I loved Horizons and WOM. I have audio of the rides on my iPod. I watched a video of both the other day. And slow was definitely the word of the day.
The only thing I would ever be upset if they got rid of would be Spaceship Earth
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News Guardians of the Galaxy Cosmic Rewind attraction confirmed for Epcot
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
The only thing I would ever be upset if they got rid of would be Spaceship Earth
HMF
Well-Known Member
I am betting on Animal Kingdom in the space currently housing craporama.
Maeryk
Well-Known Member
Sure. if the original ideologies put butts in seats. At the moment, the original ideology sees WS packed with stumbling drunks, and FW more or less walked through between the monorail and the booze carts. FW is dying a slow and horrible death. And saying "But it's ideologically pure!" isn't going to help. I know everyone loves to hate on Disney, and hiss the name of the current CEO and whoever is in charge of parks.. but I've been hearing that since before Epcot opened. Disney has to play the long game, and look at trends, and see what is drawing people in. And they do that.. with surveys, test audiences, etc. They aren't blindly dropping mumbledy million bucks on something and hoping it will work.
The trick, IMO, is to combine cutting edge with mild thrills and continue the edutainment. Everyone griping seems convinced they are utterly icapable of that. I am not nearly as convinced. I'm at least willing to wait and see what comes of it before I dismiss it out of hand, because my crystal ball has told me change, all change, just sucks.
The sourpusses are gonna be sourpusses, and that's their right. I choose to look forward to what could be one heck of an attraction, featuring characters I identify with and love a lot more than Ellen, Alex, and Bill Nye the psedoscience "Saves the world" guy. In fact, I wonder if his awful new tv show has spurred Disney to want to distance themselves from him. Wouldn't be the first actor for that to happen to.
ppete1975
Well-Known Member
I don't see the building in the blue sky vision.. but its hard to tell with the way that drawing is
The_Jobu
Well-Known Member
Maeryk
Well-Known Member
Its lower left.. behind the guys if it's the still from the expo.
BenJacobs
Well-Known Member
That's why they are updating FW, the concept art looks incredible, with loads of buildings that people haven't even talked about. But what I'm trying to say is that there are loads of better options for IPs, as this is the trend in Epcot, for a ride, ones that can actually stay true to the ideologies.
LorangeJuice
Active Member
It HAS adapted and diverged! I'm still waiting for the part where people admit those adaptations and diversions didn't make the park any better instead of focusing on bashing those that are "idealists" when we are actually being realists here lol!
The diversions and adaptations to date have all been based on the fads of the day. Thrills. C&D-list celebrities. Screens. Now, it's IP and just plain copying off Universal. Should Disney have shoved Hannah Montana and company into Future World because it was popular? NO! Can you agree with me on that? I sure HOPE so! This is why it's NOT the rigid idealists vs. everyone else.
Do you know why Horizons is still lamented 18 years after it closed? It's because it wasn't replaced by something better. The same with JII, and the list goes on.
Do you know why fans of the original EPCOT Center are not happy about the direction of the park? It's because it's not nearly as cohesive as it once was.
Ellen's Energy Adventure wasn't really that good either and well past its prime. I haven't really seen anyone upset about its closing, yet STILL there's a passionate discussion on the direction of the park going on here. That HAS to tell you something! It's not the fact that there's a change that's the problem here. It's not purist/idealists vs. everyone else, I promise. Please stop making it an "us vs. them" kind of thing.
The general trend in quality and cohesiveness has gone down while the prices have gone up. That's not rocket science. That's common sense. It's not being an idealist. It's just pointing out reality.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
I wasn't responding to something you yourself said directly.
montyz81
Well-Known Member
But there is a history of them fixing it (albeit only 1 time). I think they did a nice moving back to the original Epcot Center intent with TT 2.0. Not all the way there, but at least they did go in that direction.
hpyhnt 1000
Well-Known Member
Been thinking about how this could remotely "fit" into Epcot and keeping it "true to the original vision" of the park.* Some might remember the interview with Joe Rohde related to Mission: Breakout at DCA, where he emphasized that these Marvel additions are meant to look disruptive and exist in a sort of alternative reality. (“It’s not a fantasy world,” Rohde said in an interview with The [LA] Times. “It is an alternative reality world. It appears in our world and transforms it.”)
