ABQ
Well-Known Member
Cool. As I assume it's not dissimilar to that the OP posted.
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Fort Wilderness DVC Resort plans for former River Country land
- Thread starter ptaylor
- Start date
CDavid
Well-Known Member
Well, if they're smart enough to not mess with the Polynesian water feature, I'm sure they wouldn't touch Pioneer Hall.
Oh, wait...never mind...
Scuttle
Well-Known Member
Speaking of, what's the latest on the poly water feature? Anyone got any info at all?Well, if they're smart enough to not mess with the Polynesian water feature, I'm sure they wouldn't touch Pioneer Hall.
Oh, wait...never mind...
alissafalco
Well-Known Member
That, and there is absolutely no food beverage station of their own at GFV.
Thanks @71jason for a great post of what truly is going on.
So ... two anecdotes from last night that I think illustrate exactly what's wrong with WDW these days.
First, due to Three Kings Day/Marathon Week/northerners not being able to fly (see previous post), yesterday was a very busy day at MK--easily equivalent to Summer. However, Casey's went down for refurb as scheduled. Did TDO offset this by reopening Tommorowland Terrace or Tortuga Tavern? Of course not. Lines were out the door at Pecos Bill and Cosmic Rays. Even worse, people were walking out of Rays and sitting on the walkway with trays of food, because there just wasn't seating. It's bad enough that TDO underestimated the crowds when other experts, like, say Touring Plans, anticipated them, but it's even worse they don't have a Plan B to provide guests food when things like this happen.
Second, as most know, 130 DVC rooms just opened up next to the Grand Floridian--with absolutely no food or beverage service of their own, not even a convenience shop. However, upper management is still trying to run the Grand based on the past 5 years (when there was no DVC, natch). Gasparilla has been slammed every week, selling out of food like chips (Lays, Doritos, etc.) every night for over a week. Upper management can't figure out that perhaps this isn't an anomaly and that they should order more food. The table service restaurants and bars have been slammed, too--so of course, upper management wanted them to cut staffing this week to meet historical levels. They would rather lose sales and alienate guests than risk paying an extra server for a night.
This isn't a case of "But Disney exists to make money...". They are LOSING money while providing poor customer service. It just shows that the MBAs running the show in TDO and Burbank don't "get" theme parks. They don't understand how they run, when they get busy (Friday the 13th?), why they get busy, what guests expect when they visit. Noses buried in a spreadsheet rather than walking through the parks.
71jason, Tuesday at 9:42 AMReport
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dgp602
Well-Known Member
If you look closely at the bottom photo, it looks like part of this project overlays the current cabins at Fort Wilderness??An interesting new Twitter account called amusementleaks has just posted this image from late 2011 of plans for the DVC resort at the former River Country location at Fort Wilderness.
I'm all for improvements, but man, when is enough, enough? DVC is a money maker, but at what cost? The whole "character" of that area changes with a project this large. Isn't that area supposed to be themed as undeveloped and quiet? Not anymore!!
PhilharMagician
Well-Known Member
The plans in the first post of this thread show Pioneer hall being safe. I remember the ones (multiple DWG's) that were circulating a few years ago showed the new construction overlapping the Northwest corner of Pioneer hall by about 4 meters. I thought I had copied the DWG's, but I cannot find them.
I will have to keep looking. I do however have the proposed new stable plans.
Tonka's Skipper
Well-Known Member
The enlargement of the site plan does not show any change to the HDDR. It does put the parking lot close to the HDDR, which would help with parking for the show. However the parking lot is very close to the camping/cabin loops.
There has always been a golf cart parking issue at FW and the plans show a lot of additional cart parking.
The 2010 site plans showed the whole resort being closer/west to WL and had a over the water feature like they are doing the Poly.
I do believe these plans are intentionally leaked just to get unscientific polls for good or bad.
Personally I prefer the site closer to the WL. Another bit of site plans on another forum, has a train station at the WL. I would love to see the narrow gauge steam railroad returned to FW and to the new resort and WL.
AKK
There has always been a golf cart parking issue at FW and the plans show a lot of additional cart parking.
The 2010 site plans showed the whole resort being closer/west to WL and had a over the water feature like they are doing the Poly.
I do believe these plans are intentionally leaked just to get unscientific polls for good or bad.
Personally I prefer the site closer to the WL. Another bit of site plans on another forum, has a train station at the WL. I would love to see the narrow gauge steam railroad returned to FW and to the new resort and WL.
AKK
bgraham34
Well-Known Member
This has been Disney's problems for years now. They would rather pick up pennies off the ground while Dollar bills fly over their heads. I spend less and less each year because Disney feels the need to cut corners and make everything generic.
thehowiet
Wilson King of Prussia
Exactly. My wife and I usually come up with a loose predetermined souvenir budget before we head to WDW. The past few trips we've come in WAY under budget, not because we didn't want to buy things and spend money but because we just couldn't find anything we felt was worth buying.
