Is Big Thunder Mountain Jinxed?

[ogryn]

http://www.miceage.com/allutz/al040604a.htm

Al seems to be breaking news about another Big Thunder Mountain accident. Soon they will have no trains left

 

[cherrynegra]

I read the same article via savedisney. Holy crapola!! What is with that attraction? Can you imagine what would have happened if it had crashed with both cars filled to capacity? Thank goodness nobody got hurt and the cars were empty at the time. Yeah, I'm with you now. Now I'm starting to wonder if it is jinxed.

 

[JackSkellington]

Wow, that is bad news. I mean BTMRR is one ofmy favorite rides there. Now it seems to be a disaster on wheels.

 

[marni1971]

OMG.

 

[Pat X]

Ok, first, I think we all need to calm down a bit...first, lets consider the source. This is Al Lutz we are talking about. He has flat out lied and exagerated many times in the past. For example, he published a ride review of Grizzly River Run that trashed the ride before any human rider actually rode the attraction! That is just one example, so I don't consider him reliable in the least.

Also, here is a post from Mouseinfo that may provide some insight onto the situation:

"Please rest assured that there is quite a bit of information in Al's article that is not entirely accurate and certainly much of the information has been sensationalized for the reading community. It is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for this to happen when guests are on the attraction.

I want to reiterate the fact that vehicles were being moved in a mode that has never and will never be used while guests are in ride vehicles or around the attraction, making it impossible for a guest to have been hurt in this type of accident."

 

[JackSkellington]

I think this is a little exaggeration, I mean if this really happened this would be all over the news. So this is probably a hoax.

 

[imagineer boy]

Originally posted by Pat X
Ok, first, I think we all need to calm down a bit...first, lets consider the source. This is Al Lutz we are talking about. He has flat out lied and exagerated many times in the past. For example, he published a ride review of Grizzly River Run that trashed the ride before any human rider actually rode the attraction! That is just one example, so I don't consider him reliable in the least.

Also, here is a post from Mouseinfo that may provide some insight onto the situation:

"Please rest assured that there is quite a bit of information in Al's article that is not entirely accurate and certainly much of the information has been sensationalized for the reading community. It is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for this to happen when guests are on the attraction.

I want to reiterate the fact that vehicles were being moved in a mode that has never and will never be used while guests are in ride vehicles or around the attraction, making it impossible for a guest to have been hurt in this type of accident."

I do think that Al Lutz does sometimes get too negative, but back then, I think Al Lutz was so dissapointed with DCA that he pointed out every single bad thing and no good things. Al Lutz's articles are however much more enjoyable to read because of all the good stuff that's been happening with Matt O. in charge. I doubt it was a hoax. The dinosaur part is the slowest part of the ride. I think the only damage the collision was was a large dent or something. Lutz must've gotten false info. and maybe exadurated stories. We'll just have to wait and see it comfirmed.

 

[skeeter]

GET YOUR "I SURVIVED BIG THUNDER MOUNTAIN" T-SHIRTS!!
GET'M WHILE THEY'RE HOT!!
All joking aside, I am glad no one was hurt. Will I hesitate riding BTM? Probably!:lookaroun

 

[Pat X]

It looks like another unoffical Disney site, Mouseplanet, got a statement form Disney

http://mousepad.mouseplanet.com/sho...?t=27151&page=2

"I spoke with Bob Tucker, spokesperson for the Disneyland Resort, and here is what he had to say.

"During a reset operation Saturday night, without any guests present, one train ran into the back of another. Both trains were damaged. No guests were injured because this proceedure is only performed at Big Thunder Mountain Railroad when guests are not riding the attraction. It (the ride) reopened Sunday."

Asked what Disney did after the accident, he said "We reviewed our operating proceedures. Some were not followed and we retrained accordingly."

He added that "The attraction is running with one less train, and we hope to add the 4th soon."

We are developing more information about this incident, and will report it as we can clarify some points. Although the accident was not "DOSH-reportable," Disney did file a report, and we hope to have a copy of it shortly. "

 

[cherrynegra]

Originally posted by Pat X


Asked what Disney did after the accident, he said "We reviewed our operating proceedures. Some were not followed and we retrained accordingly."

Okay, does anyone else find it a little frightening that after it's been closed all these months and after going over the ride with a fine tooth comb, apparently "operating procedures" were not followed?:hammer:

 

[skeeter]

I have to agree. With the months that this ride was closed, I would have expected BTM to be at 100 percent. The fact that no one was on the ride at the time of the accident is irrelevant. It still happened, and if a computer malfunction is to blame, what will protect it from happening with people on the ride? Sounds a bit strange to me--

 

[Pat X]

Well, from what I have read on other sites is when the ride is restarted, it is done manually, not by a computer, so it was someone who wasn't following the restart procedure properly. Under normal ride operations, the computer would never have allowed the other train to enter that section of the ride. It's only after an emergency stop where trains are still left on the track that the cars are moved manually.

If someone has different info, please post!