We also know that the M:B overlay gets (if you'll pardon the use of an overused term) fairly meta. There's no attempt to theme the thing to the fictional Hollywoodland section of DCA. Rather, it simply existing is the backstory; The Collector chose to display his collection at Disneyland Resort because it's a known major tourist destination. There's even Figment being part of the collection and Quill's dialogue of "Is that Disneyland? This is so cool!" when he finds out they were being displayed there. All very wink-wink and self-referential.
So all of that makes me wonder if we're looking at a similar situation with the Epcot attraction. Maybe the idea is that this exists in "Epcot Center" 2021 (or whatever the park is called by then), which has had its World's Fair roots reinforced during the upcoming transformation. And the Guardians have been brought in to perform a demonstration or exhibition about energy or some other topic. But something goes wrong, they need our help to fix it, there's some audience interactivity, and it all culminates in a quick blast through space with everything sorted out and them expressing their gratitude.
Or maybe Quill "remembers" coming to EPCOT Center as a kid and persuades his fellow Guardians to make a trip back to check it out (such a story builds on the photo from the D23 presentation). Could even be he hears a classic song from the park on his mixtape (old UoE finale theme?) and that makes him want to come back. But then when they try to leave there's something wrong with the ship, or some evil villain spots them/wants to stop them, now they need our help, yadda yadda, you get the drill.
Do any of those scenarios truly "fit" into Epcot? In the strictest sense certainly not, but I could see how a justification can be made. They also leave open a chance that the initial thrust of the attraction is that you are entering an exhibit at the Epcot World's Fair (educational! true to vision!) before your visit gets interrupted by the Guardians plot line.
Just my $.02 on this. At least this nonsense means our ToT (arguably the best of the bunch and a pinnacle of Imagineering) remains, and that is something I think worth celebrating.
*I don't think it ever really can, but it's an amusing intellectual exercise nonetheless
We also know that the M:B overlay gets (if you'll pardon the use of an overused term) fairly meta. There's no attempt to theme the thing to the fictional Hollywoodland section of DCA. Rather, it simply existing is the backstory; The Collector chose to display his collection at Disneyland Resort because it's a known major tourist destination. There's even Figment being part of the collection and Quill's dialogue of "Is that Disneyland? This is so cool!" when he finds out they were being displayed there. All very wink-wink and self-referential.
So all of that makes me wonder if we're looking at a similar situation with the Epcot attraction. Maybe the idea is that this exists in "Epcot Center" 2021 (or whatever the park is called by then), which has had its World's Fair roots reinforced during the upcoming transformation. And the Guardians have been brought in to perform a demonstration or exhibition about energy or some other topic. But something goes wrong, they need our help to fix it, there's some audience interactivity, and it all culminates in a quick blast through space with everything sorted out and them expressing their gratitude.
Or maybe Quill "remembers" coming to EPCOT Center as a kid and persuades his fellow Guardians to make a trip back to check it out (such a story builds on the photo from the D23 presentation). Could even be he hears a classic song from the park on his mixtape (old UoE finale theme?) and that makes him want to come back. But then when they try to leave there's something wrong with the ship, or some evil villain spots them/wants to stop them, now they need our help, yadda yadda, you get the drill.
Do any of those scenarios truly "fit" into Epcot? In the strictest sense certainly not, but I could see how a justification can be made. They also leave open a chance that the initial thrust of the attraction is that you are entering an exhibit at the Epcot World's Fair (educational! true to vision!) before your visit gets interrupted by the Guardians plot line.
Just my $.02 on this. At least this nonsense means our ToT (arguably the best of the bunch and a pinnacle of Imagineering) remains, and that is something I think worth celebrating.
*I don't think it ever really can, but it's an amusing intellectual exercise nonetheless
The_Jobu
Well-Known Member
Maeryk
Well-Known Member
What I see is 8 people going "nothing will ever be as good as horizons was".. people I can only assume don't actually remember Horizons. or "Sure, Energy SUCKS ROCKS, but we shouldn't change anything.. because whatever comes next will undoubtedly be worse."
You may not think it comes off that way, but it does. What I don't see are a lot of suggestions of what would be better. Just griping that we are finally getting some much needed updating.. updating that isn't simply slapping an IP into an already existing ride (Nemo) and then pretty much ignoring the entire rest of the thing in favor of the gift shop. I love that they are (apparently) keeping the energy building. But it's time for be taken out to the back 40 and put down. Disney spent a ridiculous amount of money on Marvel. Slightly less than it spent for Lucasfilm. it only makes sense that they are going to use it when/wherever they can. I know people hate IP in epcot. I get that. I just don't happen to share it.
