News 'Encanto' and 'Indiana Jones'-themed experiences at Animal Kingdom

[Disgruntled Walt]

@lentesta Can you share historical data of Dinosaur's popularity/ratings? Has it declined? Was it never that high to begin with? I just want to know if there is data that supports the idea that the ride is unpopular.

 

[erasure fan1]

Maybe if people had actually seen it or watched it on Disney Plus (I haven't seen it myself, but I doubt it's as bad as everyone makes it out to be), it would have done better.

I did watch it. I would have to watch it again to make a final decision. But I didn't think it was that bad. I wouldn't put it as a top pixar film but it wasn't nearly as bad as what the majority of people said about it. Of course my expectations could have been so low from all the hate on it that I was pleasantly surprised. Lol

I disagree. Jurassic is framed as dinosaurs as monsters/dangerous. Disney absolutely could do counter programming of showing the wonder and inspiration of dinosaurs and human beings’ love affair with them. I honestly don’t get why Disney is just quitting there where it’s absolutely a big enough concept to “share” with Uni.

I'm right there with you. Dinosaurs are well loved enough that multiple concepts could be successful. Disney could have very easily leaned into the wonder like you said. I can understand changing Dinosaur in AK because at this point it does seem like a discount Jurassic park. But it could have very easily been updated to something of a cross between universe of energy and Dinosaur. Give it a little Disney thrill and the wonder of dinosaurs, and you can have success. Unfortunately Disney and no IP has gone the same way as dinosaurs. Extinct.

 

[The Leader of the Club]

I honestly don’t get why Disney is just quitting there where it’s absolutely a big enough concept to “share” with Uni.

it’s all a matter of merchandising. People aren’t as likely to buy a generic dinosaur sweatshirt/t-shirt when they can get one with the Jurassic Park Logo on the next day of their vacation. People don’t care about the Carnatorus or Iguanadon as much as the T-Rex or Velociraptor.

 

[erasure fan1]

it’s all a matter of merchandising. People aren’t as likely to buy a generic dinosaur sweatshirt/t-shirt when they can get one with the Jurassic Park Logo on the next day of their vacation.

True. But they would be willing to buy a, insert awesome dinosaur land name, shirt. That's where Disney fails. People buy merch for adventure land, or tomorrow land. How about space mountain or thunder... If the land is great and the ride is great, I guarantee it can move merch. The problem is, you have to work for it. Something Disney doesn't seem all that willing to do. It's all, path of least resistance now.

 

[The Leader of the Club]

People liked Splash Mountain, too (at least before 2020), but that didn't stop them from getting rid of THAT.

Dinosaur isn’t based on a movie the company deemed too problematic to release. If Splash didn’t have that baggage, it probably would still be around.

So what you're implying is that people who go to theme parks are dumb hicks who hate anything that doesn't have an IP attached to it and clap whenever they see their favorite character in an attraction, even if that attraction is mediocre? I should also point out that Spaceship Earth always has long lines whenever I'm at EPCOT.

You’re putting words in my mouth. I’m saying that Disney’s main appeal is their IP. It’s what gets people through the door. It’s what guests expect to see. Mickey Mouse, Princesses, Toy Story, Star Wars, etc. These characters are what bring guests and sell merchandise. It’s why kids clamor to visit Disney over another theme park. People don’t hate attractions that don’t feature these characters, but those attractions also aren’t why millions of first-time guests flock to Orlando every year. The characters get them through the door, the quality of attractions (both original and IP) and service should keep them coming back.

As for SSE, it’s the first ride in the park and it’s in the park icon. It should have a long wait regardless of what the attraction is. Most guests wouldn’t say it’s their favorite ride though.

 

[Bill Cipher]

As I mentioned above, it's more than the poor showing of two dinosaur movies (especially when you compare theme to Jurassic Park/World).

Disney failed to make outstanding dinosaur attractions.

And yes, DINOSAUR has its adherents. But it also has significant detractors.

It's not so much that "it has to have a theatrical IP," as it is "it has to be beloved."

Beloved enough to attract guests, get high GSATs, and push merch.

And not because there are people who want a dinosaur attraction. There are a lot of people wanting a lot of different types of attractions... and they're not going to get what they want.

I understand that Dinosaur is leaving because of a combination of low GSATs, significant detractors, poor merch sales, and high maintenance costs but I don't think Disney believes Dinosaurs as a narrative element are cursed or something for any future attractions. They could make an amazing dinosaur-based attraction with mass market appeal if management wanted it, but the primary reason they don't want it is because they don't have a hot Dinosaur IP to tie it to.

 

[Horizonsfan]

As for SSE, it’s the first ride in the park and it’s in the park icon. It should have a long wait regardless of what the attraction is. Most guests wouldn’t say it’s their favorite ride though.

It’s tough to be a Bug and GMR would like a word about the wait times of icon attractions.

 

[LSLS]

Dinosaur isn’t based on a movie the company deemed too problematic to release. If Splash didn’t have that baggage, it probably would still be around.

