Interesting new transportation Option: Whoosh - Autonomous Elevated Cable & Rail System

[donaldtoo]

I'm not even sure this would be possible with the system. They'd have to have some kind of station there that merged the cars coming from two separate lines, or just build two completely distinct lines that didn't connect.

I assume it would not have been worth the additional expense.

Yep, that’s why I was asking.
It just seems like the whole thing would be better if they could’ve connected that short piece. The whole system would then be, essentially, a loop with 3 legs.

 

[donaldtoo]

The goal of the system was not to connect Epcot and DHS - it was to connect those 2 parks with the resorts.

You can get to DHS from Epcot, and vice versa, but it’s definitely the long way around, and you hafta’ switch along the way.

 

[StarWarsGirl]

We have never stayed at a Skyliner resort. I am curious for anyone who has, is there really a significant time savings between time it would take for a Disney Bus to take you from the resort to the park, and what the Skyliner offers? Is there really any efficiency/benefit to the Skyliner Transporation as a system, or it is it just a nice added perk/novelty for those resorts?

For any internal transportation system, I generally don't see where alternative systems outweigh the benefits of simple bus systems.

I haven't stayed at a Skyliner resort, but for between Beach Club and DHS, it's SOOO much better than water transportation or walking. Skyliner takes about 15-20 minutes. Water transportation takes at least 30, more during higher periods (during park closing) and the walk is unbearably hot during the summer.

The nice thing is that the Skyliner continuously moves, so you're not waiting forever for a bus/watercraft. It takes way less time at closing to get back to Beach Club than buses to other resorts from DHS. We used to just walk it back to Beach Club at closing because the line for the boat would be insane. My feet appreciate the break.

It was also a godsend during Covid when there was social distancing. They just put one group on per gondola and sent you on your way. Busses and monorails were a nightmare for loading.

 

[StarWarsGirl]

The goal of the system was not to connect Epcot and DHS - it was to connect those 2 parks with the resorts.

That may not have been the goal...we still use it for that purpose.

 

[Mireille]

We have never stayed at a Skyliner resort. I am curious for anyone who has, is there really a significant time savings between time it would take for a Disney Bus to take you from the resort to the park, and what the Skyliner offers? Is there really any efficiency/benefit to the Skyliner Transporation as a system, or it is it just a nice added perk/novelty for those resorts?

For any internal transportation system, I generally don't see where alternative systems outweigh the benefits of simple bus systems.

Seeing as the times I stayed at current skyliner resorts they didn't offer bus service to DHS or Epcot when the skyliner was running so I can't really say if I saved any time or not. The waiting is easier than for a bus since the Skyliner is always moving and in the rare occasion I've been in a line to get on (mostly early AM to rope drop) the line is always moving, so even the long lines don't feel as long as they look.

What I personally love about it is it's like a ride on your way to the rides. The views are interesting. Except for the busiest of times, your party usually gets its own gondola. There's no standing like on the bus. And yeah, it's just novel and fun since they took the Skyway out of MK. But in the end, it's not a huge upgrade to the bus, but I'd say there's no drawback either. It's just fun! (As long as you don't have a fear of heights.)

 

[StarWarsGirl]

That may not have been the goal...we still use it for that purpose.

Adding to this...

I find that buses between parks are pretty slow, so I generally favor the Skyliner between DHS and Epcot, especially if I'm going to the World Showcase end. To me, it's no more convoluted than taking the monorail between MK and Epcot and changing over at TTC.

The only way I'd take the bus to Epcot from DHS is if I needed to be on that end of the park.

You should always allot at least an hour in between getting between parks when using Disney Transportation because stuff happens that's out of your control. You don't wanna miss that ADR or LL because the bus didn't come when expected, there was a slowdown on the Skyliner, or the monorail was running more slowly than expected.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I guess that would be similar to like how there are no park to park busses.

They do run park to park busses.

That may not have been the goal...we still use it for that purpose.

Oh me too! Now that I don’t have an AP I will often spend multiple days resort hopping using the transportation. And then I’ll just spend a day or 2 in the parks.

 

[donaldtoo]

They do run park to park busses.

Yes, I got that mixed up. It’s resort to resort busses they don’t run.
On our trip last October, we had to go from AKL to AK, to then catch a bus to POFQ to get beignets.

 

[danlb_2000]

The goal of the system was not to connect Epcot and DHS - it was to connect those 2 parks with the resorts.

Especially since there is already boat transportation between those two parks and a walking path.

