Fastpass 3

[Max Smart]

I had lengthy talks with operations management last year regarding Fastpass Plus - the main complaint it resolved was people not understanding why they could only have one (classic) fastpass at a time. I saw families who didn't realize that they needed to make reservations for rides weeks out, doomed to wait in hour-long lines to see the popular attractions (while we rode them multiple times, because we booked fastpasses long ago). Some people apparently like the new system, while many like myself preferred the old system - where you would check into a line, then go shop/eat/visit unpopular rides until your wait was up.

Just kicking around an idea - what if they had a hybrid, where you could make fastpasses in advance, or you could do an old-school fastpass check-in if you don't have appointment (Fastpass+) fastpasses set?

I think I would opt out of scheduled fastpasses in favor of this.

 

[Launchpad McQuack]

Maybe I'm just not understanding this correctly, so forgive me if I am oversimplifying it, but would the hybrid really be any different than what they have now? If you don't book FP+ beforehand, you can still go to the kiosk and schedule a FP. I'm not really seeing the advantage of choosing to do it in the park if other people are still booking them weeks out.

Would this theoretically just limit the number for FP+ available on the app, and hold more in an in park pool for same-day guests? I guess I could see it working that way. Say, for example, there are 100 FP available for Space Mountain, and 50 were available online and 50 had to be picked up in-park at the kiosk, or even 40 available at 60 days (on-site), 30 at 30 days (open up to off-site as well, but on-site guests can still log in and take them), and 30 in-park.

Maybe I'm overthinking it now. Then again, I actually like FP+ and MDE because planning and getting excited months and months out is part of the fun.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Maybe I'm overthinking it now. Then again, I actually like FP+ and MDE because planning and getting excited months and months out is part of the fun.

Which, really, is the core of the disconnect between this community and the average guest. Like you, the average guest generally enjoys the process of planning their WDW vacation. The MDX process is not a burden to them, it's a privilege. Conversely, the superfans of WDW Magic are much more likely to be locals, passholders, Cast Members, DVC members, and other frequent visitors. Those folks typically prefer a more spur-of-the-moment WDW experience, so the planning doesn't have the same magic for them.

 

[Max Smart]

The way it worked before was that FastPass would essentially save your place in line - allowing you to do other things (potentially for $$$, like shopping) instead of being bored in the queue. People didn't understand why you couldn't have more than one (because you can't be waiting in two lines at once!), so they made Fastpass+, which is an appointment instead of a place-holder. If you show up at the park in the morning without a fast-pass, it might tell you that you can ride Dwarves Mine at 7:30pm (while the wait is only 60 minutes), or maybe not at all.

If you are interested, I can outline the dozen or so problems with this system from fairness, efficiency, comfort, and profitability standpoint. The quick version is that, some of us preferred to arrive at the ride, check in, and do other stuff in that area of the park while waiting our turn on the popular ride, instead of following a schedule of appointments.

 

[Launchpad McQuack]

I remember the process of how the old system works, but I guess I still don't fully grasp your "hybrid" solution or how me scheduling a 10:30 FP and waiting my turn to ride Space Mountain is different than getting to the park, printing a FP that says 10:30 on it, and waiting to ride it.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

The way it worked before was that FastPass would essentially save your place in line - allowing you to do other things (potentially for $$$, like shopping) instead of being bored in the queue.

That's never how it worked. Think about it... there were many days when you might get to Toy Story Mania at 10:00 AM and get a Fastpass return time that was 7:00 PM or later. If the Fastpass was "saving your place in line," that would imply that the standby wait was nine hours. That's obviously not the case. Rather than saving your place in line, the "old" Fastpass system deposited a set number of tickets in each window, regardless of what the standby time was. That's exactly the same way the new system works. The new system already IS the "hybrid" system you described simply because you misunderstand how the old system worked in the first place. The only difference is that you can plan ahead, pick your time (subject to window availability), and you don't have to physically retrieve a paper ticket.

If you are interested, I can outline the dozen or so problems with this system from fairness, efficiency, comfort, and profitability standpoint. The quick version is that, some of us preferred to arrive at the ride, check in, and do other stuff in that area of the park while waiting our turn on the popular ride, instead of following a schedule of appointments.

You still have that option.

 

[marni1971]

I'd say the average guest doesn't know you need a Fastpass. Or what one is. Or how to get one.

 

[Max Smart]

You don't really still have the option - if I show up 9am without a fastpass, it says 60 minute wait, and I go to apply for a FastPass+, it might assign me a 7:00pm time, or tell me that Fastpasses on that ride are all used up, sorry. With a hybrid system, I (having no FastPass+ reservations that day) could get a traditional FastPass by touching my band to the post at the ride, which would allow me to get on the ride at 10am.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

You don't really still have the option - if I show up 9am without a fastpass, it says 60 minute wait, and I go to apply for a FastPass+, it might assign me a 7:00pm time...

That's not how it works. It doesn't assign you a time. You pick the time, subject to availability.

With a hybrid system, I (having no FastPass+ reservations that day) could get a traditional FastPass by touching my band to the post at the ride, which would allow me to get on the ride at 10am.

That's not how the traditional FastPass worked, either. There was NEVER a system that would assign you a 10am Fastpass just for showing up at 9am with a 60 minute wait. Never ever.

You''re building a "hybrid" system based on an incorrect understanding of the old system and an incorrect understanding of the current system.

 

[Max Smart]

That's never how it worked. Think about it... there were many days when you might get to Toy Story Mania at 10:00 AM and get a Fastpass return time that was 7:00 PM or later. If the Fastpass was "saving your place in line," that would imply that the standby wait was nine hours.

