Rumor Higher Speed Rail from MCO to Disney World

[SpectroMan93]

Are there "some" people who would rather take a longer trip than drive? I am sure there are, there are some people that like almost any kind of niche thing. There are some people who think the world is still flat. The question is are there enough people who would rather take the trip such that it makes sense to invest the money in the project. Your talking about hundreds of millions of dollars, if not more, in investment and hoping to recoup that on the number of people who don't care about timing/cost, and just don't want to make the drive themselves. AND hoping there are enough people who think that way, and need the service on a regular basis enough such that its profitable. The length of the drive/projected train route from SoFL to Tamps is such that your not getting daily commuters.

I agree its always nice to have a second option. And more then one option for a service usually creates competition , and better services overall. But while its nice for the general public to have a 2nd option, that doesn't mean it's commercially viable for a private company to undertake the costs to create the second option.

I mean I think Brightline is better suited to deciding whether this line is commercially viable or not. And they're going through with it so clearly there are numbers and projections that show it is? I'm sure all of the questions and skepticism you've posed here has also been discussed by the people involved. I trust they know what they're doing. Also did you just compare people who choose to commute by rail to flat earthers? Lol what?

 

[Disstevefan1]

I love trains, but these lines must be able to make money instead of costing taxpayers money.

If they can make money, I am all for it.

 

[Andrew25]

Are there "some" people who would rather take a longer trip than drive? I am sure there are, there are some people that like almost any kind of niche thing. There are some people who think the world is still flat. The question is are there enough people who would rather take the trip such that it makes sense to invest the money in the project. Your talking about hundreds of millions of dollars, if not more, in investment and hoping to recoup that on the number of people who don't care about timing/cost, and just don't want to make the drive themselves. AND hoping there are enough people who think that way, and need the service on a regular basis enough such that its profitable. The length of the drive/projected train route from SoFL to Tamps is such that your not getting daily commuters.

I agree its always nice to have a second option. And more then one option for a service usually creates competition , and better services overall. But while its nice for the general public to have a 2nd option, that doesn't mean it's commercially viable for a private company to undertake the costs to create the second option.

Going to ignore the flat earth comment as that has no bearing in this conversation.

Brightline stopped selling their "annual pass" in order to accommodate demand from just the Miami to Orlando leg, so there's more than enough demand out there for Brightline. When Brightline first opened the Miami-West Palm leg, people questioned the profitability of such a run when it was "only" an hour away driving... and it was well attended and obviously a success as the company continues to invest into adding more stations along the current route (Fort Pierce, Cocoa, etc.), let alone pursuing Tampa.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

But while it’s nice for the general public to have a 2nd option, that doesn't mean it's commercially viable for a private company to undertake the costs to create the second option.

Well, obviously there have been many studies done and they show the ridership would be there.

The Disney stop alone would be a huge marketing opportunity for Brightline - on property or right next door doesn’t matter.

And of course it’s not just Tampa to Orlando, it’s Tampa to Orlando, West Palm, Ft. Lauderdale, and Miami. And hopefully one day Jacksonville as well.

 

[Comped]

And hopefully one day Jacksonville as well.

And other places (like Cocoa, Daytona, Lakeland, and more, per a combination of FDOT and Brightline/Sunrail planning) - between Sunrail and Brightline the only place in the region which won't see a stop is eastern Orange ccounty. Which is fine for tourists, I guess.

 

[Andrew25]

I'd imagine there will be a healthy customer base of Lakeland residents who to travel to Orlando or Tampa for work if they offer a commuter pass again.

 

[MisterPenguin]

I love trains, but these lines must be able to make money instead of costing taxpayers money.

Would you say the same thing about widening a hiway or building a new one?

 

[MisterPenguin]

But considering national wide driving personal vehicles still remains the supermajority of the means of transportation, people get over it.

But it wasn't something they voted on as their preference last century before the network of vehicular roads were built.

But the car industry certainly pushed it and advertised it as the all-American dream. This was in confluence with suburban sprawl, which, BTW, is subsidized by taxes. Some roads pay for themselves in tolls. The majority of all roads that exist are paid for by taxes. Lots and lots of taxes.

Not pointing at you, but when anyone says they don't think taxes should be used for mass transit... that's hysterical. Because their taxes are supporting the building and the continuing very expensive maintenance of the road systems.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Would you say the same thing about widening a hiway or building a new one?

How cool would it be to have a train station at Disney Springs, I love trains and Walt did too.

In my mind, we pay taxes to build and maintain roads, roads I KNOW that will be used so much they need be expanded, widened, maintained.

A train line is a gamble with tax payer money in my opinion, even if they are cool.

