Former VP Details Original Star Wars Land Plans

[Imagineer45]

Monsters still pops up. Cars ride seems dead.

I am most disappointed we never got a Monsters Inc Door roller coaster. They could have even had an enormous showbuilding in plain sight because of the factory facade. Honestly, a Monstropolis land at DHS would be fantastic. In addition to the roller coaster, add Ride and Go Seek from Tokyo, relocate Laugh Floor from MK, and throw in a Harryhausen's restaurant. As much as I like Cars Land and RSR, I think it should remain unique to DCA.

 

[marni1971]

I am most disappointed we never got a Monsters Inc Door roller coaster. They could have even had an enormous showbuilding in plain sight because of the factory facade. Honestly, a Monstropolis land at DHS would be fantastic. In addition to the roller coaster, add Ride and Go Seek from Tokyo, relocate Laugh Floor from MK, and throw in a Harryhausen's restaurant. As much as I like Cars Land and RSR, I think it should remain unique to DCA.

There was a reason why DHS got a copy of the Emeryville Pixar arch...

 

[doctornick]

To be honest I thought we were done with this after how thrilled everyone was with ROTR.

My guess is that most people are at least okay-ish with the land but that some people are all too eager to use the land as a proxy for their complaints about the sequel trilogy/state of Star Wars in general/Kathleen Kennedy.

That's not to say there aren't things to criticize with the land, but that would be true with any new development (especially with having significant budget cuts of things that were promised/promoted).

 

[doctornick]

I haven't seen Galaxy's Edge so I really can't speak to its quality. That said, conceptually, I think Tatooine would've made sense.

Yes, it is a drab, desert planet but they could've pulled it off. There is plenty about the planet and Mos Eisley that was not depicted in the films that could've been elaborated upon or invented.

I agree that Tatooine is a drab design (and would have particularly seemed boring if it was built right next to DL's Frontierland). That said, I think that the shots of Mos Espa in TPM do some some interesting architectural features including some stuff that could be used to hide show buildings....

We never really saw enough of Mos Eisley to see if the rest of that city is similar to Mos Espa, but it wouldn't be a big stretch to just use the same type of features.

Of course, that wouldn't really help with a lack of water or greenery. I think any Tatooine area would benefit from being smaller just to limit those issues. So IMHO it works better as part of a greater Star Wars development. Or you have to come up with some storyline of there being an an oasis on the edge of the city or something to be able to add them.

 

[The_Jobu]

Thanks KK

take a break, you earned it.

 

[tirian]

Read through this, then go back through my history and see if this doesn't line up 100% with what I said, even down to the original location of the cantina. And do you know why people normally can't tell this sort of thing unless it's anonymous? Because you'll be blacklisted in the entertainment industry, and you run the risk of forgetting an NDA in small print somewhere on an initialed paper from 15 years ago.

The most frustrating part about the Pixie Duster (PD) response is that the original plans were one of the worst-kept secrets regardless of NDAs. Everyone in Celebration and the Studios, from high-level execs to CP custodians, knew about the Monsters, Inc. coaster and the original location for SW. These were common knowledge, along with the facts that (1) the land was supposed to be OT, (2) the land was supposed to be Tatooine, and (3) the land can still be easily reskinned if desired. (Point #3 costs money and may never happen.)

At least it’s nice to see Dan C’s official confirmation for rumors you, @marni1971, @Magic Feather, Lee, and I had said for years.

 

[tirian]

What happened to the part of the story that The Force Awakens made two billion dollars and that convinced Iger to go with the new trilogy (assuming the rest of the movies would continue to be that big)?

Also, Tatooine, as it appeared in the original trilogy is boring: Cantina, run down space port, and isolated moisture farming homes. You know if they went with that, it'd be a book-report Millennium Falcon ride of how we escaped the planet.... which we return to when the ride is over?

What happened to the part of the story where DHS was forced to accept a SWL layout that fit into DL?


Reporting:

They came back the next day and acted just as excited as they were two years earlier. I was really impressed by their optimism. And they dug into it, and that’s what you see today. ​

Spin:

Sadly, many Star Wars fans haven’t shared Imagineering’s optimism. ​

That part is a mess anyway. TFA capitalized on people’s excitement but was basically a remake of Episode IV, then the next two paled in comparison and toy sales plummeted and...

...and even that story depends on who’s telling the tale, from PDs to industry insiders to toy companies.

Easiest lesson: don’t base extremely expensive, new attractions on new content until you know it’s stood the test of time. Exhibit A: POTC with Jack Sparrow is now more outdated than it would’ve been if they’d simply left the ride alone and kept the Sparrow show in the courtyard for a few years. Exhibit B: Honey, I Shrunk the Audience was still playing in 2007.

 

[tirian]

Having actually been to Space Adventure Land (Galaxy's Edge to the rest of you) I can now speak to it.

