Is Disney Paying Its Fair Share in Orlando?

[Goofyernmost]

He was a very rich man. Yes, many service people lived near the railroad and occupied service positions for the tourism that his railroad and hotels brought to the east coast.
Key West was already booming, his plan to connect it was one of the best things that could happen.

South Beach has been a draw for many years. The Art Deco District was built in the '30s.

All of this would have continued in tourism, popularity, and growth with or without Disney World.

You can attribute Central Florida to Walt, but not the coastal cities.

I suppose, but, it would be speculation only on both our parts. There is no tell just how much new life that Walt's foley pumped into the state. Yes, the beaches were still a draw, but, it was still a limited number that were going there regularly. However, it is a reversal now since Disney came up with the magic bus and the forced stay on Disney property came into being. Then the amount of influence that was brought into the state was reduced. Beaches are beaches, and they will always draw a certain number of people, but, not 60 million a year. That would make for a pretty crowded beach. Sort of a shark buffet.

 

[GCTales]

All this discussion of the development of Florida well outside the Orlando area is very nice... But s really irrelevant to the original question posed- "Is Disney paying its fair share in Orlando?"


I think the answer has been an unequivocal yes.

 

[21stamps]

I suppose, but, it would be speculation only on both our parts. There is no tell just how much new life that Walt's foley pumped into the state. Yes, the beaches were still a draw, but, it was still a limited number that were going there regularly. However, it is a reversal now since Disney came up with the magic bus and the forced stay on Disney property came into being. Then the amount of influence that was brought into the state was reduced. Beaches are beaches, and they will always draw a certain number of people, but, not 60 million a year. That would make for a pretty crowded beach. Sort of a shark buffet.

It's not complete speculation, just the history of the state. I don't think the majority of the approx 40million annual SoFla tourists are vacationing there because of Disney, or ever were. There's not really any correlation to show it.
I do think state income tax may exist if WDW visitors weren't coming to the state.


I agree with you.. the beaches will never reach the same number as Orlando area tourism. I do not want to visit a beach that has 60million visitors per year!! I think it's smart to have all of the theme parks and amusement parks in the same general area.

 

[floridagirl57]

This is complete BS and you know it. RCID gets Disney out of having to deal with city governments, which is wholly appropriate as the resort is effectively a city unto itself. RCID doesn't do anything to get them out of state and federal regulations, which is why they have to spend millions of dollars buying up wetlands whenever they want to do some development on the land they own.

I know I'm late on this topic but I wanted to add that Florida has several "Improvement Districts" not just the RCID (example: The West Villages Improvement District in North Port Florida, Sarasota County). These Districts are basically funding mechanisms for the infrastructure. In other Districts in Florida created under the same State Statute (Chapter 189), the City (or unincorporated County) the District falls into still has a lot of control for permitting, master planning etc. The local government might even provide the utilities and trash pick-up. Every District is set up differently but the RCID has A LOT of control and some have argued too much control. Read "Married to the Mouse" if you're interested.

 

[floridagirl57]

Absolutely. To be honest, I personally think Miami is a dump. I’ve stayed there 2 times and travelled through Miami multiple other times.

The Keys are decent but I don’t even consider that part of Florida since they are like 100 miles away from the motherland.

I’ve also been to Tampa once, which was dirty.

So after one visit, with no reference on what area of the City you were in, you can the cleanliness of an entire City? Trust me there is a huge difference between the area around Bush Gardens or Lowery Park Zoo and Downtown. And if you really want to discuss a theme park that unequivocally puts no investment back into the City, we can have a discussion about BG.

 

[Chef Mickey]

So after one visit, with no reference on what area of the City you were in, you can ***** the cleanliness of an entire City? Trust me there is a huge difference between the area around Bush Gardens or Lowery Park Zoo and Downtown. And if you really want to discuss a theme park that unequivocally puts no investment back into the City, we can have a discussion about BG.

Yes, pretty much how it works. Please don't start making it sound like Tampa is a hot vacation spot or top tourist destination. Again, maybe for locals...not nationally. Doesn't mean no one goes there...it just means there are 100 cities I'd go before Tampa.

 

[21stamps]

So after one visit, with no reference on what area of the City you were in, you can ***** the cleanliness of an entire City? Trust me there is a huge difference between the area around Bush Gardens or Lowery Park Zoo and Downtown. And if you really want to discuss a theme park that unequivocally puts no investment back into the City, we can have a discussion about BG.

I think a lot of people have no idea how vast and different Florida is.

I sound like a tourism advert right now, but there is so many different cultures, lifestyles, beaches, water, wildlife, plants, trees, flowers, entertainment options, climate, etc, all within one state..and a lot of that list can vary within certain areas of a city, I think the latter is true of any city in any state. As for Tampa or Miami- it depends where you stayed, however, most of the time too many people don't actually know where they did stay or if they were even in the area that they thought they were in.lol

 

["El Gran Magnifico"]

Please don't start making it sound like Tampa is a hot vacation spot or top tourist destination. Again, maybe for locals...not nationally.