You and others keep saying "ripping off Universal".. I really don't think that is what is going to happen here. I think you are going to get a new, innovative ride system, using a relatable ip, that will continue the mission and concept of Epcot. But again, y'all have used your crystal balls (say hi to Leota for me) and already know everything there is to know about this ride, apparently.
Nemo is in Living Seas. Lion King in Land. Figment in Imagination. Test Track is a giant GM ad, with pretty much zero "educational" anything to it at this point. Princesses in all the WS countries they come from.. for all the complaining about Anna and Elsa in Norway, Snow, Belle, Mulan, Jasmine, and a giant cat have been roaming around WS countries for decades.
Epcot needs to appeal to the teens. It just has to. WS is for "old people" as my kids keep reminding me.. it's about drinking and eating and shopping.. they were ecstatic when boring old maelstrom went away and a relatable IP went in. FW is, frankly, boring, for anyone not running the nostalgia game. Kids today are not the same as we were when we first walked in in the early 80s. sorry. It's just the way it is. Disney has to set the hook to keep them interested. Back then, when we played with the roller coaster builder in Communicore, you couldn't run a full roller coaster sim on your cell phone.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
It belongs in Epcot as much as Mission Space, Test Track, or Soarin' does.
The_Jobu
Well-Known Member
You know they don't just build what your kids want, right? Some kids actually enjoy science centers, museums, learning... all that old people stuff.
If they just built what kids like they'd have Six Flags. EPCOT aims (aimed) higher.
misterID
Well-Known Member
This is complete nonsense. Up and down. The one person who has a deranged obsession /issue with HORIZONS is you, because you constantly bring it up on your own, trash it from out of nowhere, flame other posters, which is clearly your attempt to start an argument. You're making arguments against the posters here, not a defense of an attraction. That is seriously all you do.
I do remember HORIZONS. And it was an incredible attraction. And no, it wasn't closed by a sinkhole, which you belligerently argued over with people who actually know what they're talking about. Everything you argue is an opinion you brew out of your own head and own tastes and your own beliefs, not the truth.
A lot of us have not argued against MARVEL but the placement of the attractions.
Mike S
Well-Known Member
Now you're just being crazy.
Thankfully they found out it would be extremely difficult to tear the Omnimover track out of Spaceship Earth.
And properly too. Oh well.
I never experienced Horizons so I don't have any nostalgia for it but from what I've seen in videos it looked amazing. All they would've had to do were periodic refreshes like Spaceship Earth has gotten over the years. Even American Adventure got all new animatronics in one update back in the 90's. It's replacement hasn't exactly set the world on fire either. You don't speak for everyone.
Please yes.
The reason FW languished was lack of proper updates and crappy ones like Imagination. Ellen shouldn't have stayed as long as she did. A proper update to Energy should've happened much sooner but now there's really no more hope at all so whatever. The point I'm making here is that proper updates to Epcot that kept in the original theme weren't nearly as impossible as some of you claim them to be. None of the "purists" would say nothing should've changed from 1982 and that EPCOT Center should've been a museum. Only that the changes should've been done appropriately.
The second one is more likely.
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Kamikaze
Well-Known Member
But yet you still posted it as if you had.
There isn't a real reason to use ESPN in the parks. They use ABC when appropriate.
Both to the movie posters. Both to the comics. I will say that SOME of the comics only have Disney on the inside, but some have both.
At the end of an episode of SportsCenter, it carries a Disney copyright. Not sure why Marvel would have anything to do with Moana or SportsCenter. I said that Marvel was Disney, not that Disney was Marvel, or that you can interchange the Division names.
One owner, different, co-existing divisions. They are supposed to build synergy off of each other, not be completely separate. If Disney sees an opportunity for ESPN in the parks, they would 100% take advantage of it. Did you know it used to be Disney's Wide World of Sports before they rebranded it to ESPN for the synergy?
They do teach about things in Seas. If you know it already, that can't be held against Disney. If you don't think you can learn there, you aren't paying attention.
Now, you're right about FEA. There isn't any knowledge being dropped about Norway there. But did you used to sit through the Maelstrom post ride video? Or did you walk through? Be honest.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
If it was about energy, why not say that? Disney made a point of saying how the project connected to EPCOT Center and it was not energy.
Disney says the park’s ideals are not changing. So which is it?
Link?