Fast Pass, or not Past Pass? That is the question.

Which model of line-forming at Disney do you like best


  • Total voters
    78

Pepper's Ghost

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Sorry if this has been posted previously. I'm sure it has, but I couldn't find a thread about this. I know most people are used to FP now, and it's not likely going away. I'm just curious what portion of the people like FP compared to preferring the days of yore when standby lines were much shorter. Please vote, and leave your feedback too. I really am trying to understand the other side on this one.

My opinion which I believe is unpopular:
I think the FP system is what makes lines too long. I've said it several times on these boards, but my guestimation is that the priority for FP slows the standby line by 3 times... conservatively. A 20 min wait becomes a 60 min wait in standby. That's just an estimate, but it's based on standing in line for rides pre-FP, and post FP (hard to figure the effect on newer rides.) There could be other factors like increased attendance, but you stand in the same exact place without moving 3 times longer than pre-FP. I'm also basing that on the estimate that they let 20 people in from the FP line, then 10 from standby. That means for every 30 people that go in, now it's just 10 from standby hence my estimate that it slows the line by 3x.

What happened to first come, first serve? I know we're used to it now, but all it does is reward people's feeling of entitlement, and makes the "standby folk" feel snubbed, skipped, pi$$ed, etc. People are always looking to game the system, so the FP system indulges the worst human behaviors. I preferred the days where a few dishonest people faked handicaps to game the system. To me it's comparable to legalizing driving on the expressway shoulder to skip hundreds of cars.

Some people are more tech adept and able to take advantage, while others are less savvy and suffer the ills of being tech ignorant. Btw, I'm pretty tech savvy and know how it all works. I just don't like the system, mostly the part where you have to book things out 60 days, or you wait in a 2.5 hr line if you really want to ride. It's stupid and IMO Disney is picking "winners" by using this system, specifically those who are addicted to their phones. I think the next person's time is as valuable as mine. Why make people wait hours because they don't know how to use the system? Wouldn't it be better to wait in a 30 min line on average like years past, and go on whatever ride you want the entire day, than to get onto to some rides in 5 mins, and either wait in a standby for 2 hours, or never even get on a popular ride? I NEVER saw 2 hour waits pre-FP. FP is the culprit IMO.

Thoughts?
 

Queen of the WDW Screne

If you don't like it then you can leave
In the Parks
No
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This subject has been beaten to death in my opinion.
 

Queen of the WDW Screne

If you don't like it then you can leave
In the Parks
No
My bad. I saw other conversations, but really wanted to see by numbers how many people agree with each side, and hadn't seen a poll.
Admittedly I am interested in the poll but I fear people may just start arguments in the actual thread once it gets going and that's where the subject has been beaten to death lol.
 
All systems have pros and cons but I think the best answer would be raising ticket prices to decrease demand. All these FP/queueing systems do is juggle water from one overflowing bucket to the other, with the winners usually being people who have the time, experience, or money to fully take advantage of the system. If/when demand cools off, lower prices again. Unfortunately Disney wouldn't do this because they need high volumes of people going to the parks to sell hotel rooms and expensive plates of food.
 

Pepper's Ghost

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Admittedly I am interested in the poll but I fear people may just start arguments in the actual thread once it gets going and that's where the subject has been beaten to death lol.
Well, from what I've seen on this forum, ALL conversations devolve into arguments. So many passionate folks on these boards. 🤣

All systems have pros and cons but I think the best answer would be raising ticket prices to decrease demand. All these FP/queueing systems do is juggle water from one overflowing bucket to the other, with the winners usually being people who have the time, experience, or money to fully take advantage of the system. If/when demand cools off, lower prices again. Unfortunately Disney wouldn't do this because they need high volumes of people going to the parks to sell hotel rooms and expensive plates of food.
Agree with this wholeheartedly. Economics could also solve this issue.
 