Did it look cool? Yeah pretty cool. I wasn't in awe of it, but it had nice detail.
The first thing that I noticed was missing was The Big Reveal when you walk into the land.
You go through the tunnel and there is nothing that just pops up and makes you say "Wow!" It just rocks and then some buildings.
So Disney missed that opportunity.

Immersive? Barely. The only thing really Star Wars about it was seeing Chewie walking around, and Rey and maybe two First Order Troopers with Kylo Ren. No droids, no aliens no real immersion. So all it has going for it is that it looked good.

Rides:
It was neat going into the Millenium Falcon, but if you can't go up the ramp then what's the point?
Smuggler's Run was okay. It was what many said it was...a scaled down version of Star Tours.
They had too much going on on the screen for you to really enjoy it.
And after doing a good bit of damage to the Falcon I was looking for the sparks and smoke as we walked out of the cockpit.
Alas...nothing. So there goes that immersion.
I also don't know of anyone who did well and went into Baatu and was honored as a hero or congratulated. So remove that immersion.

Rise of the Resistance was very cool.
I will say that was a nicely done ride.
Since I grew up with the original Star Wars I was a bit awestruck. I won't spoil anything for anyone, but it was a very good story and a solid ride. Finally something felt like Star Wars.

Food:
Terrible. We tried basically everything and ....not good.
Blue milk was okay, much better than Green Milk. That tasted horrible.
Ronto Wraps. Nope
Some beverages were pretty good in the Oga's Cantina, but the food overall was disappointing.

I didn't do the light saber building because I just couldn't justify spending $200 for a light saber.
I did get to see other light sabers that others had built and they looked good and had some weight to them.
My biggest problem is that the "secret place" where you go to get your light sabers built....had a line out front of it.
And they handed out a card to the people to show them their choice of parts.
So that secret order storyline...that was scrapped.

I even asked one CM, "I just saw the First Order troopers right around the corner (I literally did). Aren't you afraid they will discover the secret place." He was a bit surprised that I asked that, and didn't give me a great answer. I don't even remember much of what he said, that's how unconvincing it was.

Was it a nice place to visit? Yes
Did it look neat? Yes
Were the details by the Imagineers excellent? Yes
Was it Star Wars? Not really

Would I go again? Probably, but I won't stay long because once you've done it...you've done it.
Unless of course they raise the game on the place.

One of the CMs broke character (which wasn't much of a stretch) and talked to me a bit.
He told me that they were supposed to have droids and aliens and scripted scenes all day long, but Bob Chapek axed all of that.

Very disappointing to hear that.

Now, had they made that Tatooine and actual Star Wars based.....I may have never left.
Drinks at the Mos Eisley Cantina
Table service dinner in Jabba's palace with a huge, animatronic Jabba and a frozen Han Solo on the wall.
Pod Racing ride
Jawas running around trying to trade with you.

etc., etc.

You would have never got me out of there.
But thank you again Kathleen Kennedy. You have destroyed Star Wars because you don't know what you are doing.

Careful, don’t give your own opinion. I did that after visiting SWGE in California, and was promptly pestered for not loving it the way the people who’d never been to Disneyland thought I should.

Long-time SW fans aren’t as important as people who suddenly decided they liked it because Disney bought Lucasfilm. Didn’t you know that? If you don’t think the new Disney movies are as good as the originals, it’s because you’re an old fogey who’s part of the problem. But you’re allowed to hate the prequels because those were made before Disney bought SW.

 

[marni1971]

What we got is much, much better than what could've been.

That’s a given. Certainly for the version one reskin of the echo area. Version two probably too.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

That’s a given. Certainly for the version one reskin of the echo area. Version two probably too.

In those versions, do you know what the new attraction would have been?

 

[UNCgolf]

My guess is that most people are at least okay-ish with the land but that some people are all too eager to use the land as a proxy for their complaints about the sequel trilogy/state of Star Wars in general/Kathleen Kennedy.

That's not to say there aren't things to criticize with the land, but that would be true with any new development (especially with having significant budget cuts of things that were promised/promoted).

I think this basically nails it. I don't like the sequel trilogy at all and still find it incredibly tiresome to listen to the same complaints over and over (especially since my reasons for disliking it are usually not remotely connected to the nonsense they're often peddling).

Batuu is fine. I think they could have made some better decisions and I wasn't blown away by it, but it's a cool location and really does feel like you've left DHS and gone to another place. It would definitely be improved if they hadn't cut so much of the entertainment etc. but that's not on the designers. Toy Story Land is next door and is vastly inferior in every way, so why so much focus on Galaxy's Edge?

 

[Ismael Flores]

The original plan sounds great... but if you read the part about being near Star Tours, I imagine the original concept would not have been a full, separate, immersive land (kind of like the original Imagineering plan for Harry Potter was a mini land in MK) ...

I think the Batuu we got is most likely a richer, more immersive land than originally planned. They can sort out (re-theme) time lines in the future.

