Is this really a service dog?

[John park hopper]

I have a question I have seen service dogs At WDW when it is 95 degrees and the humidity the same. As a run of the mill dog owner I would never subject my dog to those conditions. Having a service dog is it responsible for the owner to subject their dogs to such conditions simple because I want to go to WDW which really isn't a necessity. Go when its cooler weather and less stress on the animal.. What are your thoughts as a service dog trainer?

 

[jaklgreen]

Sorry but Ive been a dog trainer for 45+ years, working in many fields of training including Guide dogs for the blind, hearing ear dogs and service dogs for w/c dependent users. Also training and certifying therapy dogs that visit in nursing homes and hospital settings. My DW now has had 3 service dogs. We self trained her first dog and DW chose to go to a service dog school for her last 2. I AM very qualified to know what goes into training service dogs, what makes them successful and what disqualifies them.
Ten weeks can not produce a reliably well trained dog no matter how much instinctual ability, or aptitude they may have for doing something. Just basic obedience takes 6- 8 weeks just to get a dog started in understanding commands, and thats getting a dog minimally started.

SO, it sounds like you are agreeing with me. Because I said that there is no way that you can just take "any dog" and train them yourself in a few weeks. It takes a lot of work and a lot of training. I don't have to be a dog trainer to realize that. I must have misinterpreted your post, but it sounded like you were saying that people can just easily train just any dog.

 

[Lilofan]

I have a question I have seen service dogs At WDW when it is 95 degrees and the humidity the same. As a run of the mill dog owner I would never subject my dog to those conditions. Having a service dog is it responsible for the owner to subject their dogs to such conditions simple because I want to go to WDW which really isn't a necessity. Go when its cooler weather and less stress on the animal.. What are your thoughts as a service dog trainer?

Cooler weather at WDW June-Aug?, slim to none. Ideal time is Nov- April

 

[Incomudro]

I don't agree with this at all. Some dogs have the aptitude for certain things. For example, there are service dogs that can predict a seizure. Not all dogs have that ability and can learn to notify their human. Dogs are tested and placed where they do best. I guess it really depends on what "service" the dog is providing. And not only do they have to learn their specific task, they have to learn how to know when they are working, and when they can run around. There is so much more that goes into a true service dog then what you are saying.

I'd seriously like to know how these dogs that can supposedly detect seizures are trained.
In order to train, there needs to be enough examples, repetition, and reward to train.
How many seizure examples can a single dog be trained from?
It's not as though they happen every day.
Even if a group of several people who were prone to seizures were kept around a dog all day, for weeks on end - would enough seizure occur (or be imminent) to not only get a response from the dog, but teach it the desired behavior?
Now, this is not to be confused with dogs trained to stay near a fallen person, or get help for that person in some manner.
Those are different requirements that can readily be trained for.

 

[Bullseye1967]

I'd seriously like to know how these dogs that can supposedly detect seizures are trained.
In order to train, there needs to be enough examples, repetition, and reward to train.
How many seizure examples can a single dog be trained from.
It's not as though they happen every day.
Even if a group of several people who were prone to seizures were kept around a dog all day, for weeks on end - would enough seizure occur (or be imminent) to not only get a response from the dog, but teach it the desired behavior?
Now, this is not to be confused with dogs trained to stay near a fallen person, or get help for that person in some manner.
Those are different requirements that can readily be trained for.

According to the AKC you can not train a dog to alert to a seizure. They are seizure response dogs. It is not known how some dogs can sense a seizure coming.

Seizure Dogs: What are They and What do They Do?

Seizure response dogs are invaluable assets. They assist their owners during frightening and dangerous events. Learn more about seizure dogs here.

www.akc.org

 

[Dear Prudence]

Probably another person taking advantage of the system and not only ruining it for others, but also marginalizing the people who actually need the special assistance and/or are special needs.

I don't know about this case and of course you're a jerk if you speculate or question anything, but you know it happens more often than it should.

I actually need a service dog and won't get one because of the stigma. Stuff like this is actively preventing people who need help from getting it.

