Height balloons, this time between TTC and Contemporary

[Gregoryp73]

I agree with this - while the MK resorts have good service to the MK, and Epcot resorts have good service to Epcot/DHS, thats about where it ends. We find the Deluxes to have the worst overall transportation, and the moderates and values - though its all buses - are far easier to use and faster overall. Waiting for a bus at a Deluxe is often terrible, and with no queue you land up getting cut by a huge family that shows up as the bus is approaching all too often.

I think that's why I like the beach club so much...while not my favorite themed hotel, I really only use the bus to go to the AK. For DHS is relaxing boat, for EC it's a short walk, and for MK I'll usually go to epcot to catch the monorail.

 

[dsnyfreak]

maybe they are going to make it a skyride over the lagoon..:lookaroun
seriously though. im thinking it may be some sort of $400 a night hotel that noone can really afford...or another discovery island type place where you can visit animals like at a state park.:veryconfu

 

[Tom]

maybe they are going to make it a skyride over the lagoon..:lookaroun
seriously though. im thinking it may be some sort of $400 a night hotel that noone can really afford...or another discovery island type place where you can visit animals like at a state park.:veryconfu

I don't think they'll put wildlife that close to such a populated and high traffic area.

One location or another, they're seriously pondering a new hotel. They're just trying to see which location would be the least offensive, and most economical.

 

[Gregoryp73]

I don't think they'll put wildlife that close to such a populated and high traffic area.

One location or another, they're seriously pondering a new hotel. They're just trying to see which location would be the least offensive, and most economical.

Also, I doubt they would want to build something to compete with animal kingdom...it's already not a "full-day" park in some peoples eyes.

Here's another thought. What about an adventure park? They had talked about doing night kingdom for awhile...I don't think they would have as much of an issue putting up an area with zip lines or rock walls on that area if they can find "spots" that are ok to build on. It would be a bit of an odd location though...

 

[tikiman]

Also, I doubt they would want to build something to compete with animal kingdom...it's already not a "full-day" park in some peoples eyes.

Here's another thought. What about an adventure park? They had talked about doing night kingdom for awhile...I don't think they would have as much of an issue putting up an area with zip lines or rock walls on that area if they can find "spots" that are ok to build on. It would be a bit of an odd location though...

They had a spot ready for Night Kingdom. The problems with the economy delayed that from happening.

 

[Tom]

Also, I doubt they would want to build something to compete with animal kingdom...it's already not a "full-day" park in some peoples eyes.

Here's another thought. What about an adventure park? They had talked about doing night kingdom for awhile...I don't think they would have as much of an issue putting up an area with zip lines or rock walls on that area if they can find "spots" that are ok to build on. It would be a bit of an odd location though...

Park ideas are great, but if you're implying that some sort of attraction would be built around the lagoon, that won't be the case. Whatever happens at the Poly or the empty plot (if anything) will be accommodations, not attractions.

 

[tomman710]

I know they have an empty pleasure island they don't know what to do with but I think it'd be great to put some sort of waterfront entertainment area, restaurants, shops (of course), and maybe a water night time show with seating around the lagoon ... so basically Hyperion Wharf but around this lagoon ...

... of course I usually stay at one of those monorail resorts so I am probably being biased or maybe lazy in not wanting to go to Downtown Disney ... but still it could be pretty cool to have a little entertainment district around the lagoon.

 

[Gregoryp73]

Park ideas are great, but if you're implying that some sort of attraction would be built around the lagoon, that won't be the case. Whatever happens at the Poly or the empty plot (if anything) will be accommodations, not attractions.

Wholeheartdly agree that the Poly site balloons are for DVC and Poly Upgrades.

I was referring to the ones by the contemporary. I don't really see them building a second tower...and most everyone said where they saw the balloons was unbuildable for a hotel setting.

I was thinking of other options for that large plot by Contemporary...and it wouldn't be unlike disney to think of other options if they can swing something that won't absolutely sink into wetlands...

 

[Master Yoda]

Wholeheartdly agree that the Poly site balloons are for DVC and Poly Upgrades.

I was referring to the ones by the contemporary. I don't really see them building a second tower...and most everyone said where they saw the balloons was unbuildable for a hotel setting.

I was thinking of other options for that large plot by Contemporary...and it wouldn't be unlike disney to think of other options if they can swing something that won't absolutely sink into wetlands...

There is really no such thing as "unbuildable". You can technically build anywhere it is just that it will be less or more expensive to do so depending on the site conditions. Eventually, the cost to build on that site and the profit that can be made from doing so are going to be on the right side of each other and something will get built there.

 

[Tom]

Wholeheartdly agree that the Poly site balloons are for DVC and Poly Upgrades.

I was referring to the ones by the contemporary. I don't really see them building a second tower...and most everyone said where they saw the balloons was unbuildable for a hotel setting.

I was thinking of other options for that large plot by Contemporary...and it wouldn't be unlike disney to think of other options if they can swing something that won't absolutely sink into wetlands...

The fact that they're flying sight line balloons at the hotel plot between CR and TTC says that Disney is not in full agreement with internet forum members who claim that the ground is unbuildable.

