News Expose reveals WDC control in online fan community

[UNCgolf]

Pandora, SWGE, multiple dumbos, Little Mermaid ride, Nemo, 7DMT, MPhilarmagic, RnRC, M:S, Soarin, Rat, etc. These are major rides that have been added to WDW alone.

I can't consider that stagnant. Maybe that is slower than most? I'm not sure. I'll take your word for it.

Some of those weren't really additions. Little Mermaid/7DMT replaced 20k (although 20k was already closed and wasn't going to reopen) and the Snow White dark ride, and Mission: Space replaced Horizons.

Nemo was also a serious downgrade to the previous Living Seas full experience (and is an absolutely terrible ride).

Even SWGE/TSL replaced the previous Backlot Tour and other areas of DHS -- the tour and those other areas were mostly outdated and needed to be replaced due to the shuttering of the studio, but they still weren't expansions.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Yeah...but then I wouldn’t be able to ooh and aah for all of 30 seconds while looking at the tens of millions of dollars of fake rock work...and then proceeding to want to bang my head against said rock work, when I realize there isn’t a lot to do in the mini-land.

You leave JJ abrams out of this!!!

(No please…never really want to hear his name again)

 

[DCLcruiser]

Some of those weren't really additions. Little Mermaid/7DMT replaced 20k and the Snow White dark ride and Mission: Space replaced Horizons.

Nemo was also a serious downgrade to the previous Living Seas full experience (and is an absolutely terrible ride).

I remember 20k...I also remember an empty space for years. And then some character thing. 7DMT is an plus for me.

Horizons was one of my favorite rides as a kid thanks to being able to pick a scene to rewatch. Mission: Space is a better thrill ride lol.

Nemo is what it is. I don't really recall the old Seas Pavilion as an attraction as a kid.

 

[The Mrs]

But it…like mine train…is a very minor ride

That's a fair point but it's also fair to say that different people value different things. I love slinky dog but I've never gone on rise or flight of passage or even soarin because rides with screens are a trigger for my migraines. Not everyone uses the same measuring stick. Weird huh?

 

[Kamikaze]

But it…like mine train…is a very minor ride

They aren't, though. Those are two of the most popular rides on property, that makes them major attractions. Note the word - attract. Meaning - they attract people to the park to ride them. They definitely do that, and not in a minor way.

To say they aren't as plussed or detailed or in-depth as other attractions, both now and in the history of TWDC is true. I don't think you can reasonably argue otherwise. But to say they don't pull people into the parks is false.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

They aren't, though. Those are two of the most popular rides on property, that makes them major attractions. Note the word - attract. Meaning - they attract people to the park to ride them. They definitely do that, and not in a minor way.

To say they aren't as plussed or detailed or in-depth as other attractions, both now and in the history of TWDC is true. I don't think you can reasonably argue otherwise. But to say they don't pull people into the parks is false.

The line is reflective of the offerings and crowds…not the engineering

mine train is a 2 minute family coaster with one AA room…

slinky is an intamin family ride with theming…And not incredibly themed on the whole.

They are what they are. I’ll split this one with you

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

That's a fair point but it's also fair to say that different people value different things. I love slinky dog but I've never gone on rise or flight of passage or even soarin because rides with screens are a trigger for my migraines. Not everyone uses the same measuring stick. Weird huh?

Fair…in a way it’s more popular than the sum of its parts…

my point is a 2 hour wait in a place that is not very refreshed at high daily cost to all attendees isn’t exactly groundbreaking

 

[DCLcruiser]

The line is reflective of the offerings and crowds…not the engineering

mine train is a 2 minute family coaster with one AA room…

slinky is an intamin family ride with theming…And not incredibly themed on the whole.

They are what they are. I’ll split this one with you

I was very disappointed that 7DMT did not have more AA rooms. I thought the whole ride would take you through scenes (quickly of course).

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Some of those weren't really additions. Little Mermaid/7DMT replaced 20k (although 20k was already closed and wasn't going to reopen) and the Snow White dark ride, and Mission: Space replaced Horizons.

Nemo was also a serious downgrade to the previous Living Seas full experience (and is an absolutely terrible ride).

Even SWGE/TSL replaced the previous Backlot Tour and other areas of DHS -- the tour and those other areas were mostly outdated and needed to be replaced due to the shuttering of the studio, but they still weren't expansions.