 

[UNCgolf]

Seeing as the times I stayed at current skyliner resorts they didn't offer bus service to DHS or Epcot when the skyliner was running so I can't really say if I saved any time or not. The waiting is easier than for a bus since the Skyliner is always moving and in the rare occasion I've been in a line to get on (mostly early AM to rope drop) the line is always moving, so even the long lines don't feel as long as they look.

What I personally love about it is it's like a ride on your way to the rides. The views are interesting. Except for the busiest of times, your party usually gets its own gondola. There's no standing like on the bus. And yeah, it's just novel and fun since they took the Skyway out of MK. But in the end, it's not a huge upgrade to the bus, but I'd say there's no drawback either. It's just fun! (As long as you don't have a fear of heights.)

The biggest drawback over buses (other than fear of heights) is that it has to stop in storms/strong wind, or if there's a single problem anywhere along the route the whole route has to stop. Then they have to make up for it with supplemental bus service to get people to/from those park/resort combos.

In those instances, the bus service is usually slower than normal because it's not a standard route.

 

[Mireille]

The biggest drawback over buses (other than fear of heights) is that it has to stop in storms/strong wind, or if there's a single problem anywhere along the route the whole route has to stop. Then they have to make up for it with supplemental bus service to get people to/from those park/resort combos.

In those instances, the bus service is usually slower than normal because it's not a standard route.

That's true, but I guess I've been lucky in my visits and never had to take a supplemental bus. It was closed shortly once while I was visiting Epcot but as I was getting ready to go to the bus pickup location it reopened.

 

[UNCgolf]

That's true, but I guess I've been lucky in my visits and never had to take a supplemental bus. It was closed shortly once while I was visiting Epcot but as I was getting ready to go to the bus pickup location it reopened.

I think it's a much bigger problem in the spring/summer than the fall/winter, with the frequency of thunderstorms.

 

[Smiley/OCD]

There can be, Pop Century to Studios is definitely faster on the skyliner vs. the bus.

Using the back entrance of Epcot is also much nicer - it’s less crowded and the walk from the Epcot bus to the entrance is pretty long.

But really it is more the novelty and fun just like monorails and boats all around property.

IF it’s a short line at the stations…we stayed at POP and while I agree on the novelty, I actually like the bus service better and wish they still had the option of the bus to Epcot & HWD.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

The biggest drawback over buses (other than fear of heights) is that it has to stop in storms/strong wind, or if there's a single problem anywhere along the route the whole route has to stop. Then they have to make up for it with supplemental bus service to get people to/from those park/resort combos.

In those instances, the bus service is usually slower than normal because it's not a standard route.

In addition you can't really ramp up/down the skyliner, or really most any static point to point Transporation system.

Bus numbers can be added/subtracted a lot easier if there are changes in rider trends, such as during festivals or other events. And while it's never fun when a bus breaks down and you have to wait for a new one, or have to operate on a non-regular bus route, its still alot easier to deal then if a the skyliner breaks down.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Yep, that’s why I was asking.
It just seems like the whole thing would be better if they could’ve connected that short piece. The whole system would then be, essentially, a loop with 3 legs.

Right now there are three lines with a single central point that contains gondola storage and the main drive motors. Your diagram would require four lines and three points with storage and main drive motors.

 

[Phonedave]

San Francisco has been using cable cars for 151 years but they still have limitations that cannot be altered. They are cool but they are just big "gondolas" that run on rails instead of being carried by the cable. They have to have specific stops, they have to stay on whatever path they are on, if something happens in front of them they are not able to go around it and they can't switch to another cable on their own. That's were I am stumped. How is this different from San Francisco and how is that directional change able to happen and if it did wouldn't that much freedom of movement be a massive type of system? Where a city of any size, like that of WDW, would be so expensive and the equipment would be so sophisticated that it might be cheaper to just take a rocket to the Mars. Listen I'm in favor of new technology, but many times the concept is far more workable in ones brain then in the real world.

They create multiple paths, and there are multiple cable loops, allowing for shunting and bypass.

Such as the pinched loop - https://www.dcc.at/solutions/cable-linerr-pinched-loop/

Single and double shuttle - https://www.dcc.at/solutions/cable-linerr-single-and-double-shuttle/

And bypass functions - https://www.dcc.at/solutions/cable-linerr-bypass/

These are all Cable Liner configurations, they are pulled by a cable, much like the SF cable cars.

Technology has progressed quite a bit in the 151 years since the cable cars were designed.