I recall a few years ago that it would have a separate time for FastPass which was approximately the time you would have to wait - so if you show up 10am and the queue is 3 hours, it would have a FastPass time of 1pm (or 1:15, it seemed like there was a slight penalty for fastpass, but it was approximately the wait time).

This was good for rationing, because you had to decide whether you wanted to tie up your FastPass for 3 hours to get on this ride, or use it for other rides instead.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

I recall a few years ago that it would have a separate time for FastPass which was approximately the time you would have to wait - so if you show up 10am and the queue is 3 hours, it would have a FastPass time of 1pm (or 1:15, it seemed like there was a slight penalty for fastpass, but it was approximately the wait time).

This was good for rationing, because you had to decide whether you wanted to tie up your FastPass for 3 hours to get on this ride, or use it for other rides instead.

That's absolutely incorrect. It just is. Wait time never had anything to do with the FastPass return window. The only thing that determined return window was how many people had already gotten Fastpasses that day.

 

[DisneyChik17]

I'd say the average guest doesn't know you need a Fastpass. Or what one is. Or how to get one.

Or how to read the nifty flyer that perfectly explains it with pictures and everything.

 

[celluloid]

Or how to read the nifty flyer that perfectly explains it with pictures and everything.

Yes but that is the disconnect. They could communicate it all they want and the best way possible, but it does not mean that is the kind of vacation people want. The need of a business is to be in touch with what consumers want, this entire concept lacked a lot of this. The majority of elements only benefited the instant gratification of profit.

 

[marni1971]

Or how to read the nifty flyer that perfectly explains it with pictures and everything.

Maybe they don't know about a flyer. Maybe they've never been to Orlando.

Maybe when they activate their 14 day for 7 tourist hoppers they find out about Fastpass and by then it's too late for a lot of attractions.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Yes but that is the disconnect. They could communicate it all they want and the best way possible, but it does not mean that is the kind of vacation people want. The need of a business is to be in touch with what consumers want, this entire concept lacked a lot of this.

Except that the vast majority of guests love it. Nice try though.

The majority of elements only benefited the instant gratification of profit.

How do you think "profit" happens? In order for the guests to fork over more money, Disney has to make them happy. You can't generate profit against the will of your customer. It's self-evident that increased profit means increased guest satisfaction or people would stop going.

Maybe they don't know about a flyer. Maybe they've never been to Orlando.

Maybe when they activate their 14 day for 7 tourist hoppers they find out about Fastpass and by then it's too late for a lot of attractions.

Sucks? If you wanted to go see The Force Awakens at 8:00 PM on opening day and you didn't have tickets pre-ordered, that's your own fault, not Disney's. If you order something online on December 24 and you're told it won't be delivered in time for Christmas, that's your own fault, not Amazon's.

 

[DfromATX]

I got a little magnet soon after booking our trip for July that lists dates to do everything like book dining, fast passes, etc. I'm assuming everyone gets those.

We don't usually like to go in July (due to the tour groups) and I'm wondering if they will be booking their fast passes as well. If not, it'll be interesting to see what happens. No more group leaders standing at the fast pass kiosks taking all the fast passes.

 

[Max Smart]

Not to jump into that fight, but if you aren't intimately familiar with the Disney Parks, scheduling your whole day via FastPass+ isn't really practical. As for the way the original FastPass operates, maybe I was misinformed because I went during slow times of year (so the FastPass time was the same as the queue time), and the fact they said on the Magic Express video that the system "saves your place in line". Putting that aside, there's no reason to dismiss my suggestion out of hand - what would stop it from working this way I described going forward? That is, you can FastPass with a small time penalty (75 minute FP for a 60 minute queue, for example) if you prefer not to be running around following a schedule, or if you prefer the scheduled approach, you can book 3 rides in advance and spend your day trying to be where you're supposed to be at the scheduled time.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Putting that aside, there's no reason to dismiss my suggestion out of hand - what would stop it from working this way I described going forward? That is, you can FastPass with a small time penalty (75 minute FP for a 60 minute queue, for example) if you prefer not to be running around following a schedule, or if you prefer the scheduled approach, you can book 3 rides in advance and spend your day trying to be where you're supposed to be at the scheduled time.

Fastpass has a fixed capacity that has nothing to do with the posted wait time. Any attempt to link the two is impossible. If you want a Fastpass for 75 minutes from when you book it, it's based on the ride capacity and how many Fastpasses have already distribution. It has nothing to do with posted wait times and never has.

If you've ever actually used Fastpass+, you'd know that the notion of "running around following a schedule" is false. There was far more running around when you had to go to Space Mountain to pick up a fastpass, then cross the park to Big Thunder to ride it, then walk all the way back to Tomorrowland to use your Fastpass for space. If you space your Fastpasses reasonably, they fit quite nicely in a normal around-the-wheel touring plan for the Magic Kingdom.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I'd say the average guest doesn't know you need a Fastpass. Or what one is. Or how to get one.

I've never actually met anyone that didn't know it existed, but, there have been boatloads that didn't understand how it worked, with the majority having a problem thinking that FP cost extra money. People did indeed have an advantage with the old FP system if they were able to get there for rope drop, but, that was when it was needed the least, they did get them, however, and those with small children or more elderly that couldn't get there really early were usually left out of the more classic attractions because the FP's were gone by the time they got there.

 

[marni1971]

I've never actually met anyone that didn't know it existed..

Perhaps I have an "advantage" there with knowing so many foreigner first timers.