I can tell you the net gains since Bob the magnificent took over easily:

Studios: probably net 2….so one Star Wars ride and one toy story after the closures to accommodate them.

dak: Everest and the avatar section

mk: net 3…flying carpets, little mermaid and mine train (mine train isn’t actually…but much better than snow white so I give it a point)

epcot: soarin. Just soarin…and that’s ignoring closures all over the front side. Perhaps they will bother to let people on rat…eventually?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I was very disappointed that 7DMT did not have more AA rooms. I thought the whole ride would take you through scenes (quickly of course).

It’s fine the way it is…but it could have been better. Remember Staggs had to beg uncle Bob to even get that. Was supposed to be tinker belle meet and greet huts

 

[DCLcruiser]

My point is not to slam what they’ve built…though there are missteps there too…

it’s to highlight the slowing of additions and doing mostly replacements as crowds grew had caused a decline in the value of the product…
They don’t have the capacity to adjust to anything and that was what made Disney parks unique prior…they could make it spread out or add a couple of hours for overflow.

now?
Paid rides and “after hours”

there are no coincidences here

Sorry to do this out of order, I missed your response.

So you would like them to expand the # of rides. I am 100% on board with that. I would even like a 5th gate...

I am cool with updates to some rides, and even reimagining them (I think WDW does a better job of this than Uni...BttF/Simpsons for example).

 

[UNCgolf]

I remember 20k...I also remember an empty space for years. And then some character thing. 7DMT is an plus for me.

Horizons was one of my favorite rides as a kid thanks to being able to pick a scene to rewatch. Mission: Space is a better thrill ride lol.

Nemo is what it is. I don't really recall the old Seas Pavilion as an attraction as a kid.

20k was an incredible ride (much better than 7DMT or Little Mermaid) but it would have needed a serious overhaul to still be open today. And as I said (and you mentioned) it was already closed and demolished before New Fantasyland -- 7DMT is certainly an improvement over Ariel's Grotto or whatever it was called, but it's not what it should have been. It's too short and doesn't have nearly enough scenes.

The original Living Seas pavilion was one of the best things Disney built at WDW -- as a kid, the whole experience with the hydrolaters and the sea cabs actually made you feel like you'd traveled to an underwater base. It was wonderfully designed from start to finish.

I also think Horizons was one of the 4 or 5 best rides Disney ever built.

 

[UNCgolf]

They aren't, though. Those are two of the most popular rides on property, that makes them major attractions. Note the word - attract. Meaning - they attract people to the park to ride them. They definitely do that, and not in a minor way.

To say they aren't as plussed or detailed or in-depth as other attractions, both now and in the history of TWDC is true. I don't think you can reasonably argue otherwise. But to say they don't pull people into the parks is false.

Does Slinky really attract anyone to the park? Maybe it does, but I feel like people aren't going to the park specifically to ride Slinky. It just happens to be a kid friendly roller coaster in a park that's lacking in attractions.

 

[DCLcruiser]

20k was an incredible ride (much better than 7DMT or Little Mermaid) but it would have needed a serious overhaul to still be open today. And as I said (and you mentioned) it was already closed and demolished before New Fantasyland -- 7DMT is certainly an improvement over Ariel's Grotto or whatever it was called, but it's not what it should have been. It's too short and doesn't have nearly enough scenes.

The original Living Seas pavilion was one of the best things Disney built at WDW -- as a kid, the whole experience with the hydrolaters and the sea cabs actually made you feel like you'd traveled to an underwater base. It was wonderfully designed from start to finish.

I also think Horizons was one of the 4 or 5 best rides Disney ever built.

I read the Wiki on the LS pavilion and it sounds very cool. I am sure we did it, I just can't remember. Plus, going to Sea World and living near NY we are jaded for Zoos and Aquariums.

Does Slinky really attract anyone to the park? Maybe it does, but I feel like people aren't going to the park specifically to ride Slinky. It just happens to be a kid friendly roller coaster in a park that's lacking in attractions.

No, but I love roller coasters, so I'll take it. Frankly, TSMM is one of my favorite rides at WDW so I do like TS land.

 

[The Mrs]

I wish I'd gotten to experience 20,000 Leagues. It was either closed or I was out of the correct ticket every time I visited.