It IS buildable. And right now, they're doing what I've predicted for some time....weighing the option between cramming DVC into the Poly somehow vs building the long anticipated fourth monorail resort, which could easily be a combo Resort/DVC.

Adding a resort to that area will only increase traffic moderately. Adding an attraction or destination of any kind would create an absolute nightmare, and busy the place up. At night, when things shut down with the MK, that entire area has to "go to sleep". Adding anything that resembles night time entertainment would be wholly out of place and unwanted.

Besides, if people think that adding a tastefully designed resort hotel to the lagoon shore would look bad, imagine adding something DTD-ish.

 

[tikiman]

I was always told they did not build where the Venetian was going to go because of budgets in the 70s and 80s. They revisited the idea of adding the Venetian and even had drawn up plans in the 90s. No one at Disney ever mentioned that the land was unbuildable and in fact the original Venetian was to be half built out in the lagoon.

As for them deciding between expanding the Polynesian or adding over next to the TTC, it is not an either or because they are building at the Polynesian to add DVC. I think the only question is will they also build next to the TTC or maybe the question is when.

 

[njDizFan]

I think with the impednign Poly DVC expansion and if they build out Ft. Wilderness all the way to 7SL that area will be pretty packed.

I'm sure we've talked about it before but why haven't they gone in the other direction allong the shores of Bay Lake?

The Persian was destined for that area and it's a prime location with a lot more shoreline.

 

[tikiman]

I think with the impednign Poly DVC expansion and if they build out Ft. Wilderness all the way to 7SL that area will be pretty packed.

I'm sure we've talked about it before but why haven't they gone in the other direction allong the shores of Bay Lake?

The Persian was destined for that area and it's a prime location with a lot more shoreline.

I wondered the same thing but maybe they figure they can get more money if they put DVC on the monorail.

 

[Master Yoda]

I was always told they did not build where the Venetian was going to go because of budgets in the 70s and 80s. They revisited the idea of adding the Venetian and even had drawn up plans in the 90s. No one at Disney ever mentioned that the land was unbuildable and in fact the original Venetian was to be half built out in the lagoon.

As for them deciding between expanding the Polynesian or adding over next to the TTC, it is not an either or because they are building at the Polynesian to add DVC. I think the only question is will they also build next to the TTC or maybe the question is when.

From what I was told by a former co-worker that supposedly worked on the surveying done in the 90's is that test piles suffered from a condition called negative skin friction. This is where a high water table actually sucks friction piles into the ground. While this did not make the land completely useless for building until the end of time, it did make the prospect much more expensive. Turn the clock forward 20 years and we now have better, less expensive ways to deal with this problem combined with the profit generated by DVC resorts and you have a mix that could equal building on a less than idea plot of land being profitable. Also building over a man made lake is typically much easier than building over a natural source of water. In the case of the 7 seas lagoon you are only dealing with 40 years worth of silt. In the case of a natural lake you might be dealing with hundreds even thousands of years worth of it.

 

[Tom]

I was always told they did not build where the Venetian was going to go because of budgets in the 70s and 80s. They revisited the idea of adding the Venetian and even had drawn up plans in the 90s. No one at Disney ever mentioned that the land was unbuildable and in fact the original Venetian was to be half built out in the lagoon.

As for them deciding between expanding the Polynesian or adding over next to the TTC, it is not an either or because they are building at the Polynesian to add DVC. I think the only question is will they also build next to the TTC or maybe the question is when.

You're probably right about it not being an either/or. We know Poly DVC is coming. But we now know they're also (finally) entertaining the idea of building on the empty plot. I bet my wallet the new one will include DVC (like Aulani, where half the resort is regular rooms, half is DVC). So, what I predict they're deciding right now is which one to do FIRST. Eventually, both will happen, and both will must assuredly include DVC.

BTW, TikiMan, I have a neat little story to tell you, that I think you'd appreciate. I'll PM you this weekend when I get a minute.

I think with the impednign Poly DVC expansion and if they build out Ft. Wilderness all the way to 7SL that area will be pretty packed.

I'm sure we've talked about it before but why haven't they gone in the other direction allong the shores of Bay Lake?

The Persian was destined for that area and it's a prime location with a lot more shoreline.

How can Ft Wilderness be built to 7SL? Wilderness Lodge is in the way. The Campgrounds are at the southeast end of Bay Lake. Any expansion over there would have almost no impact to the 7SL area.

But the areas around Bay Lake are far less ready for development. That land was there, and other than where they've developed already, they didn't do much of anything. It's also close to the north property line, if I'm remembering the map correctly. They could possibly do something along the east bank, but it would require a LOT of new infrastructure just to support development.

I wondered the same thing but maybe they figure they can get more money if they put DVC on the monorail.

Oh, most definitely.

