to add capacity that DOESN'T increase demand. The only thing I can think of that has fit the bill here would be Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy. It adds capacity to DHS, but nobody is booking a trip just to experience it. There's very little like that, that Disney can build without drawing new clicks through the gate.

I think A.S.S. also fits that bill.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

So it would be TT and GotG? I thought there always has to be two “high demand” pay per ride options not included in G+ per park at virtually all times.

Two different things. Something can be pay-per-ride and not boarding group, e.g. Mine Train.

BG and pay-per-ride: Rise, Rat, Tron (probably)
Standby and pay-per-ride: Mine Train, Space Mountain, Flight of Passage, Kilimanjaro, Test Track, Slinky
Standby and Genie+: Basically everything else

 

[Missing20K]

So it would be TT and GotG? I thought there always has to be two “high demand” pay per ride options not included in G+ per park at virtually all times.

Reading through it again, I suppose they could drop it to one IAS eligible ride or perhaps even none. Which may increase the value of G+

 

[Missing20K]

Two different things. Something can be pay-per-ride and not boarding group, e.g. Mine Train.

BG and pay-per-ride: Rise, Rat, Tron (probably)
Standby and pay-per-ride: Mine Train, Space Mountain, Flight of Passage, Kilimanjaro, Test Track, Slinky
Standby and Genie+: Basically everything else

So there could be rides that are IAS without BG and a normal standby line. I wonder if the standby lines for headliners without BG could ever close and go to a VQ.

 

[LittleBuford]

I'm assuming it's the money it costs. Leaving a bad taste in people's mouths to have to pay for what was once free.

But the charge is what will ensure that fewer people use it. That's what many here were asking for.

 

[el_super]

Are you practicing for your interview in the industrial engineering department of Imagineering?

Nope... just trying to explain what seems to be happening in the parks. I'm sure it's far more complicated than even I can comprehend.

As has been mentioned - I think in this thread - they need to add a bunch of Little Mermaid level rides to each of the parks. Basically rides that add a lot of capacity but that no one would book a trip or extra day to go and do.

The way to alleviate perceived crowding is to add capacity that DOESN'T increase demand. The only thing I can think of that has fit the bill here would be Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy.

What your both describing is close to what they're already trying to do: a tier system for attractions.

And yeah, in a way that was probably driving the decision to build the Little Mermaid ride, which is a great capacity attraction... but it hasn't really helped lower the line at Space Mountain.

Disney still has to build blockbuster attractions to keep people coming to the park, and whatever attraction they build is still going to have to have some form of queue management system.

 

[pdude81]

I mean if Disney built 12 gates, at some point they're going to hit a limit.

The way to alleviate perceived crowding is to add capacity that DOESN'T increase demand. The only thing I can think of that has fit the bill here would be Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy. It adds capacity to DHS, but nobody is booking a trip just to experience it. There's very little like that, that Disney can build without drawing new clicks through the gate.

They can't seem to justify new spending without projected growth or cuts elsewhere though. I agree on racing academy, but if that building wasn't already there I expect there's no way it would have been added.

 

[LittleBuford]

It should be better for the people who use it, but worse for the people who don't. To what degree, will depend on how many people use it in a given day.

I suspect it will favour tourists. What's another $15 or $20 a day when you're spending thousands of dollars? Locals who visit frequently will be more likely to balk at an extra fee each time.

The price is low enough that I think it will be popular, and will end up pushing people on the fence to buying in as well, because it will continue to impact standby wait times. If it becomes a de facto necessity, then it's ultimately just another price increase. That's one reason for negative reactions.

Another is access to something like RoTR which is already difficult, and slapping a price tag on it might feel like a slap in the face.

If your assessment is correct, I wonder if the reaction here would have been more positive if the pricing were prohibitively expensive. That seems counterintuitive, but then I've never really understood what people were looking for in a replacement system anyway.

 

[DCLcruiser]

So there could be rides that are IAS without BG and a normal standby line. I wonder if the standby lines for headliners without BG could ever close and go to a VQ.

IAS is based on popularity. If today, Jungle Cruise is mobbed bc The Rock was seen standing outside the attraction it could become IAS today and today only. At that point, SM could drop down to DG+.

 

[Missing20K]

IAS is based on popularity. If today, Jungle Cruise is mobbed bc the Rock was seen standing outside the attraction it could become IAS today and today only. At that point, SM could drop down to DG+.

I understand that. But if the Rock is there and the standby becomes 210 min cuz everyone smells what the Rock is cooking, then what? We are back to where we started, no?

 

[DCLcruiser]

I understand that. But if the Rock is there and the standby becomes 210 min cuz everyone smells what the Rock is cooking, then what? We are back to where we started, no?

IAS lets you skip the line. So you get to ride this incredibly popular attraction while everyone else is waiting in line for free.

 

[TalkingHead]

I mean if Disney built 12 gates, at some point they're going to hit a limit.

The way to alleviate perceived crowding is to add capacity that DOESN'T increase demand. The only thing I can think of that has fit the bill here would be Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy. It adds capacity to DHS, but nobody is booking a trip just to experience it. There's very little like that, that Disney can build without drawing new clicks through the gate.

There's a lot they could build -- but they'd have to refrain from marketing everything like an E-ticket. The old 90s Lion King show in Fantasyland is a good example; very few people would plan trips just to see something like that, but it adds capacity, entertainment value, and fills out a park.

They add very little at that scale and consequently everything they add is treated like a new headliner.

 

[aliceismad]

They can't seem to justify new spending without projected growth or cuts elsewhere though. I agree on racing academy, but if that building wasn't already there I expect there's no way it would have been added.

They also had the animatronic tech from Cars Land.