Is Disney Pricing themselves out of the Middle Class???

[Gabe1]

I find it sad that in the past decade, the inflation rate of healthcare costs, college tuition, and gasoline are all lower than the inflation rate of a Disney admission ticket.

Annoying isn't it. My DD University, UofI, college tuition has doubled there in the last 10 years, so if my salary increases can't keep pace with that, how can I keep pace with Disney?

That's quite a steep increase for the us residents, plus your travel costs, why is that .

I thought you guys would be getting a better deal

I don't begrudge the deals that are afforded to people traveling to the US for 2-3 weeks, staying in some real nice resorts, I do want to bang my head into the wall wondering why it does cost us here in the US dramatically more for the same experience.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

And people wonder why the domestic numbers are down. I believe that one of the reasons is because people in the US usually only spend a week. I think A LOT of domestic travelers would balk at just under $6K for a vacation. Two trips would equal a new car.

 

[rob0519]

That simply reeks of shortsightedness to me, and I'm pretty sure that Walt would never have approved such an operation.

It may be time to give up the concept of what would Walt think. It's a different time and a different business climate. Walt was a businessman and while he may have done a few things differently, but at the end of the day it's still all about making money.

From a purely business perspective, of course, Disney wants the customers that spend the most money. If you owned a business and someone was going to spend $250 and someone was going to spend $1000, you would be a fool to court the lower spending customer.

In the early 2000's when people were not flying, occupancy rates dropped and WDW offered deals like 7 nights for the price of 4 to fill the resorts and the parks. Now that occupancy rates are up, there is no need to offer discounts.

An earlier poster was right. If we, as long time customers do not return, there will be another person right behind us to take our place.

From a consumer perspective, yes of course Disney is pricing out more and more people. As are others, my family and I do not go to WDW as often as we used to, unfortunately based on my records, a 7 day vacation in 2009 cost more than double what a 7 day vacation cost in 2004, not including transportaton.

 

[awoogala]

We have stayed at disney orlando for the last 6 years, and unbelievably the price for us to stay as stayed either the same or got cheaper. We are going this year again in August and staying POR, The cost forus for 2 weeks including disney 14 day ultimate comes out at £2300 for 2 adults 1 child plus we get dining plan (staying at moderate resort), this doesnt include our flight which is another £1000 GBP. How does that compare with the US.

it has gone way up on our end. from $70-80 a night at POP off season, to $120-200 a night now. Ticket prices, too.

 

[Bparso87]

I am middle class I would say we go every year. I have a DVC so that helps me bc I paid cash for it from a bonus. But even with that I stil have to pay 1100 for tics 900 to 1000 for airfare. 1000 for dining . That is 3000 dollars a year it is a lot of money. We put almost every extra dollar aside for Disney.

 

[ParentsOf4]

We put almost every extra dollar aside for Disney.

That's pretty much Disney's business strategy, to get everyone to spend nearly every single "want" dollar on Disney.

 

[Mammymouse]

A big problem domestic visitors have is the deflation of our dollar. You may notice how everything is much more expensive in the recent years. Certain foreign countries currency now buys way more than our dollars do, so in essence it is cheaper for foreign travelers to come to vacation in the US than domestic folks, given the currency exchange. What was that saying we heard a while ago - "elections have consequences".

 

[Bparso87]

That's pretty much Disney's business strategy, to get everyone to spend nearly every single "want" dollar on Disney.

Yea it is. I would really to get more discounts as a DVC member besides AP discountson the DP would be great but I know it won't happen

 

[Disneyhead'71]

A big problem domestic visitors have is the deflation of our dollar. You may notice how everything is much more expensive in the recent years. Certain foreign countries currency now buys way more than our dollars do, so in essence it is cheaper for foreign travelers to come to vacation in the US than domestic folks, given the currency exchange. What was that saying we heard a while ago - "elections have consequences".

I don't know that we really want to go there. A lot of people like ignore who crashed the country like a drunken frat boy and left it a flaming heap for the next guy.

 

[HatboxGhost]

I wish every child, rich or poor, would have the opportunity to visit this magical place.

