Fountain & Bottled Drink, Popcorn, Pretzel, and Other Snack Item Prices Exponentially

[Jon81uk]

.until making the DDP seem to have more value by jacking up the cost of dining got to us.

I think the DDP has affected quality of the food at a lot of restaurants, but I don't think its the DDP causing price increases. As noted by the prices increasing on fountain drinks and snacks discussed in this thread, prices are going up anyway. Prices have gone up so they can make more money. Quality has gone down because the share of the DDP that goes to the individual restaurant doesn't cover the true cost of the meal.

 

[Lensman]

What I meant to say was by adding Club 33 to every park in WDW, combined with budget cuts, increased prices, temporary attractions, and movie-tie-in-oblivion, it seems as if WDW is trying to cater more to the Elites, rather than tourists and middle class locals. Don’t forget the $600 Tomorrowland Cabanas!

As long as Disney makes an appropriate ginormous margin on these whales, I don't see them negatively affecting my experience that much, if at all. I do feel for the people it bothers so much.

In fact, I was thinking that if they could replace the 10% of their lowest margin visitors with 1/10th that number of visitors paying 10x as much and generating 10x the per-person profit, then I could see that benefiting me, as long as these people didn't ride more than 10x the number of rides that the lower margin customers were riding. But I could also see how this could be viewed as somewhat selfish of me. At any rate it's not like I'm praying for this to happen, but if it does I'm going to try not to let it bother me so much. And I have to hope that the squeeze doesn't get all the way up to my demographic.

BTW, I'm not sure how budget cuts, temporary attractions, and movie-tie-ins particularly cater to elites vs middle class tourists. I'd actually hope for the opposite effect where catering to the elites means higher budgets for the top-of-the-line attractions that the elites expect. I'd just worry that these attractions would end up being too low-capacity.

I do think the Tomorrowland cabanas are funny and feel out of place. Does anyone actually pay for them?

 

[xdan0920]

As people who whine aren't ad naseum as well? what kind of echo chamber do you want if opinions that don't match yours deserve to be silenced?

Take it easy kid. You can spout off your opinion all you want. Maybe start a thread that says, "Disney prices, are they high enough?" and go on and on about how you paid $12.50 for a beer at AT&T stadium one time. You can also toss out your little Econ 100 level platitudes. You can bring the usual crew with you, and the rest of us can be left to discuss what is happening at WDW.

 

[DisneyCane]

While your point is well- taken, the amount of promotional consideration Disney receives from exclusively promoting Coke products is likely tremendous - their contract is so tight, you literally cannot buy a Pepsi product on Disney property, even at the third-party owned gas stations. It has been established in the past that it is a myth that Disney gets it for "free", but they also do get a very severe discount/subsidy arrangement which is why Coke is so prominently branded all over those cups and stations, etc.

That said, even if it costs 50 cents (I'd guesstimate it is more in the 30-cent range, but have nothing other than assumption on that one, like anyone else), that really is "pennies" to most people (conceptually if not technically) when you compare the cost.

I'm from the North East, which is one of the most expensive places in the nation for food. So I used to think the prices at WDW were decently reasonable. That has markedly changed in the past ten years or so, and really so much so in the last few. I mean, $13 for a fast food burger "hot" off the warmer with a small handful of okay-if-you-douse-in-ketchup fries? With this price increase on drinks, with tax we are hitting $20 for a fast food meal. So a family of four is looking at $80 for what is really a small amount of food.

Some will compare this to a movie or a football game, but clearly - this is different. Those are individual vendors trying to make ancillary money - either the theaters, or those running the sport venues. In this case, it all goes to Disney. The problem is, Disney finance treats each restaurant like it is independent, which is one reason we have seen such extreme cuts in quantity/quality and such massive increases in price. You also don't spend a week eating at those venues - most people don't even eat a "meal" there if they are smart ("fork and dine" excluded), let alone three meals a day for a week when captive on property.

That's where I think this bubble will burst ultimately with Disney - it's no longer just a premium hotel cost to stay on property, it is starting to cost so much more to stay on property to eat that you can easily cover the cost of a rental car just eating a few off-property meals. And people who have cars can go other places, too - like Universal. It is taking us back before MYW, when they almost made it seem a bargain to stay for longer. Everything else has gotten so expensive around it, the savings on admission looks worse and worse every year.