 

[NelleBelle]

I actually need a service dog and won't get one because of the stigma. Stuff like this is actively preventing people who need help from getting it.

If you actually need a service dog, then by all means get one. I could give a fig what other people think when I have my service dog with me. Frankly, they're free to ask all the legal questions they want and I'm happy to answer, otherwise, it's none of their business.

 

[Incomudro]

According to the AKC you can not train a dog to alert to a seizure. They are seizure response dogs. It is not known how some dogs can sense a seizure coming.

Seizure Dogs: What are They and What do They Do?

Seizure response dogs are invaluable assets. They assist their owners during frightening and dangerous events. Learn more about seizure dogs here.

www.akc.org

Thank you.
The very idea goes against everything I understand about dogs, and natural science.

 

[Dear Prudence]

If you actually need a service dog, then by all means get one. I could give a fig what other people think when I have my service dog with me. Frankly, they're free to ask all the legal questions they want and I'm happy to answer, otherwise, it's none of their business.

I mean, sure, there are only 2 questions someone can legally ask you for a real and legitimate service dog, but the stigma is real, and I don't think appreciate how bad it actually is.

 

[JIMINYCR]

I actually need a service dog and won't get one because of the stigma. Stuff like this is actively preventing people who need help from getting it.

If you have a real need for a service dog and he/she will improve your quality of life by doing necessary tasks to make your day to day existence easier, then you should look into it. Those who dont actually fit the criteria of needing a dog and get a pet and then portray it as a service dog have caused outrage and furor from flooding every place with unruly dogs.

 

[JIMINYCR]

I have a question I have seen service dogs At WDW when it is 95 degrees and the humidity the same. As a run of the mill dog owner I would never subject my dog to those conditions. Having a service dog is it responsible for the owner to subject their dogs to such conditions simple because I want to go to WDW which really isn't a necessity. Go when its cooler weather and less stress on the animal.. What are your thoughts as a service dog trainer?

You have to understand these dogs are working dogs. They are not pets and you cant relate a pet with a dog that has been trained to work/ do things for the disabled. Service dog owners, as I have said previously, are aware of the conditions they are putting the dogs in and therefore prepare to work in those situations. Those who use a service dog shouldnt stop living their life because the weather isnt ideal. Sure, WDW isnt a necessity but a disabled person should be able to enjoy any vacation spot they choose and their dogs assist them no matter where they go. My DW is very, very aware of conditions and constantly evaluates how her dog is doing so they may take a break from the heat and humidity when she sees the dog is starting to be affected. She usually needs to take a break well before the dog does though.
Let me say this though.... there have been times my DW has left her dog behind because the situation she was going into might adversely affect her dog. She chose to do so because the intense noise or situation might cause future problems in the dogs stability. It is a dog after all and traumatic situations can affect any dog. She will work the dog for 8 - 10 years probably so she will not push the dog or put him in any situation where his working ability or health would be compromised.
When we do go to WDW we do try to go in cooler months, but sometimes it just wont work out. The heat affects my DW adversely and the time she can spend in the parks is minimal during the humid months. But we enjoy life as everyone else does. You dont stop living life because things arent perfect, you work around them and make them work.

 

[correcaminos]

You have to understand these dogs are working dogs. They are not pets and you cant relate a pet with a dog that has been trained to work/ do things for the disabled. Service dog owners, as I have said previously, are aware of the conditions they are putting the dogs in and therefore prepare to work in those situations. Those who use a service dog shouldnt stop living their life because the weather isnt ideal. Sure, WDW isnt a necessity but a disabled person should be able to enjoy any vacation spot they choose and their dogs assist them no matter where they go. My DW is very, very aware of conditions and constantly evaluates how her dog is doing so they may take a break from the heat and humidity when she sees the dog is starting to be affected. She usually needs to take a break well before the dog does though.
Let me say this though.... there have been times my DW has left her dog behind because the situation she was going into might adversely affect her dog. She chose to do so because the intense noise or situation might cause future problems in the dogs stability. It is a dog after all and traumatic situations can affect any dog. She will work the dog for 8 - 10 years probably so she will not push the dog or put him in any situation where his working ability or health would be compromised.
When we do go to WDW we do try to go in cooler months, but sometimes it just wont work out. The heat affects my DW adversely and the time she can spend in the parks is minimal during the humid months. But we enjoy life as everyone else does. You dont stop living life because things arent perfect, you work around them and make them work.