 

[Merlin]

Originally posted by cherrynegra
Okay, does anyone else find it a little frightening that after it's been closed all these months and after going over the ride with a fine tooth comb, apparently "operating procedures" were not followed?:hammer:

Definitely agree 100%! In fact, I find it more than just a "little frightening".

 

[xfkirsten]

I've been at the park every day since Sunday (I have friends in town to visit DL) and twice since then, I've been walking the path from Frontierland to Fantasyland when the attraction stopped and they made the closure announcement and had to evacuate the ride. While I know Al Lutz has a very negative opinion of the parks these days, this news does make me wonder if this incident had any reprocussions over the last few days (aside from longer lines) that is causing problems... or if there is a bigger problem than all of this.

-Kirsten

 

[RU42]

There is an article in the OC Register today. To sum up my understanding:

The accident was 100% human error. The supe forgot to look to see if the track was clear before he punched a button. (That's the basic gist.)

The ride was in manual mode which is NEVER used when the ride is in public operation.

If I read the article right, a guest forced up a safety bar and that set the ride into emergency stop - which is what it is supposed to do. (They did it while in the station.) The accident occured while the CMs were resetting the ride; after clearing out the ride, which is according to procedure.

3 trains are now out of service which leaves 3 trains for the ride. A 4th is hoped to be brought on line soon. As the other trains are repaired Disney will allow DOSH to inspect even though they are under no obligation to have them check it.

An unfortunate accident to be sure, but not the doom and gloom that some web sites would like to make you think. The computer did not send one train crashing into another, a human did.

Pat X - I just want to thank you for level headed post of facts.

I am not the least bit scared of the ride and will happily go on it.

RU

 

[JackSkellington]

Well, this is not encouraging news for DL. I hope they will address the problem properly. I mean if this was human error, I would be a whole lot more careful when going on the ride. It is rather unfortunate BTMRR is having so many problems now.

 

[cherrynegra]

Yes, but I thing that the previous post was saying that it's never in manual mode when the public is riding it. So obvioulsy there are built in safeguards when the puter is online. HOWEVER, I am still concerned that there was any type of manual error, especially since the ride has only come online for a few weeks now. All training should be resolved. And you know the family of the gentleman who passed away on BTMR will use this somehow.

 

[JackSkellington]

Originally posted by cherrynegra
HOWEVER, I am still concerned that there was any type of manual error, especially since the ride has only come online for a few weeks now. All training should be resolved. And you know the family of the gentleman who passed away on BTMR will use this somehow.

I agree. I mean after his death, (May he Rest in Peace) there shoud have been some very seriuos training and fixing on the ride. And thank God there was no one on the ride, (even though it was a routiene check) but there should NOT be another problem in such close proximity with last Sept. accident. So with that being said Disney (in the kindest meaning) needs to fix that ride like Now. If they were to have another accident it might be put down for a while. And that would make me sad.

 

[cherrynegra]

Here's an article in the LA Times about the incident. Funny how they picked up on the story after it was reported on a fan website. You just know they comb the fansites for stories.

------------------------------------------------------

Disney Roller Coaster Snags Again

State inspectors order more training after a riderless crash of two trains on Thunder Mountain, where a man was killed last year.

By Kimi Yoshino, Times Staff Writer

For the second time in five months, state investigators have ordered Disneyland to further train workers because they failed to properly operate Big Thunder Mountain Railroad.

Tuesday's action followed Saturday's minor crash of two unoccupied trains.

The roller coaster had reopened last month, after a September derailment that killed a 22-year-old Gardena man and injured 10 other riders.

After that crash — caused when two bolts on a guide-wheel assembly fell off — the state Department of Occupational Safety and Health ordered the park to retrain ride employees.

Saturday's accident occurred when one train ran into the back of another as employees were performing a routine "reset" operation, said Disneyland spokesman Bob Tucker. The ride reopened Sunday morning.

"We've reviewed our operating procedures," Tucker said. "Some were not followed and we retrained accordingly. The attraction is now running with one less train and we hope to add the fourth very soon."

The reset procedure is performed only when no riders are on board, Tucker said.

The park was not required to report the crash to the state because no one was injured. But an undisclosed source complained to DOSH on Sunday, sparking its investigation, DOSH spokesman Dean Fryer said.

In their report, state investigators determined that one employee gave a clear sign to start a train without verifying the position of the other train. And a second employee did not fully perform her duties by overseeing the procedures, the report said.

News of the weekend crash broke Tuesday morning on a Disney watchdog site, http://www.miceage.com . Al Lutz, editor of the site, wrote that the impact made a loud crashing sound that could be heard at a nearby restaurant and on Main Street.

Santa Ana attorney Wylie Aitken, representing the family of Marcelo Torres, the rider killed in September, said he learned about Saturday's accident on Tuesday after receiving phone calls from former employees.

"It raises questions about how well they were retrained and about the whole training process, which is what a good part of our case is about," Aitken said.

 

[JackSkellington]

I am not surprised that the "Times" is onto Disney. I just think that someone needs to quit taking shortcuts, and do the job right. For the safety of the guests.