Disney's contract with Coke isn't really out of the ordinary. If you've been to Las Vegas, try to find a Coke product on an MGM Resorts property. You can't. Even when they had on property McDonald's (who has a nationwide contract with Coke), you could only get Pepsi. The only noticeable promotion for Pepsi on any of the properties is one sign on the outside of New York New York. There might be some signage on/in the T-Mobile arena.

I'm not arguing that you are getting a bargain at Disney, you are not. Disney is not all that different from a sporting venue or movie theatre. They are all entertainment venues that make their profit on a combination of admission tickets, food sales and, in the case of Disney and sporting venues, merchandise sales.

As far as the argument about eating at Disney for a week, it is the same as any tourist destination/resort. Using the Las Vegas example again, there is a Buca Di Beppo in the Excalibur. A large spaghetti with meat sauce is $36.49 vs $31.99 at the one closest to my home in South Florida. That is 14% higher. How about $20.00 for a breakfast buffet that doesn't even have a custom omelet station?

Food and beverage sales are a factor in the profit margin. To pull some information from another post of mine, Disney parks and resorts has an operating margin of around 18%. Vail Resorts (used for comparison as another high end resort company) had an operating margin for FY2018 of 18.89%. The aforementioned MGM Resorts International (another hotel/entertainment company) is at 17.11%. The operating margin for Disney parks and resort is right in line with similar resort companies. They need to stay in a comparable range or their stock will be hit and they will have to pay more to borrow money. The food and beverage pricing is part of the equation. If they take a lower gross margin on food and beverage, they will have to make it up somewhere else (admission prices, room rates, etc.) in order to end up at the same operating margin for the division.

It doesn't matter that the quick service locations serve food that is similar to fast food establishments. Disney is not operating a McDonald's franchise at Cosmic Ray's. They have a concession operation in a theme park that is used to generate profit for the theme park. Disney (and any resort operator) is targeting people's discretionary income, McDonald's targeting people's non-discretionary need to eat.

If you don't like the price they charge then don't buy the product. Bring food with you or go off property to eat. If you consider eating on property to be an integral part of the experience and you think that it isn't priced fairly, then go to Universal instead (if they charge an acceptable price, I have no idea how their food/beverage pricing compares).

 

[eliza61nyc]

I agree with you 99%

The other 1% is “luxury”

If people continue to use that label and they try to continue to price that way...it’s like plowing through the iceberg.

The next recession will show how bad an approach that is.

But it's not an "either/or" situation. I don't think Disney (or my mega corp) thinks long term like that anymore, so the "next" recession is a foreign concept. It's not like me and you who perhaps are looking at their retirement accounts and trying to figure out the right allocation so when the next recession hits and we know it will eventually come, we'll mitigate the loss. Mega corp is thinking "this quarter" for the most part.

Whatever we call the product, megacorp is going to squeeze every last dime of profit out of it, when the next recession hits and I think (my crystal ball is a fuzzy as every one else's) we still have another year outta this bull. lol that's a lot of sodas at jacked up prices to be sold.

 

[eliza61nyc]

It doesn't matter that the quick service locations serve food that is similar to fast food establishments. Disney is not operating a McDonald's franchise at Cosmic Ray's. They have a concession operation in a theme park that is used to generate profit for the theme park. Disney (and any resort operator) is targeting people's discretionary income, McDonald's targeting people's non-discretionary need to eat.

If you don't like the price they charge then don't buy the product. Bring food with you or go off property to eat. If you consider eating on property to be an integral part of the experience and you think that it isn't priced fairly, then go to Universal instead (if they charge an acceptable price, I have no idea how their food/beverage pricing compares).

And you better go quickly because I'll bet dollars to donuts that they will creep their prices up to match Disney.
right now soda is ~ 60 cent cheaper and water is 3.00 a bottle.

 

[eliza61nyc]

I see this account all the time...and I have to ask: are you doing that because you WANT to? Does it make you happy?

Or is it more like Work from home?


