palmage
Member
Not sticking up for the French but dont forget peeps they HELPED the Americans win the Revolutionary War....
lol
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Liberation Day 4/24
- Thread starter starwood
- Start date
lol
Glen Quagmire
New Member
The United States would also have a few things to be ashamed of, especially from the view point of some international guests.
calicommando
Active Member
At any rate "HAPPY LIBERATION DAY!"
Timmay
Well-Known Member
Why wouldn't they??:shrug:
May 8th is WWII Liberation Day in France, a national public holiday. As is November 11th.
Or better historians, actually. Most of the liberating??...not at all.
I think it sounds like a great celebration to have, and one they should have...even in Disney. Why would the folks in Germany (or over in Japan) feel uncomfortable. How many of them actually had anything to do with the war?
teebin
Member
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Germany has about as many people left who had anything to do with the war as there are Italians left who were actually "liberated" from the Germans. So why celebrate Liberation Day if there is no one left who was actually liberated?
Yet the fact remains that the Italians were liberated from the Axis Powers who invaded their country and killed countless civilians and soldiers. The Norway and France pavilions would also have WWII Liberation Days to celebrate, I would imagine.
Perhaps a better question might be; Does the Germany Pavilion at Epcot ever acknowledge World War II via a special day or event?
CRO-Magnum
Active Member
Of course Candians say that out of pride...
...in the role they played however Canada never had the committment to WWII of the US with less than 60% of eligible males in uniform. Yes Canada played a role in the liberation Italy where half of its 95,000 casualties occured. However the US, who overall had 950,000 casualties, was involved from the start including the draft of the plans for the invasion which was a joint effort primarily composed of US forces under General Patton and the Brits under General Montgomery. It was the US taking of Palermo that inspired the coup d'etat against Mussolini. US forces were held back by Allied Central Command to provide the Brits an opportunity to grab the glory and lift spirits at home. In reality the Polish army played as big a role in the liberation of Italy as did the Canadians.
Canada joined the war early because of their relations with Britain recognizing the King of Britain as the King of Canada as well as the Statute of Westminster. Of course right before delcaring war Canada bought military items from the US which would have been precluded if done after declaring war (very smart!).
The US joined both wars late for the same reason - why join a war early. It's like saying the French joined the American Revoluion late. Countries not directly attacked usually get involved in war due to treaties. In WWI remember the balance of treaties among European powers drew the battlle lines far in advance of the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand. That war was the natural result of imperial Europe so there was little reason for the US to join. Regarding WWII the US was never threatened and again there were no treaties requiring US involvement in the war even after the attack by Japan. However the US put the Pacific theater, the only real threat to the US, on hold for three years while focusing effort on the European theater. I can't think of a more generous move by any country in the history of history, and of course one for which we get NO credit. In reality the US was involved from the begining because it was the US war machine that powered Europe through most of WWII before, during, and after our actual involvement.
Nah... they switched to the Allied Forces' side a bit before the end of the war.
Interesting note: The Canadian history texts/educational history videos basically say to some extent: while the Canadians did most of the liberating, the US forces (who joined both World Wars late) came in maybe a day early and "took most of the glory".
"What is history, but a fable agreed upon?"
...in the role they played however Canada never had the committment to WWII of the US with less than 60% of eligible males in uniform. Yes Canada played a role in the liberation Italy where half of its 95,000 casualties occured. However the US, who overall had 950,000 casualties, was involved from the start including the draft of the plans for the invasion which was a joint effort primarily composed of US forces under General Patton and the Brits under General Montgomery. It was the US taking of Palermo that inspired the coup d'etat against Mussolini. US forces were held back by Allied Central Command to provide the Brits an opportunity to grab the glory and lift spirits at home. In reality the Polish army played as big a role in the liberation of Italy as did the Canadians.
Canada joined the war early because of their relations with Britain recognizing the King of Britain as the King of Canada as well as the Statute of Westminster. Of course right before delcaring war Canada bought military items from the US which would have been precluded if done after declaring war (very smart!).
The US joined both wars late for the same reason - why join a war early. It's like saying the French joined the American Revoluion late. Countries not directly attacked usually get involved in war due to treaties. In WWI remember the balance of treaties among European powers drew the battlle lines far in advance of the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand. That war was the natural result of imperial Europe so there was little reason for the US to join. Regarding WWII the US was never threatened and again there were no treaties requiring US involvement in the war even after the attack by Japan. However the US put the Pacific theater, the only real threat to the US, on hold for three years while focusing effort on the European theater. I can't think of a more generous move by any country in the history of history, and of course one for which we get NO credit. In reality the US was involved from the begining because it was the US war machine that powered Europe through most of WWII before, during, and after our actual involvement.
CRO-Magnum
Active Member
And in the spirit of full disclosure...
...the only reason they did this was to open a second front in Britain's existing war with France to divert resources and attention. It was never France's goal to do anything more than make Britain's life hard. And remember they provided naval vessels, and only a few at that, and they chose the targets.
