PacNWTigger
Well-Known Member
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LA Times: Is Disney Paying Its Fair Share In Anaheim
- Thread starter the.dreamfinder
- Start date
flynnibus
Premium Member
Yeah, but you don't visit Seawolrd over Disneyland simply because of tax differences
Darkbeer1
Well-Known Member
I explained by absence in the Eastern Gateway Thread...
OK, I am back...
Make this short.
Basically died in February, got septic shock and my body completely shut down. Was in a Coma for a week, and in the Hospital (actually 2) and a nursing home (Not a place I recommend), got back home, but had to learn a lot of things, like standing, walking and using my hands. My mind wasn't affected too much. Still recovering, but have greatly exceeded my Doctor's and medical team expectations. I was going up a flight of stairs within a month of getting home (My bedroom and office is upstairs, ended up converting the family room and living room as a temporary bedroom/office.)
So, I did spend some of my time dealing with neighborhood issues, especially the recall of Senator Newnan, and West Anaheim's issues of permit parking and homeless in the parks.Plus still dealing with many city staff members in multiple departments/ Also have learned the current dysfunctional city council, and the multi-layers of the problems between each other and with city staff. (Many senior members have been asked to leave/retire due to disagreements with the Mayor and selected council members. Plus the current changeover to districts is a mess, as it is only partially finished. The November 2018 election will bring a new Mayor, the last two districts will get a representive (I live in district 2, which has no specific councilmember yet) And due to a random lot, District 3's councilmember, Dr. Jose Moreno has to run for reelection. And Anaheim does not do primaries, it is the person with the most votes that wins (no majority needed).
Plus there are a lot of new dynamics in politics in the area, as the Democrats have targeted Orange County as an area to gain seats in the US House of representatives, and a lot of money and union support is being funneled into the area.
And this does effect the Anaheim Planning Commission, and why many projects have been placed on hold, not just the eastern gateway. The state is passing more laws taking away local control of zoning related items. including housing (in the name of affordable housing and required parking space. And with the current council not being able to agree on things, trying to plan for appeals is hard. (Any Planning Commission decision can be appealed to the city council).
So folks are deciding to try and wait until the new 2018 council is in charge, if possible.
Disney felt the deck was stacked against them after the last planning commission meeting, and knowing the Mayor and his sidekick, Dr, Moreno think that an "anti-Disney" stance is what they want, and think it matches up with what others think. And that is the agenda their allies (think Unions like Unite HERE) want also. (And have the power to get biased "articles" published in the LA Times). If you don't know about it, AnaheimBlog.net has a lot of interesting info about the article and how it was prepared.
So Disney is feeling the heat from within its own company as to "Why hasn't the Eastern Gateway started?" Well, the resort folks do what they like to do, kick the can down the road (aka timeline). As someone mentioned, the new fiscal year has started, and the "company" wants to start building NOW, so the Resort folks now have to get it agreed to, nd to be honest, they are not sure of any plan that could guarantee approval by the planning commission (think the non-Disney business on Harbor), and then the city council, who wants to score "points" for their agenda, and wants some sort of "payoff", aka more taxes and fees or maybe some property that can be used by the city for something like a homeless shelter or affordable housing.
So Disney is trapped, and is getting mixed messages from different departments, Government Affairs is saying, we can't agree to new taxes and fees to prevent future requests, Parks and resorts is saying, don't spend too much money on the project, especially those items that don't make us money (aka more access to leave the property).Something has got to give. Heck, the approval process from submitting the plan until getting final approval is at least 3 months, if not longer. Yes, Disney can start on the actual parking structure, as that is already zoned and approved as part of the Master Plan, but the security check and bridge isn't. And since they will work together, Disney doesn't want to start yet. Plus they need the current spaces.
Has Disney been talking to the 'neighbors", yes, but they are a bit gun-shy due to the information that got released early this year. And Disney has been talking to city staff (which unfortunately has had the city manager fired along with others, causing some issues of what direction to take.) And the council members that support both Disney and the pro-business Chamber of Commerce, which is now in the minority. I was at a meeting Tuesday night, sitting next to one of them, and couldn't even say much to each other except hello, even though we have an on going dialogue that goes back decades. It has become that toxic, and it is a shame that the three are being treated in such a poor manner by two others.
Will it get done, IMHO, yes, but a lot of things that affect the current and future relationship between the city, and California’s largest single site employer will have to be dealt with. And it does play into the November 2018 election, and who gets the financial support for the new Mayor, a replacement for Dr. Moreno, who only won by 72 votes, and the District 2 and 6 seats.
OK, I am back...
Make this short.