Also...I doubt disney is really supportive at all. I can see them eventually building without or retrofitting the kitchens out. They’ve done surveys on this.

The goal of DVC is not for them to “make it cheaper for you”...it’s to guarantee you’ll always be there with your big, fat wallet.

I think most dvc'er do it because they want too. Most dvc'ers (and this is just my feeling from the dvc website) enjoy their timeshare because it allows them to vacation more like the way they want.

I never, ever like getting my troops up early to try and get to a breakfast, especially when they were little. lol, my minions were born in the dark ages before double wide, 18 wheeler bus strollers came about. You can't imagine the headache trying to get a 3,5 and 7 year old on a disney bus to make it to breakfast.
We purchased the 2nd year we went and I almost weep with joy the firs time I could wake up, havecoffee on the balcony and realizing I did not have to get the troops moving. Nope we don't do rope drop. go into the kitchen, pop in some eggo waffles, whip up scrambled eggs and in 15 minutes they are eating.

nothing about these kids says "I pick at my food", lol and my niece goes toe to toe with her cousins.

now of course as they got bigger it became easier. this was from my august trip and I didn't cook once but again, can you imagine the snacks they go through at the end of a park day?? we stopped at walmart and loaded up and it was absolutely great having soda, water, ice cream, chips right there.

I wouldn't call it "work" from home, I call it making my life as easy as humanely possible.

Again it's not an "either/or" situation. two things can be true at the same time. Disney gets a repeat customer with disposable income and I get a break on the cost of the room. win/win

 

[MissingDisney]

Everything else has gotten so expensive around it, the savings on admission looks worse and worse every year.

This. A few years ago Undercover Tourist had an amazing limited time offer on tickets. Still high on the dust at the time, we bought several trips worth of tickets for our family to cover years to come, locking in a phenomenal price on tickets with no expiration. (We have gone at least once, sometimes more, a year, harder now that the kids are older). But $20 just so our family can drink soda with a meal if we choose? Really? We can eat an entire MEAL at Steak n Shake for that. I know it’s not an absolute comparison and we can eat elsewhere and ... and... and...

 

[HauntedPirate]

Heh... Just saw this. No, no, Corless doesn't steal material... *checks title of this thread*

Also - Prices on popcorn are creeping up. My wife and I were just commenting to each other last week how popcorn prices at DLP were outrageous, 6.49 Euros for a box, or roughly about $8 USD. And it's not even Orville Reddenbacher anymore.

 

[Brad Bishop]

I'm going to be the "business guy" and say: It literally doesn't matter what it cost them but, instead, what you, or the vast majority of visitors, are willing to pay at WDW.

Don't like the prices? Don't buy the drink. If enough people did this then they'd be forced to lower their drink prices. Unfortunately, people will "just pay it".

Not knocking your or trying to come down on you. Just saying this all in very general terms.

There's the other side of this, too, which I think most people miss:

They'd charge more but they really can't. Think about it this way: If WDW charge $1000 for a ticket to the MK do you think they'd want to do that? Of course they would. The problem is that the crowds wouldn't be profitable enough for that to work. I think it's currently $125 to get into the MK and that's about the mark where it's profitable and before they start losing business.

The market works on both sides.

Thank you market!

 

[Astro_Digital]

People you got to do what I did, stop going.
If Disney wants to run the business let them drop the prices. "Of course this is not going to happen and people will go, maybe not me but WDW does not care about a few people not going"

$125 to get in, if you eat in the parks about $80 a day in food, and about now for snacks per person.
Family of four about $1000 a day, not including rooms.

Salary does not go up "at least mine" ..... Disney keeps raising prices but people just keep going.

 

[BoarderPhreak]

I didn't read all 25 pages... But in case anyone missed this debauchery...

Dole Whip prices went up $.50 as well!

 

[Horizons '83]

People you got to do what I did, stop going.
If Disney wants to run the business let them drop the prices. "Of course this is not going to happen and people will go, maybe not me but WDW does not care about a few people not going"

$125 to get in, if you eat in the parks about $80 a day in food, and about now for snacks per person.
Family of four about $1000 a day, not including rooms.

