DisneylandForward

[mickEblu]

I didn't say it was equivalent.

What I said is from a consumer stand point they are booking a vacation anyways when there is more stuff to do not just because there is a 3rd gate.

Do you think that people would book less vacations to WDW if there were three parks instead of four but the same amount of stuff to do? No of course not. So its silly to think that just because a 3rd park is added that more vacations are going to be booked over expanding DL/DCA with the equivalent experience.

so a few more rides piecemeal'd over decades is going to move the needle and sell tons of hotel rooms and long vacation stays? Especially at annual pass holder dominated DLR? A third gate does that. Not 10 new rides over 25 years.

 

[DrStarlander]

It's very simple. The third gate at Toy Story is 40 feet above grade. The entire property is covered by this, which has all the ride show buildings and utilidor type functions.

On the roof of that, is this:

I just doubled the acreage. Magic.

 

[Disney Irish]

ok hold on let me put Disney reading glasses on:

This Disney Irish guy is crazy

Its easy to say just add a third park when you don't have to worry about all the rest of the stuff that is required to make that happen.

 

[mickEblu]

Its easy to say just add a third park when you don't have to worry about all the rest of the stuff that is required to make that happen.

I’m a Walt. You’re a Roy. And that’s ok. The world needs both.

 

[Distorian]

I didn't say it was equivalent.

Let us review the minutes.

If I'm getting the equivalent third gate experience for a two gate cost…

Case closed.

What I said is from a consumer stand point they are booking a vacation anyways when there is more stuff to do not just because there is a 3rd gate.

Do you think that people would book less vacations to WDW if there were three parks instead of four but the same amount of stuff to do? No of course not. So its silly to think that just because a 3rd park is added that more vacations are going to be booked over expanding DL/DCA with the equivalent experience.

People definitely spend more time and money at WDW because there are four parks instead of if there were only three. What even is this argument? Usually I disagree with you but I understand what you’re talking about, but this idea that a shopping district brings in equal tourism to a third park is bafflingly out of touch with reality.

 

[Disney Irish]

so a few more rides piecemeal'd over decades is going to move the needle and sell tons of hotel rooms and long vacation stays? Especially at annual pass holder dominated DLR? A third gate does that. Not 10 new rides over 25 years.

Again put your Disney hat on, which is more likely to be what Disney does ....

1. Piecemeal out new additions to the existing Parks over the next 15-40 years

or

2. A single push for a 3rd gate that doesn't allow for anything else in the future

Remember DLForward is suppose to be setting up Disney for future expansion for the next 40 years. Not a single push for one final addition.

 

[mickEblu]

Again put your Disney hat on, which is more likely to be what Disney does ....

1. Piecemeal out new additions to the existing Parks over the next 15-40 years

or

2. A single push for a 3rd gate that doesn't allow for anything else in the future

Remember DLForward is suppose to be setting up Disney for future expansion for the next 40 years. Not a single push for one final addition.

The third gate because it actually moves the needle and meets objectives much quicker. When does Disney play the long game? How many corporations do that these days? Quarter over quarter gains baby!

Plus they’d still have DL forwards lots and “expansion pads” within DL proper to use.

And when that’s all gone we can have the 4th park somewhere in Chino.

 

[DrStarlander]

The last thing Southern California needs is another shopping center. Especially a shopping center by the people who brought us DTD. Would I take a Caruso development? Sure. But another Disney shopping center. Absolutely not. They are not anywhere near best in class in that field.

 

[Disney Irish]

Let us review the minutes.

Case closed.

People definitely spend more time and money at WDW because there are four parks instead of if there were only three. What even is this argument? Usually I disagree with you but I understand what you’re talking about, but this idea that a shopping district brings in equal tourism to a third park is bafflingly out of touch with reality.

You missed the point.

This isn't about the shopping district being used to draw in tourists. Never claimed that, you guys were trying to say that.

This is about ANY addition to the Parks is going to draw in more tourist. So if Disney add say 12 new attractions to the expansion areas for DL and DCA, a 3rd gate equivalent. Its going to bring in the same amount of tourists as a 3rd gate would.

 

[mickEblu]

The last thing Southern California needs is another shopping center. Especially a shopping center by the people who brought us DTD. Would I take a Caruso development? Sure. But another Disney shopping center. Absolutely not. They are not anywhere near best in class in that field.

Agree but I wouldn’t want a Caruso in that lot either. It has to be a park. After they announce it it’ll sound so obvious to everyone in hindsight.

