Jungle Cruise Re-Imagining

[SorcererMC]

And actually the Trader Sam character really didn't have any pronounced ethnicity...He could be of any derivation really...so he is not necessarily an appropriation... Maybe they will remake him more of a world explorer and trader...and not of any indigenous culture...

That's not true. The headhunter reference is specific to Jivaro indigenous peoples, who had a reputation as fierce warriors against the Conquista.

 

[tirian]

EDIT: These changes would be infinitely more palatable if the replacements were equal to or better than the quality of the item removed but they are not. I have absolutely no faith in the final decision makers to get these things right.

This is everything. “DiSneeLAnd Is nOt a MooooSE-um” is almost always an excuse for poorly planned, poorly executed changes.

 

[Parker in NYC]

I fear for my Tiki birds. I really do. I'm a complete hypocrite for letting (well, Disney doesn't need my permission!) Disney rethink/redo attractions to reflect the times but then scream about my fears that they'll change my favorite attraction. I understand, I really do. But I'm truly stubborn and contradictory.

 

[tirian]

That's not true. The headhunter reference is specific to Jivaro indigenous peoples, who had a reputation as fierce warriors against the Conquista.

It was that specific? There were never, ever, ever any other headhunters in any other culture in the entire history of the world?

 

[SorcererMC]

It was that specific? There were never, ever, ever any other headhunters in any other culture in the entire history of the world?

Yes. They were the only ones in South America. IIRC. It's been a long time since high school.

 

[tirian]

Yes. They were the only ones in South America. IIRC. It's been a long time since high school.

Was he specifically in South America, or a generalized jungle?

I thought Brazil was up front with the plastic butterflies, LOL.

(Point being, it was always tongue-in-cheek.)

 

[WEDway Inc & Company LLC]

Doesn't look like Jungle Cruise is on the list of open attractions for DLR....

https://disneyland.disney.go.com/experience-updates/parks-tickets/#drawer-card-disneylandAttractionsEntertainment

 

[Rich Brownn]

The haters can hate me if they want, but I never really was much amused by Trader Sam to be honest, as a kid I was actually kinda terrifed of the idea of shrunken heads {still am truth be told} As an adult I've come to see the genius behind the characters, the workmanship of the model makers to make a model. but lets be real here, its been stated before, Disney is doing this because they feel it should changfe and be more "in the times"

I never recalled Jungle Cruise or even Juingle Cruise as having a story to it like the other rides {pirates, Haunted Mansion, Peter Pan, even the dumbo or space mountain have stories behind them to help sell the ride as a fun experience}

Walt himself was always looking at a ride, riding it and thinking "What is wrong with it and how can we do better ?" So in this update to Jungle Cruise, Disney is trying to do as its namesake creator was doing and making it better. Even if it makes people, die hard fans of the ride for example, upset, Disney doesnt care, they see something not working, they wanna fix it and make it work right. somehow they want to add a story to Jungle Cruise, I say let them, I want to see it with a good story, and I'm a sucker for a good story {its how I got sucked into Skyrim, but that's another story entirely!}

So me, like I said, the haters can rant at me all they like, I for one am excited for these changes.

It's interesting because originally the JC was very serious. Disney himself asked Marc Davis to add gags to it in the 60s and there was a lot of controversy back then about making it "funny"

 

[UNCgolf]

It's interesting because originally the JC was very serious. Disney himself asked Marc Davis to add gags to it in the 60s and there was a lot of controversy back then about making it "funny"

I think that was because he realized it just didn't work as serious documentary style with fake animals even though that's what he originally wanted. Walt probably would have loved the Safari at Animal Kingdom.

 

[AdventureHasAName]

You understand the difference between a Cat and a Race of People, right?

This is not a great analogy.

Yes, I do. Popeye is a human person and a caricature. Is his depiction a denigration? Beetle Bailey is caricature of a white male lazy soldier Is his comic strip offensive? Hagar the Horrible is a viking caricature. Is that comic racist against Norwegians?

 

[AdventureHasAName]

Well for the jungle cruise, they probably stop after removing references to natives being savages and head hunters. Whether it’s based in history or not, whether it’s a characterization or not, whether thousands of people for or against it complain, the company that owns and operates the attraction decided they no longer wanted those scenes in their boat ride.

If your response to every action Disney takes is to say, "Well, it's their company, they can do what they want," that doesn't leave you with a lot of room for discussion.