PostScott

New Member
I'm gonna be completely honest but WDW would be so much better with a system like maxpass. However I do see some downsides with this. The app would most indefinitely crash with even more people at the beginning of the day logging on to grab a FP, and the app already works slow enough. I think I may be a bit selfish here but I love it at DL because I can refresh the FP page and within 5 mins, I can grab a fastpass for another e-ticket that had either no more available slots or ones for much later in the day. Unlike at DL, in WDW I noticed that almost no one gives up their fastpasses. What I want to know though is if people don't discard their FPs because they don't know how or because they just don't want to even though they'll know they'll miss their return time. I do think that FPs kill the standby wait time so, if they really want to resolve the issue then I think it would be beneficial to maybe give out less FPs on some days and observe how that changes the standby times (Ik this isn't the best experiment but I'm sure someone can take this idea and make it more polished). So until then, I'm gonna enjoy taking that extra 5 mins to refresh the FP page and hope for the best.
 

JIMINYCR

Well-Known Member
Im leaning towards Same day FP and standby. I'd rather get to a park early and arrange that first round of FP+ that day and not to have to look into the future. I'd think there would be more opportunity to get what I wanted. Those who arrive late by sleeping in or just dont use what they chose would increase my chances.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
I'm gonna be completely honest but WDW would be so much better with a system like maxpass. However I do see some downsides with this. The app would most indefinitely crash with even more people at the beginning of the day logging on to grab a FP, and the app already works slow enough. I think I may be a bit selfish here but I love it at DL because I can refresh the FP page and within 5 mins, I can grab a fastpass for another e-ticket that had either no more available slots or ones for much later in the day. Unlike at DL, in WDW I noticed that almost no one gives up their fastpasses. What I want to know though is if people don't discard their FPs because they don't know how or because they just don't want to even though they'll know they'll miss their return time. I do think that FPs kill the standby wait time so, if they really want to resolve the issue then I think it would be beneficial to maybe give out less FPs on some days and observe how that changes the standby times (Ik this isn't the best experiment but I'm sure someone can take this idea and make it more polished). So until then, I'm gonna enjoy taking that extra 5 mins to refresh the FP page and hope for the best.
The IT implementation is the problem. Maxpass could work at WDW and not crash the app if the app were built to handle the load. If WDW wanted a rock solid platform they could build/buy one. It only takes the will to do so, they have the cash but when you fire all your IT people and replace them with outsourcing it may be hard to get people to work for you that are competent.
 

bryanfze55

Well-Known Member
I don’t think bringing MaxPass to WDW would be a fix. Wait times will always be longer at WDW than Disneyland, no matter what. The two resorts have an equal number of attractions, yet all of those attractions are within walking distance at Disneyland assuming you have a Park Hopper. It spreads crowds out very well.
 

Trackmaster

Well-Known Member
Sorry if this has been posted previously. I'm sure it has, but I couldn't find a thread about this. I know most people are used to FP now, and it's not likely going away. I'm just curious what portion of the people like FP compared to preferring the days of yore when standby lines were much shorter. Please vote, and leave your feedback too. I really am trying to understand the other side on this one.

My opinion which I believe is unpopular:
I think the FP system is what makes lines too long. I've said it several times on these boards, but my guestimation is that the priority for FP slows the standby line by 3 times... conservatively. A 20 min wait becomes a 60 min wait in standby. That's just an estimate, but it's based on standing in line for rides pre-FP, and post FP (hard to figure the effect on newer rides.) There could be other factors like increased attendance, but you stand in the same exact place without moving 3 times longer than pre-FP. I'm also basing that on the estimate that they let 20 people in from the FP line, then 10 from standby. That means for every 30 people that go in, now it's just 10 from standby hence my estimate that it slows the line by 3x.

What happened to first come, first serve? I know we're used to it now, but all it does is reward people's feeling of entitlement, and makes the "standby folk" feel snubbed, skipped, pi$$ed, etc. People are always looking to game the system, so the FP system indulges the worst human behaviors. I preferred the days where a few dishonest people faked handicaps to game the system. To me it's comparable to legalizing driving on the expressway shoulder to skip hundreds of cars.

Some people are more tech adept and able to take advantage, while others are less savvy and suffer the ills of being tech ignorant. Btw, I'm pretty tech savvy and know how it all works. I just don't like the system, mostly the part where you have to book things out 60 days, or you wait in a 2.5 hr line if you really want to ride. It's stupid and IMO Disney is picking "winners" by using this system, specifically those who are addicted to their phones. I think the next person's time is as valuable as mine. Why make people wait hours because they don't know how to use the system? Wouldn't it be better to wait in a 30 min line on average like years past, and go on whatever ride you want the entire day, than to get onto to some rides in 5 mins, and either wait in a standby for 2 hours, or never even get on a popular ride? I NEVER saw 2 hour waits pre-FP. FP is the culprit IMO.