Agreed. I think that was what Walt wanted too but nowadays that idea has changed so much.

 

[FettFan]

It may be time to give up the concept of what would Walt think. It's a different time and a different business climate. Walt was a businessman and while he may have done a few things differently, but at the end of the day it's still all about making money.

Yeah but Walt was never one to leave a show's quality compromised for years on end while at the same time gouging ticket prices so much that it would make even longtime fans consider scrapping a trip to Disneyland, which is exactly what TDO seems to be content with doing right now.


EDIT -- And no, do not give up on what Walt would think. Operations at all Disney parks and resorts should continue theoretically as if Walt were to walk into the offices at any minute.

When Wayne Allwine took over the voice of Mickey back in the 80s, he was given one piece of advice: "Just remember, kid, you're only filling in for the boss."

THAT is the kind of attitude that all of Disney's officials and employees need to maintain at all times....all the way from Bob Iger to the part-time guy cleaning up vomit on the doombuggies.

 

[cheezbat]

I don't know that we really want to go there. A lot of people like ignore who crashed the country like a drunken frat boy and left it a flaming heap for the next guy.

Well I'm going there...

It doesn't matter WHO is in the White House, or who WAS in the White House...you can thank our entire awful government for the mess were in. Republican or Democrat or Independent, it doesn't matter. The whole system is corrupt and has been for decades now. There have been many things in play that all attribute to the current state of our nation and economy.

To top that off, the worldwide economy has been pretty shaky the last number of years too. The powerhouses aren't looking so mighty right now.

Anyway...off my rant....it saddens me to see just how fast the price increases have happened at WDW. The rate of inflation is disgusting, especially considering the lack of new offerings which could justify the increases.
It also saddens me that an American business is now courting more foreigners than US vacationers it seems. I'm seeing far more UK'ers and Brazilian tour groups...and hear far more Spanish and Portuguese than English.
While everyone has a right to visit Disney, it just seems like WDW hardly cares about its home crowd.

 

[DfromATX]

WDW occupancy rate is down, WDW attendance is down.

At Disney's 2012 earnings conference call, Jay Rasulo said that "Walt Disney World attendance was down modestly". Based on other statements, it seems it was down 1-to-3%. Even that decline was propped up by significant increased international attendance, led by Brazil and Argentina. Domestic attendance is down even more.

Rather than try to appeal to Americans, it appears Disney is advertising to new markets overseas, assuming these new markets won't be as demanding since they don't know what WDW quality was like in the past and would consider the entire parks as "new" experiences, unlike Americans who have been going to WDW for years and recognize that WDW has not had a major expansion since DAK 15 years ago. It's cheaper for Disney to advertise overseas then it is to improve the parks.

Furthermore, Disney confirmed during the call that occupancy rates are down to 78%. This after being closer to 90% for many years.

Even so called "Value Resort" rooms are approaching $200/night on holiday weeks such as Easter. Christmas week is at $199/night and, no doubt, will soon break the $200/night psychological barrier. These are for Disney's least expensive rooms. The least expensive room at the Grand Floridian for Christmas week now starts at $842/night. At these prices, more and more guests are staying offsite or simply not visiting WDW as all.

For some perspective, when WDW opened in 1971, it was possible to get a room in the Garden Wing of the Contemporary Resort for $22/night, about $125/night today. For it's first decade, WDW's room occupancy rate was essentially 100%.

Returning to the thread's title, "Is Disney Pricing themselves out of the Middle Class?" The answer is a resounding "YES".

This makes me feel sad.

 

[RoyWalley]

Gas Prices and Airlines are the biggest problems.

 

[DfromATX]

Gas Prices and Airlines are the biggest problems.

For our upcoming trip, I was balking more about the resort and dining prices. We are flying from Texas for about $300 a ticket. We booked a year in advance, plus we compared prices for various days of the week.