Basically died in February, got septic shock and my body completely shut down. Was in a Coma for a week, and in the Hospital (actually 2) and a nursing home (Not a place I recommend), got back home, but had to learn a lot of things, like standing, walking and using my hands. My mind wasn't affected too much. Still recovering, but have greatly exceeded my Doctor's and medical team expectations. I was going up a flight of stairs within a month of getting home (My bedroom and office is upstairs, ended up converting the family room and living room as a temporary bedroom/office.)
So, I did spend some of my time dealing with neighborhood issues, especially the recall of Senator Newnan, and West Anaheim's issues of permit parking and homeless in the parks.Plus still dealing with many city staff members in multiple departments/ Also have learned the current dysfunctional city council, and the multi-layers of the problems between each other and with city staff. (Many senior members have been asked to leave/retire due to disagreements with the Mayor and selected council members. Plus the current changeover to districts is a mess, as it is only partially finished. The November 2018 election will bring a new Mayor, the last two districts will get a representive (I live in district 2, which has no specific councilmember yet) And due to a random lot, District 3's councilmember, Dr. Jose Moreno has to run for reelection. And Anaheim does not do primaries, it is the person with the most votes that wins (no majority needed).
Plus there are a lot of new dynamics in politics in the area, as the Democrats have targeted Orange County as an area to gain seats in the US House of representatives, and a lot of money and union support is being funneled into the area.
And this does effect the Anaheim Planning Commission, and why many projects have been placed on hold, not just the eastern gateway. The state is passing more laws taking away local control of zoning related items. including housing (in the name of affordable housing and required parking space. And with the current council not being able to agree on things, trying to plan for appeals is hard. (Any Planning Commission decision can be appealed to the city council).
So folks are deciding to try and wait until the new 2018 council is in charge, if possible.
Disney felt the deck was stacked against them after the last planning commission meeting, and knowing the Mayor and his sidekick, Dr, Moreno think that an "anti-Disney" stance is what they want, and think it matches up with what others think. And that is the agenda their allies (think Unions like Unite HERE) want also. (And have the power to get biased "articles" published in the LA Times). If you don't know about it, AnaheimBlog.net has a lot of interesting info about the article and how it was prepared.
So Disney is feeling the heat from within its own company as to "Why hasn't the Eastern Gateway started?" Well, the resort folks do what they like to do, kick the can down the road (aka timeline). As someone mentioned, the new fiscal year has started, and the "company" wants to start building NOW, so the Resort folks now have to get it agreed to, nd to be honest, they are not sure of any plan that could guarantee approval by the planning commission (think the non-Disney business on Harbor), and then the city council, who wants to score "points" for their agenda, and wants some sort of "payoff", aka more taxes and fees or maybe some property that can be used by the city for something like a homeless shelter or affordable housing.
So Disney is trapped, and is getting mixed messages from different departments, Government Affairs is saying, we can't agree to new taxes and fees to prevent future requests, Parks and resorts is saying, don't spend too much money on the project, especially those items that don't make us money (aka more access to leave the property).Something has got to give. Heck, the approval process from submitting the plan until getting final approval is at least 3 months, if not longer. Yes, Disney can start on the actual parking structure, as that is already zoned and approved as part of the Master Plan, but the security check and bridge isn't. And since they will work together, Disney doesn't want to start yet. Plus they need the current spaces.
Has Disney been talking to the 'neighbors", yes, but they are a bit gun-shy due to the information that got released early this year. And Disney has been talking to city staff (which unfortunately has had the city manager fired along with others, causing some issues of what direction to take.) And the council members that support both Disney and the pro-business Chamber of Commerce, which is now in the minority. I was at a meeting Tuesday night, sitting next to one of them, and couldn't even say much to each other except hello, even though we have an on going dialogue that goes back decades. It has become that toxic, and it is a shame that the three are being treated in such a poor manner by two others.
Will it get done, IMHO, yes, but a lot of things that affect the current and future relationship between the city, and California’s largest single site employer will have to be dealt with. And it does play into the November 2018 election, and who gets the financial support for the new Mayor, a replacement for Dr. Moreno, who only won by 72 votes, and the District 2 and 6 seats.
Phroobar
Well-Known Member
You guys are willing to pay $10 a person for fast passes. $50 for two rides could definitely happen depending on how immersive the experience is.
mickEblu
Well-Known Member
Well I haven't yet but I would pay for max pass on the right type of trip. I agree, 50$ was a base price assumption. I'm just really curious if they gave any thought to my idea or any reasonable explanation of why that was never an option.
Phroobar
Well-Known Member
Wasn't that the rumor from that crazy guy over at LP? They were going to build a bridge over to the Simba parking lot for SW land and then a new star wars themed hotel was going act as a berm. That guy was 100% sure that was going to happen and even said he saw mock ups and models of it. His rep got completely destroyed when SW land was announced for Disneyland.
mickEblu
Well-Known Member
Haha I've seen references to that crazy guy over here but I've never been on laughing place. I've independently armchair imagineered other stuff going in the Simba lot.