Agree and can you imagine Tatooine in the hot summer months in Florida? what do they do about the landscaping and not destroy the setting of the desert planet

 

[flynnibus]

I get the point about 'more in front of us than behind us...' - but I think when they excluded all OT stuff they missed the mark.

Look at Star Tours... people don't complain the cabins aren't from the original films.. but there is a blend of new content and old.

Still waiting to see it all myself so I've been more in the 'wait and see...' before picking a side.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

That part is a mess anyway. TFA capitalized on people’s excitement but was basically a remake of Episode IV, then the next two paled in comparison and toy sales plummeted and...

...and even that story depends on who’s telling the tale, from PDs to industry insiders to toy companies.

Easiest lesson: don’t base extremely expensive, new attractions on new content until you know it’s stood the test of time. Exhibit A: POTC with Jack Sparrow is now more outdated than it would’ve been if they’d simply left the ride alone and kept the Sparrow show in the courtyard for a few years. Exhibit B: Honey, I Shrunk the Audience was still playing in 2007.

People line up for 2 hours to go on the Snow White coaster.

Iger logic tells us that building it would never have been a good idea. What does that say about his understanding of "old" IP and the parks?

 

[FutureCEO]

Is there any rumors about more rides? Or Star Tours moving into the land or being demolished?

 

[marni1971]

In those versions, do you know what the new attraction would have been?

The Version one I know of had nothing new. Reskin of the echo area for an indoor academy and the existing cafe became the Cantina. Version two elaborated on this and replaced Indy with the attraction(s:

 

[marni1971]

Is there any rumors about more rides? Or Star Tours moving into the land or being demolished?

Not yet, no and no.

And that was before the current climate.

 

[Magic Feather]

There was a reason why DHS got a copy of the Emeryville Pixar arch...

Ah yes, the PIXAR area that could have been. That said, I'll be honest to saying that I preferred the placemaking of TSL. While it could definitely aim to do better on content, the original proposal (IMO) continued the old DHS aesthetic that relied a bit too much on urban environments.

@Magic Feather Are able to share any details on this? I saw you mention on the IU forums that you know some info about this proposal.
Of course, I understand if you can't say.

I'm really busy with work (pandemic response challenges at work) ; but, I just had a friend email me with questions about this article. I'll eventually try to put things into perspective; but, take my word on the following:

- this article is based on the very early days after the Lucasfilm purchase when it was literally the wild west of Imaginering and Parks all trying to think up what they could do with the property.
- this DHS concept would've been value based concepts and was only appealing to the TDO side of the house.
- it would've been lesser than the Tomorrowland reskin for Disneyland that was shot down for not being ambitious enough with the hodge-podge greatest hits approach (which the value DHS approach would've sort of mirrored without the budget)
- The use of the sequel trilogy was something that Iger and Lucasfilm were both behind and happened when TFA succeeded
- Scott coming back to oversee and apply the Potter approach to a unified land (planet) cemented the use of it versus a trip around the galaxy.

What we got is much, much better than what could've been.

I feel like @JediMasterMatt 's recap is probably one of the best that you will get. The original DHS proposal (all of the following is my opinion, and should be treated as such) was bad. To me it came across as if the design principles behind Star Tours and the original Midway Mania threw up all over Echo Lake. I have always found Echo Lake to be near integral to the place making of Hollywood Studios, showing how nature still encroaches on the urban environment, but we tame it to meet our needs. I personally am difficult to get on board with any proposal that gets rid of the lake. Any proposal that uses the Indy Plot, whether for a major attraction or land, should have a berm near where the entrance to the show is now, and the "ground level" should sit where the stage floor for the show is. But, I digress, this is about the Star Wars proposal that mostly consisted of a series of permanent overlays and reworks of existing facilities that really only built upon what Disney knew people would go for through pre-existing brand activations (think Cantina or Jedi Training). Eventually this proposal evolved to partially take over the Indy plot for a new attraction, but, even if they plopped Rise in the middle of Indy and did the rest of the existing proposal, I would have a very hard time giving it my personal stamp of approval.
Also, the DL proposal was slick, but still suffered from older design principles, and would have been seen as mildly obsolete post-Potter. For an idea of what that would look like, look at how they are treating the Marvel property in Hong Kong. Imagine if that was Star Wars and in Disneyland.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

The Version one I know of had nothing new. Reskin of the echo area for an indoor academy and the existing cafe became the Cantina. Version two elaborated on this and replaced Indy with the attraction(s:

So basically.... new Fantasyland? Some fancy rocks to look at, “enchanted tales with Yoda” and maybe an attraction but nothing on the level of Rise?

 

[Magic Feather]

So basically.... new Fantasyland? Some fancy rocks to look at, “enchanted tales with Yoda” and maybe an attraction but nothing on the level of Rise?

Even the fancy rocks weren't that fancy. Not even close to what we got with Batuu, Pandora, Cars, or even NFL.