 

[ddbowdoin]

My wife and I spent New Years Eve in Ireland, four cities: Limerick, Adare, Cork, and Dublin, for 6 days for 1300.00 total, dont think you could do that at Disney. Also spent 3 weeks backpacking around China for under 2500.00, couldnt spend 3 weeks at WDW for that, not to metion 12 days in Lake Como and Provence for about 3000.00 roughly what WDW would cost for us.

as someone who has over 100 family members left over in the motherland and who has traveled there numerous times, I am curious how the hell you did 6 days for 1300 bucks?!?! I can't find a flight south of 7 bills unless I am willing to fly Boston - New York - Heathrow - Shannon (spending nearly 16 hours for what is just a 5.5hr flight).

Those are apples and oranges... one is a high price destination with high cost attractions the other is fields with dairy cows and beautiful rolling countryside landscapes.

 

[ddbowdoin]

Ah, my favorite, really least favorite topic, Disney prices.

Disney started offering hopper tickets that included all attractions with the opening of Epcot in 1982. Disney-MGM Studios opened in 1989, followed by DAK in 1998. The following 10-year spans compare median household income with ticket prices, assuming a WDW vacation in 1982 was 3 days (2 days for MK, 1 day for Epcot) and grew by one day as each park was added.

1982
Median Household Income: $19,004
3-Day WDW ticket ($35) price-per-day: $11.67
Ticket/income percentage: 0.0614%

1992
Median Household Income: $29,448
4-Day WDW ticket ($130.46) price-per-day: $32.62
Ticket/income percentage: 0.11076%

2002
Median Household Income: $41,620
5-Day WDW ticket ($243.89) price-per-day: $48.78
Ticket/income percentage: 0.11720%

2012
Median Household Income: $50,054 (estimated)
5-Day WDW ticket ($484.58) price-per-day: $96.92
Ticket/income percentage: 0.19362%

What's obvious is that even the ticket price-per-day has grown tremendously since 1982. In addition, WDW has grown (which is good), meaning that the length of a "full" WDW vacation has grown as well, making it even more difficult for families to afford WDW. Of course, families can simply buy three-day tickets today but, as we all know, today's WDW tickets are heavily front-loaded. Today's WDW comes out significantly less favorable (in terms of cost) when comparing a 3-day ticket in 1982 to a 3-day ticket in 2012.

A 2012 3-day base ticket (i.e. no hopping and no water parks) costs $257.73. Even as recently as 10 years ago, a 3-day Ultimate Hopper (which included hopping & water parks) cost $164.01, or $209.89 adjusted for inflation. Of course, as noted above, a 1982 3-day World Passport (included hopping) cost $35.00, or $83.50 adjusted for inflation. That's less than a one-day base ticket in 2012.

If WDW quality had remained relatively constant, I probably could stomach it. But I'm one of those doom-and-gloomers who think quality has plummeted in the last 10 years. All things considered, prices are outrageous.

Luckily I made a smart investment 8 years ago and bought a lot of WDW tickets. I'll be milking those for years!

is 50K considered "middle class" these days?

 

[DfromATX]

is 50K considered "middle class" these days?

She's right. I was curious too so I looked it up. Here's what I found:

US Household Income

According to the Census ACS survey, the median household income for the United States was $50,502 in 2011, the latest data available. 2012 Census ACS data (including 2012 national household income numbers) will be released in September of 2013.

 

[ddbowdoin]

She's right. I was curious too so I looked it up. Here's what I found:

US Household Income

According to the Census ACS survey, the median household income for the United States was $50,502 in 2011, the latest data available. 2012 Census ACS data (including 2012 national household income numbers) will be released in September of 2013.

wow, I guess I always considered myself middle class... guess I was wrong. Perhaps there are a crap load of single income earners in America these days.

 

[Glasgow]

What company wouldn't want Disney's business model? It stinks for the consumers but as much as people like to say otherwise, most people on this board will sacrifice something else to keep their Disney trip. That, my friend, is a desirable Product. There is simply no substitute for memories, especially ones with the kids (which they are directly targeting in this last ad campaign - you only have so many opportunities to make memories with your children).
Having said that, yes, I think they are getting dangerously close to pricing out much of market here in the US. We're a once a year family as well over the last decade and now with school ages kids we can no longer take advantage of all of the free dining and misc discounts. We'll be facing this same difficult decision in the next year or two - which will run out first, our resolve or our bank account?