My parents and I have so much stuff from the 80s and very early 90s and hardly anything from all of our trips over the past three or four years. It's to the point now that if I picked any one year between 1982 and 1990 that the amount of souvenirs we bought back in any given year is practically double what we've brought back across all of our trips between 2010 and 2013. That's not even a slight exaggeration. My parents and one of my neighbors have also made similar comments/observations.
disneydudette
Well-Known Member
Considering FW already offers cabins equipped with full kitchens, and the V@WL are not too far away... why not take this "opportunity" to create a Moderate/Deluxe level resort of Family-like Suites?
While I am not a big fan of the AoA suite layouts... I do like/prefer USO's Cabana Bay Resort design. Perhaps Disney could offer even more flexibility by designing both King (Sleep 5 with pullout couch and chair) and 2-Queen (sleep 6 with pull out couch) suites.
While I am not a big fan of the AoA suite layouts... I do like/prefer USO's Cabana Bay Resort design. Perhaps Disney could offer even more flexibility by designing both King (Sleep 5 with pullout couch and chair) and 2-Queen (sleep 6 with pull out couch) suites.
vonpluto
Well-Known Member
The plans in the first post of this thread show Pioneer hall being safe. I remember the ones (multiple DWG's) that were circulating a few years ago showed the new construction overlapping the Northwest corner of Pioneer hall by about 4 meters. I thought I had copied the DWG's, but I cannot find them.
Do you mean these plans?
Attachments
GhettoJetta5
Member
I have one probably odd concern... If this were to happen, that would be a lot of parking in the back of Fort Wilderness which would create a ton of extra traffic in the campground, unless guests entered through the Lodge entrance, but with the Lodge already having a DVC that could be odd... Just a thought... As someone who stays at Fort Wilderness often, I like that traffic isn't bad (other than maybe carts) with so many biking\jogging\etc.
PhilharMagician
Well-Known Member
That was leaked around October 2010 about a year before the ones in the first post in this thread. That drawing leaked with the stable one the I posted. The one that showed the interference was attached to a permit filed with the Southern Florida Water Management District and I cannot find it. I can tell you the memory is a terrible thing to loose and I hope I am not completely loosing it.
One good thing is that the latest drawings from 2011 show the DVC moving farther West and missing Pioneer Hall completely
bgraham34
Well-Known Member
My trip last year was the first time we never bought a souvenir. Could not find anything we liked.
Belowthesurface
Well-Known Member
These plans will go nicely with the visual intrusions of FW. The new Four Seasons Resort--complete with red lights, so planes don't hit it-- looms over the parking lot and entrance of FW. Very wilderness-esque.
bethymouse
Well-Known Member
Why not just build another water park there?
MinnieM123
Premium Member
Back in the 80s and 90s, I'd have difficulty deciding what to buy, because there were so many unique and attractive choices in the gift shops. I'd have a budget for souvenirs, and it was just never enough!
For at least the past 5 years or so, there's hardly been anything I wanted to buy. Seems to me that Disney is overlooking a revenue source by not upgrading the merchandise in their shops. By upgrading, I don't necessarily mean more expensive, but just more creatively themed, distinctive products in a range of prices, like they used to have.
Unplugged
Well-Known Member
A quick reply to a few things I've seen in this thread (I'm not going to overload this with each person) and a few new thoughts.
- Quick note on the naming reference, it's "Wilderness Lodge" & "The Villas at Wilderness Lodge" (often referenced as WLV), not "Fort Wilderness Lodge". No big deal, but it can get confusing when we start talking about the actual "Fort Wilderness".
- The problems regarding GF's snack bar & shop were mentioned and references to other resorts with separate shops for DVC were noted. I wanted to point out from an operational point that WLV does NOT have it's own separate snack bar or shop and the resort operates very well (disclaimer...it's my DVC home resort). I do not know the total room count comparison between GF/WL and GFV/VWL, but assume there is some operational changes to all facilities at GF that will take some tweaking to get inventory right or even the next big remodel to enlarge the facilities. I'm sure it will work out when you have that much $$$ at the resort and in points raising a fuss about quality & service.
- IMHO, while we don't stay at the Fort Wilderness campgrounds (we aren't the camping type), I think there is a LOT of value in the maintaining the natural experience. We've been there for the campfire shows, Hoop-dee-doo, and just to hang out. It's a great place and would be a terrible environmental/thematic loss to change it by adding DVC. While I find DVC a great thing, it should NOT impact FW. If DVC were perhaps simply dedicated RV spaces or cabins through DVC points for those that are long stay regulars, that would make far more sense, but I don't think the financial model would meet the margins they want.
- IMHO - Looking at the WL grounds from Google Earth and having been there for years, it makes more sense to add an additional WLV building there, perhaps on the East side (towards the campgrounds on the East side of the WL pier) and add a small snack stop there. That would maintain both resort themes, increase DVC room count around the lakes, and not impact the camping.