 

[IanDLBZF]

FYI, Lynx put out details regarding the next service change and dropped big news at the same time…
The DeLand SunRail station will open June 2!!!!!!!

 

[HauntedPirate]

But it wasn't something they voted on as their preference last century before the network of vehicular roads were built.

But the car industry certainly pushed it and advertised it as the all-American dream. This was in confluence with suburban sprawl, which, BTW, is subsidized by taxes. Some roads pay for themselves in tolls. The majority of all roads that exist are paid for by taxes. Lots and lots of taxes.

Not pointing at you, but when anyone says they don't think taxes should be used for mass transit... that's hysterical. Because their taxes are supporting the building and the continuing very expensive maintenance of the road systems.

Roads benefit everyone. Mass transit does not. Unless there's a ton of commerce happening via mass transit that we aren't aware of. Then there's the discussion around gasoline taxes going towards roads and bridges but the government wants to push everyone into EVs, which obviously don't pay gasoline taxes but are also heavier than their ICE counterparts and put a larger amount of wear and tear on the roads. But those are not discussions for this thread.

I'm all for having a rail option like the Brightline. It opens up options for visitors and residents alike, which is never a bad thing. If Brightline didn't think it was worth the cost, they wouldn't be building out the line.

 

[UNCgolf]

Roads benefit everyone. Mass transit does not. Unless there's a ton of commerce happening via mass transit that we aren't aware of. Then there's the discussion around gasoline taxes going towards roads and bridges but the government wants to push everyone into EVs, which obviously don't pay gasoline taxes but are also heavier than their ICE counterparts and put a larger amount of wear and tear on the roads. But those are not discussions for this thread.

I'm all for having a rail option like the Brightline. It opens up options for visitors and residents alike, which is never a bad thing. If Brightline didn't think it was worth the cost, they wouldn't be building out the line.

I think this is a flawed premise. Mass transit benefits roads, so if roads benefit everyone (which is arguable -- maybe not in the abstract, but individual roads certainly don't benefit everyone), then mass transit also has to benefit everyone.

And again, I say this as a person who generally prefers to have a car available and drive most places.

 

[Skibum1970]

My biggest concern with a train or light rail coming into Disney Springs is that would dump a ton of people who would need to move themselves and their luggage to their hotels. I'm not an expert on this but the current transportation buses do not have a luggage hold and could not really work with people carrying/pulling their luggage onto the buses due to space limitations.

To me, this is always part of the problem with high-speed rail, which I would support if worked out. You take the rail to your city destination but you still have to get from the station to your ultimate destination (e.g., Hotel, amusement park, museum, etc.). So, once you get to your city, you're back to using car service since most cities do not have the best infrastructure for mass transit options.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

A train line is a gamble with tax payer money in my opinion, even if they are cool.

Brightline isn’t. Sunrail is.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Brightline isn’t. Sunrail is.

Good, we are getting there....

 

[lazyboy97o]

I'd imagine there will be a healthy customer base of Lakeland residents who to travel to Orlando or Tampa for work if they offer a commuter pass again.

I know it probably sounds crazy, but SunRail should just be a cross state commuter system that essentially mirrors I-4. Daytona to Tampa. Florida is looking at Amtrak expanding service in the state which would have to be state-funded anyway.

Roads benefit everyone. Mass transit does not.

The design of roads in the US is incredibly hostile to a lot of people. The US has a serious issue with killing pedestrians.

There are these animations out there showing how a block of congestion can all fit in a streetcar. That’s a benefit to road users.

Brightline isn’t. Sunrail is.

Eh, Brightline gets plenty of public funds. It’s just not ongoing funding.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Eh, Brightline gets plenty of public funds. It’s just not ongoing funding.

Don’t all businesses? Including Disney Parks?

Or maybe you are referring to something specific I’m not aware of.

 

[Andrew25]

We're never getting rid of personal vehicles in the US... but we can certainly reduce the need to rely on them entirely.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Don’t all businesses? Including Disney Parks?

Or maybe you are referring to something specific I’m not aware of.

Disney doesn’t get grants that make up a large portion of their funding for an attraction.

We're never getting rid of personal vehicles in the US... but we can certainly reduce the need to rely on them entirely.

It’s such a weird concern. Part of what makes transit appealing to many is traffic. How many cities with great transit networks don’t also have heavy traffic?

 

[Lilofan]

We're never getting rid of personal vehicles in the US... but we can certainly reduce the need to rely on them entirely.

Rely of driving is not like in the past. One can order and delivered with a click of a mouse and or a swipe of an iPhone without even leaving the comfort of your home. This made Bezos one of the richest people on the planet at almost $200B net worth and growing.