 

[The Mrs]

Does Slinky really attract anyone to the park? Maybe it does, but I feel like people aren't going to the park specifically to ride Slinky. It just happens to be a kid friendly roller coaster in a park that's lacking in attractions.

I have actually walked to Hollywood Studios from Boardwalk Inn several times just to ride Slinky. I sort of feel embarrassed admitting it on this thread of attraction connoisseurs.

 

[UNCgolf]

I have actually walked to Hollywood Studios from Boardwalk Inn several times just to ride Slinky. I sort of feel embarrassed admitting it on this thread of attraction connoisseurs.

There's nothing wrong with that if you really enjoyed it!

I like Na'vi River Journey far more than most people here, although I'm still convinced that's due to the wait times being extremely inflated. It wouldn't have such long waits if it was at the Magic Kingdom (or if DAK had more to do) and it would be easier to judge it on its merits instead of the wait.

 

[UNCgolf]

I read the Wiki on the LS pavilion and it sounds very cool. I am sure we did it, I just can't remember. Plus, going to Sea World and living near NY we are jaded for Zoos and Aquariums.

It was actually the biggest aquarium tank in the US when it first opened (maybe in the whole world, actually?) but yeah, that wasn't really the draw for me as a kid. It was the whole experience themed as though you were actually underwater in a base. Now it's just an aquarium (and one that I think has fewer animals than it did at its height, although I may be wrong on that).

I live in Atlanta and we have the biggest aquarium tank in the western hemisphere now (I think second largest in the world), so the one at EPCOT isn't super impressive to me. It really needs that sea base theme back to make it unique. Plus, as I said, the Nemo ride is just awful. It's always empty.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Does Slinky really attract anyone to the park? Maybe it does, but I feel like people aren't going to the park specifically to ride Slinky. It just happens to be a kid friendly roller coaster in a park that's lacking in attractions.

Of course not. It’s just the “newest” thing to ride that appeals to the widest amount of travelers so they gravitate towards it. No one ever said: “you know…let’s head to Orlando for $7,500 or so…slinky is calling”

I have actually walked to Hollywood Studios from Boardwalk Inn several times just to ride Slinky. I sort of feel embarrassed admitting it on this thread of attraction connoisseurs.

No foul…we all want to be in the compound - or we wouldn’t be here…

we take what they give us. The problem is they need to give more.

3 of the last 4 “minilands” have been some degree of failure to accomplish what was needed/prudent…so they have spent a lot of time and money on that.
12 years and maybe $2.5 billion??
For a 8 or so new rides and one hybrid sit down restaurant beyond the usual quick serves and junk peddlers??

 

[kpilcher]

I am really confused by the hatred for Genie and Genie+. Other than people not wanting to personally pay for it. The biggest complaints boil down to it is not very Disney.
But Disney pioneered the "Pay to get in the gates" then pay for each attraction and some would cost way more than others model. Other park operators in 1955 thought Walt was crazy to charge people to get into his little park.
Then Disney introduced all of the upcharge activities at Walt Disney World in 1971. Free waterski show on the lagoon, but pay extra so you can have a seat. Close the park at sunset, so you can charge people to ride a boat around the lagoon and Bay Lake while you spend money on cocktails. Or you can pay to go to a Dinner Show at the Top of the World or Luau Cove.
Want to get around the World, pay for transportation to WED for the monorail, bus, ferry or trains. "
Not staying on property, then don't get on a bus, you had to show your resort ID card for a quick jaunt to Fort Wilderness to ride the ponys (pony or horse rides are an additional charge) This is the exact business model that Uncle Walt and Uncle Roy designed for vacation.

That’s mostly true, but when the A-E tickets were in place admission topped out at $8 (1980 just before 1-day passports replaced A-E) That would be about $25 in today’s dollars. The Most popular ticket book would be another $35 including the transportation ticket you mentioned. So $60/day In 2021 dollars. Now they are asking Up to $159 just for admission. so it’s no wonder additional up charges per attraction or day aren’t popular with many people. Keep in mind, Fastpass was free but it wasn’t charity. it was intended to get people to spend more money by giving them less time in lines. Don’t get me wrong: Disney needed to make a change Fastpass+ had gotten out of hand and hurt efficiency. But I get why the new model makes people mad.