Thoughts?
I think that the FP+ is a good idea and has some solid arguments and logic behind it, but has poor execution.

The good ideas/intention:
Everybody knows the crowds are going to be big, and that lines will be unavoidable. The FP+ gives you guaranteed you production regardless of how your day goes. Yeah, people like requiring physical presence, but that's a little biased against people who can't make it for rope drop or want to come later. It also has the potential for helping with crowd disbursement as guests can pick their visits based on available FP+ line-ups. It also gives the park a chance to upsell the hotels, as you get the extra time to book -- in addition to making extra money it gives a higher priority to tourists who can't it make it to the park very often. Its a "we'll get you on once, and everything else is on you" system.

The reality:
There are just too many loopholes to exploit. I think that the fact that discarded reservations get thrown back in, and that people can re-book after three is a dangerous combination. Its great for me. I see it as a free skip the line at will system. But this makes it unfair to people who don't know the system. The FP+ is always jammed, it always steals capacity from stand-by, and for casual guests, they have no idea how to actually get a FP+.

The fixes:
I'd consider eliminating pound the app altogether. Either make it so that cancelled reservations aren't thrown back in the pot, you cannot cancel reservations after 24 hours of making them, or lock people out for 30 minutes when they're refreshing too much. I'd also consider getting rid of the extra 1 by 1 reservations... maybe only allowing one on top of your original three. I think that this would make it so that FP+ wasn't always filled, and people could more easily get on through stand-by. Or they could expand the FP+ available, since many will be virtually eliminated upon cancellation. Either way, it helps the casual guest.
 

Big Phil

Well-Known Member
I don't own a cell phone (on purpose) so I am very much against the grain of what the majority are doing nowadays. I know how to navigate without a phone. Everyone looks at their phone and sees that Splash Mountain is only 15-20 minutes. Yeah, and then when everyone goes in that direction it is back to 45 again. Fastpass is partially what kills it. I'll do it on the day I am there for some things that might have a longer line but this idea that you should book it way in advance it tiring. I would love to experience the Mine Train someday but not if I have to plan things to a neurotic extent.

Was at Universal a couple of years ago and the old rules apply as before. Go in around the time it opens, peel to the back and do those rides first and then make your way forward. 1990 or 2020 it still works. We waited 5 minutes for King Kong, Spiderman, Jurassic Park and Potter. Then we worked our way to the front and did Dr. Seuss land and those lines are never long anyway but by then many people were working their way to the back. It never fails, and you don't need a phone for it.
 

Pepper's Ghost

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I find it fascinating that of this small sample size that Same-Day Only fast pass is more popular than FP+ and No FP combined. I'd go for that I guess, but oh, do long for the days of yore when you waited in line for HM for 25 mins even when the park was busy. But I'd take the days of rushing to my favorite ride to snag a FP, then getting in standby for that ride. 😁 It's a much better process if you ask me.
 

Trackmaster

Well-Known Member
I don't own a cell phone (on purpose) so I am very much against the grain of what the majority are doing nowadays. I know how to navigate without a phone. Everyone looks at their phone and sees that Splash Mountain is only 15-20 minutes. Yeah, and then when everyone goes in that direction it is back to 45 again. Fastpass is partially what kills it. I'll do it on the day I am there for some things that might have a longer line but this idea that you should book it way in advance it tiring. I would love to experience the Mine Train someday but not if I have to plan things to a neurotic extent.

Was at Universal a couple of years ago and the old rules apply as before. Go in around the time it opens, peel to the back and do those rides first and then make your way forward. 1990 or 2020 it still works. We waited 5 minutes for King Kong, Spiderman, Jurassic Park and Potter. Then we worked our way to the front and did Dr. Seuss land and those lines are never long anyway but by then many people were working their way to the back. It never fails, and you don't need a phone for it.
Yeah, I always find it funny when I book a FP+ a few minutes before the window starts, and I go up to the line, and people are still waiting in a 90 minute stand-by line, even when tons of FP+ are available. Waiting in stand-by lines is your first mistake at Disney. Disney is all about the FP+ now.
 