But wait ... I'm a share-holder in the Walt Disney Company. That means I'm a partial owner of the company. So I guess that means I'm back to being allowed to criticize the decisions the company makes. Lucky me.

 

[THEMEPARKPIONEER]

There so woke how about they drop those prices, you can’t even get a snack without going broke there

 

[SorcererMC]

Hagar the Horrible is a viking caricature. Is that comic racist against Norwegians?

I mean, Vikings didn't actually wear horned helmets. Just sayin'.

 

[MrPromey]

EDIT: These changes would be infinitely more palatable if the replacements were equal to or better than the quality of the item removed but they are not. I have absolutely no faith in the final decision makers to get these things right.

This is my big problem, too. Nothing they do in WDW is ever as good as they promise it will be anymore* and anything they change or update somehow ends up being of lesser quality than what it replaced or having major gotchas attached (mistake on the lake, anyone?).

I mean, they can't even seem to get painting the castle right, these days - come on!



*Unless it's rock work. They'll blow our minds with rock work but rocks aside, they only got half of Avatar Land right.

 

[Brer Panther]

One animatronic was removed from the attraction, jungle cruise didn’t turn into a concrete slab. Maybe not a single person complained about it. Who says Disney is caving to anyone about this.

To my knowledge, there wasn't a petition formed to get Trader Sam taken out of the Jungle Cruise that Disney caved to (coughcoughSplashMountaincoughcough).

 

[LittleBuford]

And actually the Trader Sam character really didn't have any pronounced ethnicity...

That he appeared to many as a generic “native” doesn’t mean he was any less problematic.

ETA: And note that he was intended to look South American (which is how I always interpreted him):

I found a website that quotes from a 1971 newsletter called Walt Disney World News. Here's the passage about Trader Sam (or "Salesman Sam" as they name him):

And waiting around the final bend to welcome guests back to civilization is "Salesman Sam," the South American headhunter, dangling his copious supply of shrunken heads, attempting to entice guests to either become a purchaser or a "purchase."​

For what it's worth, I had always interpreted him to be a caricature of a South American "tribesman".

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[castlecake2.0]

If your response to every action Disney takes is to say, "Well, it's their company, they can do what they want," that doesn't leave you with a lot of room for discussion.

But wait ... I'm a share-holder in the Walt Disney Company. That means I'm a partial owner of the company. So I guess that means I'm back to being allowed to criticize the decisions the company makes. Lucky me.

It’s true though, as a business they made a decision. I didn’t say people aren’t allowed to criticize it, I’m saying they don’t care. I’m a shareholder too, but I doubt either of us own enough shares for us to dictate the design choices of an attraction.

 

[jeanericuser001]

To my knowledge, there wasn't a petition formed to get Trader Sam taken out of the Jungle Cruise that Disney caved to (coughcoughSplashMountaincoughcough).

Two Nine-Year-Olds’ Magnificent Open Letter to Disney About Racial and Gender Stereotypes

“Like most people we love your attractions, but we found some problems with some of them and those problems are stereotypes.”

www.brainpickings.org

Actually this is no different than the sort of bs universal, seaworld, busch gardens, and other places gets all the time from people looking to make a name for themselves and likely raise some money in the process. They manufacture a cause and seek to build controversy. Controversy leads to media attention. Media attention leads to pressure on said companies to cave in to the demands of certain individuals. It also coincidentally leads to donations both to the individuals who started this and those who provide a platform for that person. Inevitably the company in question will in some cases cave in to the demands to avoid negative publicity. Then the media attention slowly dies down while the change is made. The person who started the controversy has made money and gotten their few minutes of fame or infamy while a change is undoubtedly made which has an impact on how the targeted companies does something. Ultimately in the end though its a hollow victory for everyone except the accusers. Each of the major theme parks has had this sort of thing happen and alas few parks actually don't give in to those demands.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

Yes, I do. Popeye is a human person and a caricature. Is his depiction a denigration? Beetle Bailey is caricature of a white male lazy soldier Is his comic strip offensive? Hagar the Horrible is a viking caricature. Is that comic racist against Norwegians?

Yikes.

Way to dig deeper.

 

[Brer Panther]

Two Nine-Year-Olds’ Magnificent Open Letter to Disney About Racial and Gender Stereotypes

“Like most people we love your attractions, but we found some problems with some of them and those problems are stereotypes.”

www.brainpickings.org

I stand corrected.