A friend had a dog that couldn't work after horrific storms. It was trauma enough that any thunder was too much. They also tend to leave the dog with in trusted care due to that now. As a guide dog they can leave the dog and use other methods. I know some conditions cannot but yes, handlers/owners understand and take into consideration for sure.

 

[JIMINYCR]

A friend had a dog that couldn't work after horrific storms. It was trauma enough that any thunder was too much. They also tend to leave the dog with in trusted care due to that now. As a guide dog they can leave the dog and use other methods. I know some conditions cannot but yes, handlers/owners understand and take into consideration for sure.

Years ago when I trained Guide Dogs I had a student graduate who took his dog to a ceremony at West Point. At some point in the ceremony they shot off a series of cannons. He was unaware that this was going to be part of the proceedings. After that experience the dog couldnt handle thunder, fireworks, car backfires or any other similar sounds. So the dog was retired and the school had to get him a replacement. He was devastated to have to let go of that dog.
All the dogs in training were tested and evaluated for soundness before training and throughout training but no one can tell whats going to make a dog fall apart. Weve seen the most innocuous situations affect what had been the most sound, reliable dogs and destroy them. Some dogs will work for years having no issues and then for no reason cannot handle something minor and have to retire.

 

[correcaminos]

Years ago when I trained Guide Dogs I had a student graduate who took his dog to a ceremony at West Point. At some point in the ceremony they shot off a series of cannons. He was unaware that this was going to be part of the proceedings. After that experience the dog couldnt handle thunder, fireworks, car backfires or any other similar sounds. So the dog was retired and the school had to get him a replacement. He was devastated to have to let go of that dog.
All the dogs in training were tested and evaluated for soundness before training and throughout training but no one can tell whats going to make a dog fall apart. Weve seen the most innocuous situations affect what had been the most sound, reliable dogs and destroy them. Some dogs will work for years having no issues and then for no reason cannot handle something minor and have to retire.

My cousin taught at West Point a few years. I spent several spring breaks there skiing. The moment you said they took their dog there, I knew where this was going. It is so hard to let go of a dog. I know I watched it and it was so hard to see. Plus the time lost and having to redo training with a new dog (as in the weeks spent at a school to make sure the dog and handler are good fits).

I am aware that dogs do get checked for sound reactions and such, but as you said one never knows what might set one off. Much like I loved thunderstorms until a derecho hit a decade ago. Now I cannot stand them. I assume similar for all animals. Once triggered you cannot fix. Probably in part of why I know some who can leave dogs in good care on some vacations. It's safer that way.

 

[Dear Prudence]

If you have a real need for a service dog and he/she will improve your quality of life by doing necessary tasks to make your day to day existence easier, then you should look into it. Those who dont actually fit the criteria of needing a dog and get a pet and then portray it as a service dog have caused outrage and furor from flooding every place with unruly dogs.

Okay, but are you going to pay for one?

 

[JIMINYCR]

Okay, but are you going to pay for one?

No need to be flippant, you brought it up and I was trying to help. So you know… Canine Companions do not charge for placement of their dogs or the student stay and training with the dog they receive. Some service dog schools do require students to raise a very large fee before they accept you. CC has huge donor supporters who keep the school going so those in need can benefit without the burden of paying. Students are given life time follow up support for any needs. This school has multiple sites, 6 regions throughout the country so they can service people no matter where they live. There is a required 2 week stay for team training the student in the use of the dog they are matched with. They do have a waiting list depending on the region and persons needs but if you are serious you should look into it. There is a lengthy application process so they can know you and your needs and match the proper dog for you.