From what I was told by a former co-worker that supposedly worked on the surveying done in the 90's is that test piles suffered from a condition called negative skin friction. This is where a high water table actually sucks friction piles into the ground. While this did not make the land completely useless for building until the end of time, it did make the prospect much more expensive. Turn the clock forward 20 years and we now have better, less expensive ways to deal with this problem combined with the profit generated by DVC resorts and you have a mix that could equal building on a less than idea plot of land being profitable. Also building over a man made lake is typically much easier than building over a natural source of water. In the case of the 7 seas lagoon you are only dealing with 40 years worth of silt. In the case of a natural lake you might be dealing with hundreds even thousands of years worth of it.

Right. They built 7SL, and they can continue to implement engineered soils with today's technologies. With enough lime, you can do anything here on Indiana's slimy, nasty clay. :lol:

 

[njDizFan]

I am trying to find the thread, it was mentioned several times. I am looking at the map, maybe it was a wilderness lodge expansion...geez

Anybody have a link to that proposed map(fan made) showing the expansion into the 7 seas lagoon.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

There were plans for a Tomorrowland themed hotel which would be connected to Tomorrowland via the People Mover. The hotel would have a lot of high-tech conveniences as well as theming, sort of like staying in a hotel with a lobby like space mountain's queue. For convenience, a lot of guests would probably like taking the People Mover into the park instead of walking over the Contemporary to take the monorail.

The people mover would also allow guests inside of MK to take the People Mover over the second floor of this futuristically styled hotel where there would have been some sort of show, be it alien band featuring audioanimatronics, or live performers, and a restaurant. Think an upscale Cosmic Ray's with new technology. Exiting the show area, into the hotel proper, would be the same as leaving the park. Due to the proximity to Tomorrowland, this hotel was supposed to have a fascade which looked futuristic and which lit up at night, and would attract guests to the entertainment/restaurant level.

I am unsure if this is what the sight line testing is about . . . if done properly the Tomorrowland Hotel could be a big plus for Tomorrowland, as well as turning the People Mover into a real transportation system.

There were also rumors that the construction in the former SkyWay station in Fantasyland would allow for some sort of Premiere Entrance to the park, I think that the Tomorrowland Hotel is more feasible.

 

[Master Yoda]

There were plans for a Tomorrowland themed hotel which would be connected to Tomorrowland via the People Mover. The hotel would have a lot of high-tech conveniences as well as theming, sort of like staying in a hotel with a lobby like space mountain's queue. For convenience, a lot of guests would probably like taking the People Mover into the park instead of walking over the Contemporary to take the monorail.

The people mover would also allow guests inside of MK to take the People Mover over the second floor of this futuristically styled hotel where there would have been some sort of show, be it alien band featuring audioanimatronics, or live performers, and a restaurant. Think an upscale Cosmic Ray's with new technology. Exiting the show area, into the hotel proper, would be the same as leaving the park. Due to the proximity to Tomorrowland, this hotel was supposed to have a fascade which looked futuristic and which lit up at night, and would attract guests to the entertainment/restaurant level.

I am unsure if this is what the sight line testing is about . . . if done properly the Tomorrowland Hotel could be a big plus for Tomorrowland, as well as turning the People Mover into a real transportation system.

There were also rumors that the construction in the former SkyWay station in Fantasyland would allow for some sort of Premiere Entrance to the park, I think that the Tomorrowland Hotel is more feasible.

Not likely as the the balloons were on a section of land between the Contemporary and the TTC.

 

[Camera1950s]

I like the prospects. Let's remember that lodgings near the MK tend to be theamed after a section of the MK.
GF = Main street
Poly = Adventure land
Contemporary = Tomorrow land (I think to far away for another tower)
Wilderness lodge and fort = Frontier land

The only lands missing are:
a small Liberty square (not probable, would look like the GF)
a small circus land (less likely, who wants a tent with monorail access)
or
The first major park expansion/rework in a very long time, Fantasy land.
(my bet is here, who would not love to stay in a castile)

Think of all the possibilities for a tallish resort.
king

 

[Gregoryp73]

The fact that they're flying sight line balloons at the hotel plot between CR and TTC says that Disney is not in full agreement with internet forum members who claim that the ground is unbuildable.

It IS buildable. And right now, they're doing what I've predicted for some time....weighing the option between cramming DVC into the Poly somehow vs building the long anticipated fourth monorail resort, which could easily be a combo Resort/DVC.

Adding a resort to that area will only increase traffic moderately. Adding an attraction or destination of any kind would create an absolute nightmare, and busy the place up. At night, when things shut down with the MK, that entire area has to "go to sleep". Adding anything that resembles night time entertainment would be wholly out of place and unwanted.

Besides, if people think that adding a tastefully designed resort hotel to the lagoon shore would look bad, imagine adding something DTD-ish.

I am totally hoping it is a resort rather than some sort of alternate addition (i.e. waterpark, adventure park, or shopping area)...

My main concern is them breaking away from the MK mirror on this one. While a venetian, or asian resort would have been nice back in the day...i like how SSL and BL is set up to mirror the lands of MK. They are only missing one representation....Fantasyland.

I would love for them to do this....in a 16 century germanic fashion (cobblestone streets, carraiges, alps pool slide)...

Putting any other type of hotel in would detract from the theme they currently have in place.