Well, considering the Tampa-St Pete area (more commonly known as Tampa Bay) includes St Pete Beach, Madeira Beach, and Clearwater Beach...I'd say you're a shade off on your analysis. It's not hurting for national tourism. If you're basing it on time you spent in one specific area of Tampa, it's like saying you didn't like Miami because you spent a day in Homestead.

 

[21stamps]

Well, considering the Tampa-St Pete area (more commonly known as Tampa Bay) includes St Pete Beach, Madeira Beach, and Clearwater Beach...I'd say you're a shade off on your analysis. It's not hurting for national tourism. If you're basing it on time you spent in one specific area of Tampa, it's like saying you didn't like Miami because you spent a day in Homestead.

Seriously, I've heard people talk about how they disliked Miami Beach when spent 1 night pre cruise.
I asked where they stayed, and then informed them that is actually Hialeah.lol.

 

[POLY LOVER]

All this discussion of the development of Florida well outside the Orlando area is very nice... But s really irrelevant to the original question posed- "Is Disney paying its fair share in Orlando?"


I think the answer has been an unequivocal yes.

No corporation pays its fair share, it's not in their interest to pay , its in their interest to pay as least as possible. Fair share in corporate terms doesn't compute. They pay and contribute what is in their best interest to. They hire legions of tax avoidance accountants to do just that. Corporations are made up of shareholders and CEO custodians that make millions in pay and bonuses. Disney like other corporations are cold hard operations that make decisions based on profits. Does Disney pay their fair share in their minds they do plus some. The truth of it can be debated until this thread runs out of space.

 

[NearTheEars]

As long as you assume that the 60K+ CM's were born there in Central Florida, otherwise, I think there is a flaw in your thinking.

No, I don’t think 60,000 people moved to Central Florida specifically to work for minimum wage at WDW.
Several thousand, though, absolutely.

 

[NearTheEars]

Yes, pretty much how it works. Please don't start making it sound like Tampa is a hot vacation spot or top tourist destination. Again, maybe for locals...not nationally. Doesn't mean no one goes there...it just means there are 100 cities I'd go before Tampa.

Vacationing just in Tampa, doubtful. Some folks may stay there at night, but most are spending their days in St. Pete and Clearwater, which offer some nice beaches. There’s still tons of people out there that do beach-only trips.

 

[GCTales]

No corporation pays its fair share, it's not in their interest to pay , its in their interest to pay as least as possible. Fair share in corporate terms doesn't compute. They pay and contribute what is in their best interest to. They hire legions of tax avoidance accountants to do just that. Corporations are made up of shareholders and CEO custodians that make millions in pay and bonuses. Disney like other corporations are cold hard operations that make decisions based on profits. Does Disney pay their fair share in their minds they do plus some. The truth of it can be debated until this thread runs out of space.

And just what, in that case, do you consider "their fair share"?

I ask because it looks like they could pay 50% in taxes and that rate would not be high enough to satisfy you.

They pay what the tax laws dictate they pay.. Just because they have accountants to review and use every discount TO WHICH THEY ARE LEGALLY ENTITLED does not mean they are not paying what they are supposed to.

 

[POLY LOVER]

And just what, in that case, do you consider "their fair share"?

I ask because it looks like they could pay 50% in taxes and that rate would not be high enough to satisfy you.

They pay what the tax laws dictate they pay.. Just because they have accountants to review and use every discount TO WHICH THEY ARE LEGALLY ENTITLED does not mean they are not paying what they are supposed to.

Fair share is what they make it. Accountants do not just review and take discounts as you say. They lobby politicians, they structure the corporation in ways to avoid taxes, they find loopholes, they earn their fees by saving corporation money. And just to be clear they will never pay 50%.
As The Godfather said, its not personal it's strictly business!

 

[Damon7777]

In response to GCTales "supposed to"

Just for clarification do you mean that in a legal responsibility/obligation sort of way or an ethical corporate citizenship sort of way?

 

[flynnibus]

. Another industry could have taken hold here and created better skilled jobs. No one knows.

Could have? What's stopping it? Oh yeah, it's just a meaningless hypothetical

 

[GCTales]

In response to GCTales "supposed to"

Just for clarification do you mean that in a legal responsibility/obligation sort of way or an ethical corporate citizenship sort of way?

Considering there is no real definition of "ethical corporate citizenship" in relation to taxes.. That is a subjective term... And I meant legal...

 

[Goofyernmost]

No, I don’t think 60,000 people moved to Central Florida specifically to work for minimum wage at WDW.
Several thousand, though, absolutely.

Minimum wage or not, they didn't start out in Orlando. Maybe some from other parts of the state of Florida, but, the vast, and I do mean vast, majority have come into the area just to work for Disney at minimum wage.

Why, you ask surprisingly? Because the instant gratification thing is a fairly recent stumbling block to the success of youth today. Most realize that you start someplace otherwise CEO offices would be filled with acne filled teenagers that were told by their parents that all they need to do to get what they want is demand it. That feel that businesses should understand just how valuable they are as employees and that they will be glad to actually show that worth just as soon as that company pays them what they are worth.