You’re putting words in my mouth. I’m saying that Disney’s main appeal is their IP. It’s what gets people through the door. It’s what guests expect to see. Mickey Mouse, Princesses, Toy Story, Star Wars, etc. These characters are what bring guests and sell merchandise. It’s why kids clamor to visit Disney over another theme park. People don’t hate attractions that don’t feature these characters, but those attractions also aren’t why millions of first-time guests flock to Orlando every year. The characters get them through the door, the quality of attractions (both original and IP) and service should keep them coming back.

As for SSE, it’s the first ride in the park and it’s in the park icon. It should have a long wait regardless of what the attraction is. Most guests wouldn’t say it’s their favorite ride though.

Maybe to an extent. But I'd venture a guess that Haunted Mansion merch sells towards the top as well. Further, basing exclusively on an IP has the potential to limit things. Do things stay popular when that IP isn't the new thing anymore? What about if people don't like the IP? Personally, I can't stand Encanto, and the rest of my family is meh on it, so a mini-land and ride about it already starts on the outs, and needs to show it's an insanely good ride to get us caring at all. And of course the other question that is just impossible to answer, is the IP why a ride is popular, or is the ride itself the reason? If Guardians was themed as a journey to explore space instead of some battle, would it be the same popularity? Or could it make it more timeless? I've said many times, but I love riding that thing, and I still have no idea what the story is or how we win.

 

[Bocabear]

Maybe to an extent. But I'd venture a guess that Haunted Mansion merch sells towards the top as well. Further, basing exclusively on an IP has the potential to limit things. Do things stay popular when that IP isn't the new thing anymore? What about if people don't like the IP? Personally, I can't stand Encanto, and the rest of my family is meh on it, so a mini-land and ride about it already starts on the outs, and needs to show it's an insanely good ride to get us caring at all. And of course the other question that is just impossible to answer, is the IP why a ride is popular, or is the ride itself the reason? If Guardians was themed as a journey to explore space instead of some battle, would it be the same popularity? Or could it make it more timeless? I've said many times, but I love riding that thing, and I still have no idea what the story is or how we win.

Guardians could easily be re-themed without IP and still be a wildly popular ride... It is so much fun! Story in my eyes doesn't quite carry...like you said, I have no idea what I am doing or how we win, but it's a fun, thrilling experience....

 

[mickEblu]

Having been on both, this is wild to me. If you're comparing their merits as attractions I don't think it's close anymore, the dino battle at the end in person is pretty fantastic.

If you have a strong sense of nostalgia for OG jurassic park or even OH IoA then I can understand this preference down to sentimentality




I mean they made this move bringing the dinos from the worlds fair to Disneyland and from America Sings to Splash Mountain.

I think adding Dinosaur show scenes along the railroad would be a really awesome, creative use of resources - so it's almost guaranteed not to happen under our present Disney regime.....

I think I prefer the old Hollywood/ Orlando version as well. Aside from the OG nostalgia, the build up to the drop was much better with the countdown and the T-Rex popping out of the smoke. They added more AAs and the Indominus Rex is impressive but it feels like the T-Rex is just flying out of nowhere and not engaging with Indominus. Overall the scene felt more believable. It comes across a little more show building-y now. Not sure if that’s because I know what it used to be like or because you enter a building and all of a sudden you’re in a jungle. I’m guessing they re going for some sort of indoor exhibit but I’m not sure it’s successful. In other words psychologically I used to feel like I was being attacked by a T-Rex in a power plant (or whatever it was supposed to be) and now I feel like I’m in a show building.

 

[lentesta]

@lentesta Can you share historical data of Dinosaur's popularity/ratings? Has it declined? Was it never that high to begin with? I just want to know if there is data that supports the idea that the ride is unpopular.

Going back to 2012, which is what I have easy access to for a quick answer:

DINOSAUR Ratings 2012 vs 2024

• The same:
  • Preschoolers: 2.5 stars both years
  • Grade School: 4 stars both years
  • Over 30: 4 stars both years
• The changes:
  • Teens: 4.5 stars then vs 4 stars now
  • Young Adults: 5 stars then vs 4 stars now
  • Seniors: 4.5 stars vs 4 stars

We have more surveys now than in 2012, so those 2012 numbers probably have a wider confidence interval than today's numbers. But a drop from 5 stars to 4 among Young Adults, one of the groups we have a ton of data on, is almost certainly going to be significant.

The other thing to consider with any new project is this: If it's done to add or update a headliner attraction, it either adds ILL revenue, expands the appeal of Genie+, or helps guests justify the cost of Genie+.

So it doesn't have to be about replacing an unpopular attraction. It can be "If this attraction is already popular, what could we do to it to generate revenue that we're not." I really think Test Track might be the canonical example of this.

This is also one of the reasons why I think an Imagination re-do is more likely now than in pre-Genie+ days. And I'm not saying that's happening - it's just my understanding of how I think WDI is approaching new projects. Much easier to say to the board "Let's re-do this decades-old attraction for the fourth time even though it doesn't have film IP" if you can project that sales of X number of popcorn buckets will mean $Y in Lightning Lane revenue.