Phroobar
Well-Known Member
Oh good. I'd hate to think that crazy guy was you.
mickEblu
Well-Known Member
Oh good. I'd hate to think that crazy guy was you.
Lol. I could be lying too.
Phroobar
Well-Known Member
Disney Irish
Premium Member
One of the biggest reasons I can see for it not having gone there was they will likely rebuild PPH after the new hotel gets built. Then will likely build a new parking structure on top of Simba.
mickEblu
Well-Known Member
Ya, a parking structure could be it. But man, I know people would be willing to pay a premium for a boutique Star Wars hotel connected to a Star Wars park. I would love to know if that ever even made it into a discussion.
Darkbeer1
Well-Known Member
And now we get back to a can of words, and the political climate.
While a Hotel is part of the Master Plan, any type of expansion in size, number of rooms, facilities, etc. could require many types of permits, environmental studies, etc. to get a new Hotel Building(s) approved. This is why many owners opt for a major remodel instead. I remember the conversion of the Sheraton Park Hotel. They closed the property and gutted the building, leaving only the concrete and steel shell, and totally rebuilt the structure with new electrical, plumbing, etc. It took awhile, and even might have been more expensive to re-build than starting from scratch. But the savings was keeping the permits and grandfathered rules.
disneylandcm
Well-Known Member
If Disney builds a CM parking structure on Harbor/Ball and an Eastern Gateway structure for guests behind the businesses on Harbor what does the Toy Story lot become? Thank you and welcome back! Best wishes on your renewed heath.
Disney Irish
Premium Member
Well any rebuild of PPH is likely 5 years or more away anyways, so whatever political climate is happening today will likely be gone by then.
Darkbeer1
Well-Known Member
Remains parking for now. Currently Disney has a shortage of CM spaces, and guests spaces. For example, there have been many days when the CM portion of the Katella Lot has been switched to Toy Story Parking.
The Pummba Structure is designed to deal with additional guests due to Galaxy Edge expansion. You will need more parking when DCA is expanded. (Both parks will have a higher Fire Marshall Capacity due to the increased acreage). Also building of the 4th Hotel will take away parking during construction, and will need more spaces when open.
So the new parking structure for CM parking will give the company enough spaces for CM parking current needs, and hopefully allow the Katella CM lot to close and the entire area can be converted to Toy Story Guest Parking, to meet the current busy days needs along with Pummba.
Also, since the current Pummba ground lot is usually full with CM parking, they will need new spaces when the Eastern Gateway gets started, along with more parking needed for the construction workers, which usually have in their contract nearby parking due to tools that are brought to the job.
Disney's most pressing need for land use is parking for guests, CM's and employees for Downtown Disney, plus the construction workers and equipment.
Just like the DCA expansion needs the Eastern Gateway project to be completed, so they can convert the current Transportation Hub to park land. You nned spaces for CM parking on the ground lot at Ball and Harbor to allow construction. It is one big puzzle. When the parking situation is fixed, then you can look at some available land and plan for the future.
@Darkbeer1
Any thoughts on automated parking structures like the one recently built in West Hollywood?
Any thoughts on automated parking structures like the one recently built in West Hollywood?
Last edited:
Darkbeer1
Well-Known Member
YES, the speed of the system wouldn't work, also possible breakdowns. Not worth the additional cost for some need for less space per vehicle.
I think pre-paid parking and allowing automated gates might be a way to go, but Disney always has issues with guests not reading signs, and one car entering the line without payment shuts the entire line down.
Maybe a combination Manned booth with a reader, which allows the guest to just go through if pre-paid, and the CM to assist if needed. This would speed up every line and require less CM hours (saves labor costs).
njDizFan
Well-Known Member
The 43% number being thrown around is a complete non sequitur. Does it matter if TWDC is paying 1% or 99% of the taxes. Using a ratio for comparison only shows one side of the story. Disney making up such a large proportion of the income only shows how depressed the rest of Anaheim has become. NYC brought in 71 billion in tax income in 2016. Using the same metric in a different location will change the narrative. The rest I will leave for everyone else to debate.
flynnibus
Premium Member
eh?? The use of the ratio is exactly what keeps it relevant and in context. It's not about the total dollars Disney pays, the metric is about the significance of Disney to the local tax base. Absolute dollars from another city is the irrelevant stat. Anaheim doesn't operate on another city's budget.
It's not about how 'depressed' the rest of Anaheim is, purely about the how large Disney has become relative to it's neighboring businesses.
When people say "disney isn't paying enough"... pointing out how much of "enough" already comes from Disney adds perspective. "enough" is a portion of the total.. and stating how much already comes from Disney is a reference.