People go in to Disney because, one... they love Disney, grew up as a child visiting and loving every minute of the imaginary magic and want to be part of it. Most that do something like that are from financially supporting parents allowing them to live the dream. Others because it is a job that most can do with no problem. It takes very little skill other then a sense of direction to point (with two fingers) toward the closest bathroom or the next available ride vehicle. You can tell which ones are there because they really want a career at Disney. They are the ones that go over and above in playing the part that they were hired for. The others are just wasting time before they venture out into the real world sans Mickey. And others that realize that the name The Disney Company or Walt Disney World, etc. is a great name to have on a startup resume. However, that doesn't mean that the positions that they are holding are worth more then what they are getting paid. Not to mention that Disney pays above minimum wage anyway. Not a lot, the yacht will have to wait, but, with ingenuity, one less I-phone, bachelor pad will have to wait and a little less partying, they can survive until they have reached the experience level that puts them in a better category.

It is a fact of work life. Everyone has to start somewhere and what better, possibly more fun place is there then a Disney park. Yes, it has it's downsides, as does every job, but, it beats riding on the back of garbage trucks, cleaning septic tanks or washing out porta potties.

 

[GCTales]

Fair share is what they make it. Accountants do not just review and take discounts as you say. They lobby politicians, they structure the corporation in ways to avoid taxes, they find loopholes, they earn their fees by saving corporation money. And just to be clear they will never pay 50%.
As The Godfather said, its not personal it's strictly business!

Disney pays sales and use taxes, payroll and unemployment taxes, property taxes, federal and state income taxes, hotel taxes, Communications Services Taxes, local and county taxes.. I am sure I am missing a few... According to the Florida Department of Revenue - they administer / charge over 30 taxes and fees on companies operating in the state. I have only listed some that I KNOW Disney would have to pay. I am sure there are others (probably a sewage / waste tax and a recycling tax)

What do you consider their fair share? Obviously, based on your statements, you do not feel Disney pays their "fair share" in Orlando or in Anaheim.

As noted by others, this approach is frequently used by those who feel Corporations are evil and should not be allow to make more than a minimal profit (which would be determined by the government) and all other funds go to the government to be distributed as they see fit (typically on "social programs that generate votes for them).

Do you take every tax deduction to which you are entitled? Yes? Then maybe you are not paying your fair share? Maybe you should give your extra money to the government to be distributed how they see fit (This is a facetious statement, as not even the most die hard, far left liberal socialist / communist is not giving thier extra money to the government).

My point is, "fair share" is a subjective term and frequently defined to suit an objective. I would asume you pay "your fair share" of taxes as defined by the tax laws, perhaps donate some additional funds to charities of your choosing (National average is between 2.6% and 3.6%).

I believe Disney pays the taxes that they are legally obligated to pay and invest far more in the community where their facilities exist in the Orlando area than many other companies do or that hey are legally required... They donate to various charities, they support such things as "make a wish" and other similar organizations.. They work with conservation organizations... They don't "have" to do this.. they do it because it is in their best interest and meets their corporate principles.

Anyway, not going to waste further time debate corporate tax ethics... nothing I say will change someones mind when they have already made up thier mind that Disney does not "pay thier fair share".

 

[POLY LOVER]

Disney pays sales and use taxes, payroll and unemployment taxes, property taxes, federal and state income taxes, hotel taxes, Communications Services Taxes, local and county taxes.. I am sure I am missing a few... According to the Florida Department of Revenue - they administer / charge over 30 taxes and fees on companies operating in the state. I have only listed some that I KNOW Disney would have to pay. I am sure there are others (probably a sewage / waste tax and a recycling tax)

What do you consider their fair share? Obviously, based on your statements, you do not feel Disney pays their "fair share" in Orlando or in Anaheim.

As noted by others, this approach is frequently used by those who feel Corporations are evil and should not be allow to make more than a minimal profit (which would be determined by the government) and all other funds go to the government to be distributed as they see fit (typically on "social programs that generate votes for them).

Do you take every tax deduction to which you are entitled? Yes? Then maybe you are not paying your fair share? Maybe you should give your extra money to the government to be distributed how they see fit (This is a facetious statement, as not even the most die hard, far left liberal socialist / communist is not giving thier extra money to the government).

My point is, "fair share" is a subjective term and frequently defined to suit an objective. I would asume you pay "your fair share" of taxes as defined by the tax laws, perhaps donate some additional funds to charities of your choosing (National average is between 2.6% and 3.6%).

I believe Disney pays the taxes that they are legally obligated to pay and invest far more in the community where their facilities exist in the Orlando area than many other companies do or that hey are legally required... They donate to various charities, they support such things as "make a wish" and other similar organizations.. They work with conservation organizations... They don't "have" to do this.. they do it because it is in their best interest and meets their corporate principles.

Anyway, not going to waste further time debate corporate tax ethics... nothing I say will change someones mind when they have already made up thier mind that Disney does not "pay thier fair share".

I think you are hearing things that aren't being said. You have an agenda obviously and you are not listening. Subject closed it can't be resolved.