In other words it was very opportunistic vs. the US involvement in the liberation of France in WWII. One of many things the French don't realize is the US wanted to liberate France earlier in the war however it was the Brits who demanded a Mediteranean campaign. If the US hadn't fought there would not have been a D-Day invasion. Instead France would only have been liberated as an after thought of invading Germany.
Of course that says alot about the value of the French in helping to fight against Germany.
Not sticking up for the French but dont forget peeps they HELPED the Americans win the Revolutionary War....
...the only reason they did this was to open a second front in Britain's existing war with France to divert resources and attention. It was never France's goal to do anything more than make Britain's life hard. And remember they provided naval vessels, and only a few at that, and they chose the targets.
In other words it was very opportunistic vs. the US involvement in the liberation of France in WWII. One of many things the French don't realize is the US wanted to liberate France earlier in the war however it was the Brits who demanded a Mediteranean campaign. If the US hadn't fought there would not have been a D-Day invasion. Instead France would only have been liberated as an after thought of invading Germany.
Of course that says alot about the value of the French in helping to fight against Germany.
CRO-Magnum
Active Member
Don't blame Germany for WWI...
...when in reality you need to blame France and Russia. The war happened in essence because the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand in Serbia which was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. He was directly in line to inherit the throne. He was assassinated by Bosnian nationalists in Bosnia which was part of the Empire. Austria then threatened Bosnia in what was a purely internal affair (like Oklahoma threatening Michicgan because of Tim McVeigh in the Oklahoma City bombing). Bosnia was a largely Russian Orthodox country so Russia agreed to come to its aid if invaded by Austria. Germany had a treaty with Austria to come to its aid against Russia if threatened. But France had a treaty with Russia to open a second front on Germany if it threatened Russia. Austria's treaty with Germany reciprocated that Austria would threaten France if France threatened Germany. Britain had an understanding, not an actual treaty, they would help France if threatened by Germany.
See, this is what happens when we leave Europe to govern foreign affairs their way!!!
So make sure you blame France and Russia first for getting involved in a purely internal affair of another country. Germany may have fired the first shot but don't think for a second France or Russia didn't try to beat them too it - they just couldn't mobilize as quickly.
Of course on those lines you can argue against the US involvement in Iraq but I'll leave that to you.
...when in reality you need to blame France and Russia. The war happened in essence because the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand in Serbia which was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. He was directly in line to inherit the throne. He was assassinated by Bosnian nationalists in Bosnia which was part of the Empire. Austria then threatened Bosnia in what was a purely internal affair (like Oklahoma threatening Michicgan because of Tim McVeigh in the Oklahoma City bombing). Bosnia was a largely Russian Orthodox country so Russia agreed to come to its aid if invaded by Austria. Germany had a treaty with Austria to come to its aid against Russia if threatened. But France had a treaty with Russia to open a second front on Germany if it threatened Russia. Austria's treaty with Germany reciprocated that Austria would threaten France if France threatened Germany. Britain had an understanding, not an actual treaty, they would help France if threatened by Germany.
See, this is what happens when we leave Europe to govern foreign affairs their way!!!
So make sure you blame France and Russia first for getting involved in a purely internal affair of another country. Germany may have fired the first shot but don't think for a second France or Russia didn't try to beat them too it - they just couldn't mobilize as quickly.
Of course on those lines you can argue against the US involvement in Iraq but I'll leave that to you.
calicommando
Active Member
Whoa, this thread got boring. :snore:
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Wait, you forgot to mention how horrible America is as a country and how we owe everyone a big apology for everything. Remember, America is bad, everyone else is good. If you try to deny that, the PC Police will bust in on this thread again and tell you to be ashamed of yourself for being American. :hammer:
By the way, thanks for the brush up on the history lesson. It's so important to remember the incredibly painful sacrifices previous generations of Americans made so that we could all sit here 60 years later fat and happy typing away at our keyboards about a theme park in Florida.
But now it's the 21st century and those sacrifices are long forgotten, so please don't forget; America = Bad, Everyone Else = Good.
Timmay
Well-Known Member
Can't tell if this is sarcasm or not...so if it is, just ignore the following. By your reasoning, Independance Day is a waste of time, becuase, you know, all those founding father guys are dead, as well as all the folks that fought for freedom from England.
As I said earlier, France has a national holiday on May 8th celebrating liberation and the end of the war, so that would be more than acceptable in the pavilion.
Why would it, since Germany has no such national holiday. They very well could celebrate Unity Day, which commemorates the fall of the Berlin Wall.
Craig & Lisa
Active Member
The Japan Pavilion would also have some embarassed fumbling to do on days that neighboring pavilions are celebrating victory and liberation from World War II. :veryconfu[/quote]
The icon for the Japan Pavillion that sits in the World Showcase Lagoon I believe comes from Hiroshima, think about that. But, from what I remember good luck to those who pass under it.
The icon for the Japan Pavillion that sits in the World Showcase Lagoon I believe comes from Hiroshima, think about that. But, from what I remember good luck to those who pass under it.