Salary does not go up "at least mine" ..... Disney keeps raising prices but people just keep going.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Take it easy kid. You can spout off your opinion all you want. Maybe start a thread that says, "Disney prices, are they high enough?" and go on and on about how you paid $12.50 for a beer at AT&T stadium one time. You can also toss out your little Econ 100 level platitudes. You can bring the usual crew with you, and the rest of us can be left to discuss what is happening at WDW.

...I doubt I’ve ever loved a human more than right now

 

[DisneyDaver]

The next recession will show how bad an approach that is.

Maybe. Maybe not. I think it's uncertain as to whether the current pricing model will prove to be a bad approach or not. WDW can always make big profit now while the economy is good (and demand is high) and then reduce prices in the event of lower demand during a recession. The typical WDW customer most likely won't hold the current every rising pricing period against WDW ... the typical customer will price a trip whether now or during a recession and decide if the price makes sense.

 

[eddie104]

You are 100% right about what is driving the price increases (it's not wage increases)... but, so what. If increased prices means more profits, then why not increase prices. We are talking about a luxury item here in a WDW vacation. A number of years ago, I decided to spend more of my Orlando vacation dollars at Universal instead of WDW because I decided I got more value as an adult at Universal (for many of the reasons people complain about WDW on these boards). But now that I have young kids, I am back to spending all my Orlando vacation dollars at WDW because for my family's enjoyment, WDW now has more value than Universal. I'm all for WDW, Universal and other entertainment options setting their prices at any level, and then I get to decide where to spend my money based on where I see value.

At some point, prices at WDW will rise to the point where profits look like they may fall and then the increases will stop. As much as I wish WDW were cheaper, I recognize it's Disney's product so Disney can price the product however Disney think is best for Disney. And that is how it should be. If people keep buying the product, then I don't blame Disney for increasing prices (or adding uncharges for services, events, hours, benefits which the market will bear).

Your preaching to the choir on this board when it comes to price increases and to be honest some people seem to forget everybody going to Disney is not in their position and can afford more.

 

[Mander]

I've been very easy on Disney in the past but I'm starting to feel burned on these increases.

We've had our trip at the end of the month booked since January- now just this week I read that they increased some Food & Wine prices mid-festival? All these little prices increases are just a lot. Especially the ones that feel like a money grab, like resort parking. We're obviously still going for our upcoming trip but after talking we have decided not to book the bounce back trip we were planning to. I honestly didn't think there would be a day when I didn't feel like booking a trip. Maybe that will change (it probably will) but I'm just so burned out on the company's current choices.

We've got some ideas for where to go instead but at the moment a beach vacation with our dogs is the lead contender.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Maybe. Maybe not. I think it's uncertain as to whether the current pricing model will prove to be a bad approach or not. WDW can always make big profit now while the economy is good (and demand is high) and then reduce prices in the event of lower demand during a recession. The typical WDW customer most likely won't hold the current every rising pricing period against WDW ... the typical customer will price a trip whether now or during a recession and decide if the price makes sense.

My premise is that during the last recession...the regular prices were still low enough that they could do steep discounts to snare people but not have the street complain too much.

I think that bridge has been crossed...if people lock off travel and have no money (perceived money)...it’s hard to get the current prices that low and get away with it.

Time will tell.

They can’t drop 25% In attendance for 3 years and get away with it. And that bubble yum bubble is starting to stretch.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I've been very easy on Disney in the past but I'm starting to feel burned on these increases.

We've had our trip at the end of the month booked since January- now just this week I read that they increased some Food & Wine prices mid-festival? All these little prices increases are just a lot. Especially the ones that feel like a money grab, like resort parking. We're obviously still going for our upcoming trip but after talking we have decided not to book the bounce back trip we were planning to. I honestly didn't think there would be a day when I didn't feel like booking a trip. Maybe that will change (it probably will) but I'm just so burned out on the company's current choices.

We've got some ideas for where to go instead but at the moment a beach vacation with our dogs is the lead contender.

You should share this via guest communications...in order to stop it, we have to create a “pattern”...it’s the only language they speak

 

[Mander]

You should share this via guest communications...in order to stop it, we have to create a “pattern”...it’s the only language they speak

I will definitely do that.