 

[999th Happy Haunt]

WDWMagic users when a good ride has high wait times: “Lightning Lane is killing capacity”

WDWMagic users when a good ride has a low wait time: “It’s not popular enough to remain open”

 

[Fox&Hound]

People liked Splash Mountain, too (at least before 2020), but that didn't stop them from getting rid of THAT.

So what you're implying is that people who go to theme parks are dumb hicks who hate anything that doesn't have an IP attached to it and clap whenever they see their favorite character in an attraction, even if that attraction is mediocre? I should also point out that Spaceship Earth always has long lines whenever I'm at EPCOT.

Maybe if people had actually seen it or watched it on Disney Plus (I haven't seen it myself, but I doubt it's as bad as everyone makes it out to be), it would have done better.

Uh yeah, that's kind of how that work. If people had seen it, it would have done better...

The movie had multiple re-writes and I think fired a lot of the voice actors at one point. You can tell it went through many changes and ended up a huge mess. The photorealistic backgrounds were stunning but everything else made no sense or fell short.

 

[SailorMercury]

People liked Splash Mountain, too (at least before 2020), but that didn't stop them from getting rid of THAT.

STOP POSTING ABOUT SPLASH MOUNTAIN! I'M TIRED OF SEEING IT! My friends on TikTok send me memes, on Discord its frickin memes. I was in a server, right, and ALL the channels are just Splash Mountain stuff. I showed a fox to my girlfriend, and I said "Hey babe, we're gonna catch that Br'er Rabbit! HAHA! ZIP-A-DEE-DOO-DAH ZIP-A-DEE-AY!" I looked at a trash can and I said "PLEASE DON'T FLING ME IN THE TRASH BIN!" I looked at my shower, I thought of the Laughin Place and I go "NOTHIN BUT BEEEEEES IN HERE" AAAAAAAAAAAAAA

 

[SailorMercury]

Maybe to an extent. But I'd venture a guess that Haunted Mansion merch sells towards the top as well. Further, basing exclusively on an IP has the potential to limit things. Do things stay popular when that IP isn't the new thing anymore? What about if people don't like the IP? Personally, I can't stand Encanto, and the rest of my family is meh on it, so a mini-land and ride about it already starts on the outs, and needs to show it's an insanely good ride to get us caring at all. And of course the other question that is just impossible to answer, is the IP why a ride is popular, or is the ride itself the reason? If Guardians was themed as a journey to explore space instead of some battle, would it be the same popularity? Or could it make it more timeless? I've said many times, but I love riding that thing, and I still have no idea what the story is or how we win.

Cars is 18 years old, and it still pushes merch to this day. You can go to Target right now and get a Franchesco Bernulli toy from Cars 2 (widely hated by people over 8).
Princesses are always popular. Mirabel has princess popularity. The Madrigals are like the Avengers for younger kids. Everyone has a favorite one (my favorite is Isabela). They still push merch (aside from Antonio for some reason).
Years down the line, when the kids on Encanto are our age (by our I mean 20's-30's), they'll want that nostalgic Encanto merch. Like how we want nostalgic Goofy Movie and Hercules merch. We're seeing it right now for 2000's kids like me with some Treasure Planet and Atlantis things being made.
Frozen is still popular 11 years later. Moana is almost 8. Disney animation has staying power. There are few films (Black Cauldron and stuff like that) that don't have it. But this is Encanto. It has the power.

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

View attachment 781615
STOP POSTING ABOUT SPLASH MOUNTAIN! I'M TIRED OF SEEING IT! My friends on TikTok send me memes, on Discord its frickin memes. I was in a server, right, and ALL the channels are just Splash Mountain stuff. I showed a fox to my girlfriend, and I said "Hey babe, we're gonna catch that Br'er Rabbit! HAHA! ZIP-A-DEE-DOO-DAH ZIP-A-DEE-AY!" I looked at a trash can and I said "PLEASE DON'T FLING ME IN THE TRASH BIN!" I looked at my shower, I thought of the Laughin Place and I go "NOTHIN BUT BEEEEEES IN HERE" AAAAAAAAAAAAAA

 

[osian]

True. But they would be willing to buy a, insert awesome dinosaur land name, shirt. That's where Disney fails. People buy merch for adventure land, or tomorrow land. How about space mountain or thunder... If the land is great and the ride is great, I guarantee it can move merch. The problem is, you have to work for it. Something Disney doesn't seem all that willing to do. It's all, path of least resistance now.

On my last viist I would have loved a Test Track t-shirt, but they were all plastered with Mickey Mouse ears or other cutesy characters. Maybe that sells to the children, but there's a proportion of the visitors to whom that wouldn't sell and there's an untapped market for attractions and park related stuff. They used to do this. I've got a lovely character-free Soarin t-shirt. I'm really atfer loads of EPCOT merch that promotes the park that I'd be proud to wear or display, not Disney characters.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Is this a good time to say “I miss The Great Movie Ride”?

Not a day goes by that I don’t think about it and the Roman Empire.

 

[osian]

Is this a good time to say “I miss The Great Movie Ride”?

It's always a good time!

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

Is this a good time to say “I miss The Great Movie Ride”?

Not a day goes by that I don’t think about it and the Roman Empire.