ImperfectPixie

Well-Known Member
Sorry if this has been posted previously. I'm sure it has, but I couldn't find a thread about this. I know most people are used to FP now, and it's not likely going away. I'm just curious what portion of the people like FP compared to preferring the days of yore when standby lines were much shorter. Please vote, and leave your feedback too. I really am trying to understand the other side on this one.

My opinion which I believe is unpopular:
I think the FP system is what makes lines too long. I've said it several times on these boards, but my guestimation is that the priority for FP slows the standby line by 3 times... conservatively. A 20 min wait becomes a 60 min wait in standby. That's just an estimate, but it's based on standing in line for rides pre-FP, and post FP (hard to figure the effect on newer rides.) There could be other factors like increased attendance, but you stand in the same exact place without moving 3 times longer than pre-FP. I'm also basing that on the estimate that they let 20 people in from the FP line, then 10 from standby. That means for every 30 people that go in, now it's just 10 from standby hence my estimate that it slows the line by 3x.

What happened to first come, first serve? I know we're used to it now, but all it does is reward people's feeling of entitlement, and makes the "standby folk" feel snubbed, skipped, pi$$ed, etc. People are always looking to game the system, so the FP system indulges the worst human behaviors. I preferred the days where a few dishonest people faked handicaps to game the system. To me it's comparable to legalizing driving on the expressway shoulder to skip hundreds of cars.

Some people are more tech adept and able to take advantage, while others are less savvy and suffer the ills of being tech ignorant. Btw, I'm pretty tech savvy and know how it all works. I just don't like the system, mostly the part where you have to book things out 60 days, or you wait in a 2.5 hr line if you really want to ride. It's stupid and IMO Disney is picking "winners" by using this system, specifically those who are addicted to their phones. I think the next person's time is as valuable as mine. Why make people wait hours because they don't know how to use the system? Wouldn't it be better to wait in a 30 min line on average like years past, and go on whatever ride you want the entire day, than to get onto to some rides in 5 mins, and either wait in a standby for 2 hours, or never even get on a popular ride? I NEVER saw 2 hour waits pre-FP. FP is the culprit IMO.

Thoughts?
I've seen the standby to FP ratio posted as 1/4 on these boards, but I think even that isn't quite right because there have been many, many times when FP is given such a high priority that the FP line is kept pretty much empty while standby sits and waits for ridiculous amounts of time.

I will always choose legacy FP or standby only over the system that is in place now.

In regards to your statement about "a few dishonest people faked handicaps to game the system"...that doesn't even come close to what happened. People were hiring those with disabilities as "tour guides" to gain front-of-line access, basically rendering that system useless to those who really needed it simply because of the volume of people abusing the system. Speaking as an autism parent, the new DAS system that is currently in place is MUCH better.
 

trainplane3

Well-Known Member
I've seen the standby to FP ratio posted as 1/4 on these boards, but I think even that isn't quite right because there have been many, many times when FP is given such a high priority that the FP line is kept pretty much empty while standby sits and waits for ridiculous amounts of time.

I will always choose legacy FP or standby only over the system that is in place now.

In regards to your statement about "a few dishonest people faked handicaps to game the system"...that doesn't even come close to what happened. People were hiring those with disabilities as "tour guides" to gain front-of-line access, basically rendering that system useless to those who really needed it simply because of the volume of people abusing the system. Speaking as an autism parent, the new DAS system that is currently in place is MUCH better.
I believe it's a 10:1 ratio.
 

larryz

Clearly Visible
Premium Member
Yeah, I always find it funny when I book a FP+ a few minutes before the window starts, and I go up to the line, and people are still waiting in a 90 minute stand-by line, even when tons of FP+ are available. Waiting in stand-by lines is your first mistake at Disney. Disney is all about the FP+ now.
They might be locked out of further FP+s because they've got one or more of their initial three FP+s still waiting to execute. Not everybody knows the trick about early FP+ scheduling.
 
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