This is not some fantasy solution that is in somebody's head. This is in real world operations (and has been for over a decade)

Doppelmayr Group

In the city of canals there is an inspiring, elevated Doppelmayr Cable Liner® system. Fully integrated in the public transport network, the APM system transports passengers to the heart of the city.

www.dcc.at

 

[Phonedave]

The Skyliner cars are supposedly accessible anywhere for emergencies but because the line pulls the cars in practice there are fewer points that need to be accessed, and that seems easier and quicker to repair compared to a system where any car mechanically fail at any point, likely increasing need to access a car at any location, thus needing a more robust ground team. I'm imagining the press around a broken car over Hourglass Lake necessitsted one of the boats or barges (that already exists) to get a cherry picker out to repair or rescue guests. Such situation seems more likely than how the Skyliner is set up.

Or what am I missing?

They have a dedicated rescue barge in Hourglass Lake. You can see it in the water when you take the Skyliner over the lake.

 

[Phonedave]

We have never stayed at a Skyliner resort. I am curious for anyone who has, is there really a significant time savings between time it would take for a Disney Bus to take you from the resort to the park, and what the Skyliner offers? Is there really any efficiency/benefit to the Skyliner Transporation as a system, or it is it just a nice added perk/novelty for those resorts?

For any internal transportation system, I generally don't see where alternative systems outweigh the benefits of simple bus systems.

Did I get out there with a stopwatch - no. But I have stayed at Rivera. Taking the skyliner to Epcot and DHS was excellent. Aside from the one evening when it was down because of lightning, there was rarely a wait, and when they was the line moved quickly - you could easily plan how long it would take you to get to the park. Epcot at closing was a different story, there was a long line for the Skyliner, but again, it moved quickly.

 

[Skipper2]

It seems to me like if a concept like this was ever implemented in a place like WDW, some kind of ground based system would make more sense. Something like the peoplemover but with individual enclosed vehicles that are able to go around each other and take different paths. The track/roadway would be more expensive to build out but you wouldn't have the operational issues of a Gondola.

Or, Disney can just buy a fleet of robotaxis from Tesla and use the existing roads. I'm half joking so please don't derail this thread into a discussion about the delivery and viability of robotaxis.

The PeopleMover will always be a favorite of mine but unfortunately it is extremely energy intensive. Magnetic Induction Coils require a lot of juice.

 

[Skipper2]

They create multiple paths, and there are multiple cable loops, allowing for shunting and bypass.

Such as the pinched loop - https://www.dcc.at/solutions/cable-linerr-pinched-loop/

Single and double shuttle - https://www.dcc.at/solutions/cable-linerr-single-and-double-shuttle/

And bypass functions - https://www.dcc.at/solutions/cable-linerr-bypass/

These are all Cable Liner configurations, they are pulled by a cable, much like the SF cable cars.

Technology has progressed quite a bit in the 151 years since the cable cars were designed.

This is not some fantasy solution that is in somebody's head. This is in real world operations (and has been for over a decade)

Doppelmayr Group

In the city of canals there is an inspiring, elevated Doppelmayr Cable Liner® system. Fully integrated in the public transport network, the APM system transports passengers to the heart of the city.

www.dcc.at

You are on the right track, try this variation using the Whoosh systems that started this thread. 1. Assume fully automated switching control as stated. 2. The AK to TTC line is the example. It would be a triple cable line running parallel for the entire run with only limited exceptions never dropping to two for any area that isn't going to immediately accessible to intersection/switch as in the promo images. The triple line allows for load and breakdown bypass of either direction in a given area at any time of day or for events. Park open, Close, Fireworks, Run Disney Etc. This would mean any breakdown wouldn't backup the entire AK to TTC line but only to the nearest switch over which would be All Star, Blizzard, Coronado, Spur to DSprings, HS, Epcot, Typhoon, Etc as the triple line heads east and then north. The grid system they hinted at in a dense urban city environment of a station every 3 blocks is hard to picture in what is essentially a suburban sprawl more akin connected mini cities emptying all at once every day all within 10 miles of each other that is Disney. Load flexibility and reliability and the adaptability to vehicle fails that do happen are critical. Although a triple line is redundant it allows to double out bound flow at close of day by loading the "3rd" bypass line sections with excess capacity waiting for the rush. Same in reverse for openings every morning. Individual sections of the continuous 3rd line can be used to allow traffic to bypass stalled cars or to hold ready vehicles. 3. Adding an automated buddy car rescue capability that can allow any leading or following to car to connect to the stalled car. After connecting the occupied or unoccupied buddy vehicle can control by default override the stalled car and use mechanical connection brake release and then push or pull the stalled vehicle to the nearest station. Making every single vehicle capable of doing an automated assessment and mechanical tow could solve almost all stall situations. Power outage to complete transit system is unavoidable. Having a few maintenance/rescue cars would still be needed to handle anything like wheel freezes and bearing failures that make a tow unrealistic for a buddy vehicle that will likely occur in FL.