 

[mickEblu]

You missed the point.

This isn't about the shopping district being used to draw in tourists. Never claimed that, you guys were trying to say that.

This is about ANY addition to the Parks is going to draw in more tourist. So if Disney add say 12 new attractions to the expansion areas for DL and DCA, a 3rd gate equivalent. Its going to bring in the same amount of tourists as a 3rd gate would.

Not over 25 + years! That doesn’t move the needle like a 3rd gate opening overnight does.

 

[coffeefan]

The last thing Southern California needs is another shopping center. Especially a shopping center by the people who brought us DTD. Would I take a Caruso development? Sure. But another Disney shopping center. Absolutely not. They are not anywhere near best in class in that field.

DTD does not make the top 3 or 5 in OC. If we count LA shopping districts, it may not even crack the top 10.

 

[Disney Irish]

The third gate because it actually moves the needle and meets objectives much quicker. When does Disney play the long game? How many corporations do that these days? Quarter over quarter gains baby!

Plus they’d still have DL forwards lots and “expansion pads” within DL proper to use.

And when that’s all gone we can have the 4th park somewhere in Chino.

Not over 25 years! That doesn’t move the needle like a 3rd gate opening overnight does.

Move the needle, when has Disney cared about moving the needle in the last 30 years? Also we have seen Disney play it slow on new attractions, we have a long history of that at DLR. You want to go back over your whole argument about how long its been since Disney added a themed coaster to DLR? What is it now 30 years?

Even if we believe Josh is trying to go bigger on lands doesn't mean he is automatically going to just lay out Billions on a new Park.

 

[mickEblu]

Move the needle, when has Disney cared about moving the needle in the last 30 years? Also we have seen Disney play it slow on new attractions, we have a long history of that at DLR. You want to go back over your whole argument about how long its been since Disney added a themed coaster to DLR? What is it now 30 years?

Even if we believe Josh is trying to go bigger on lands doesn't mean he is automatically going to just lay out Billions on a new Park.

Ok you’re losing me. So you don’t think Disney wants people to stay at the resort another day or two? 10 new rides over three decades doesn’t accomplish that.

 

[Disney Irish]

Ok you’re losing me. So you don’t think Disney wants people to stay at the resort another day or two? 10 new rides over three decades doesn’t accomplish that.

I think expanding into the new areas adding new lands over the course of that time does that, a new land every 3-5 years.

I mean it certainly does that more than a single Park that could be seen as a half day Park that is one and done.

 

[DrStarlander]

This is about ANY addition to the Parks is going to draw in more tourist. So if Disney add say 12 new attractions to the expansion areas for DL and DCA, a 3rd gate equivalent. Its going to bring in the same amount of tourists as a 3rd gate would.

No, and that's exactly why WDW has four theme parks instead of Magic Kingdom being expanded all those decades. Tourists can get their head around "there are three parks to see" more than "there are now 63 attractions across the 2 parks whereas several years ago I think it was 40-something attractions, but I don't remember."

Agree but I wouldn’t want a Caruso in that lot either. It has to be a park. After they announce it it’ll sound so obvious to everyone in hindsight.

No, to clarify, I don't want any shopping center at Toy Story. But if a Caruso development was near the parks I would go there instead of DTD, by far.

 

[Disney Irish]

No, and that's exactly why WDW has four theme parks instead of Magic Kingdom being expanded all those decades. Tourists can get their head around "there are three parks to see" more than "there are now 63 attractions across the 2 parks whereas several years ago I think it was 40-something attractions, but I don't remember."

Disagree, maybe in 1995, but these days in the era of "Disney is too expense for what we get" you'd find more guests favoring less Parks but more experiences per Park than more Parks with less experiences per Park as they have now.

 

[mickEblu]

No, and that's exactly why WDW has four theme parks instead of Magic Kingdom being expanded all those decades. Tourists can get their head around "there are three parks to see" more than "there are now 63 attractions across the 2 parks whereas several years ago I think it was 40-something attractions, but I don't remember."


No, to clarify, I don't want any shopping center at Toy Story. But if a Caruso development was near the parks I would go there instead of DTD, by far.

Right and I’m not sure why he’s glossing over the difference between a 3rd gate opening vs 10 attractions opening on the expansion lots over 25 + years. Kind of an important distinction

 

[mickEblu]

No, to clarify, I don't want any shopping center at Toy Story. But if a Caruso development was near the parks I would go there instead of DTD, by far.

But I am kind of upset with Caruso for getting rid of my go to movie theatre at the Calabasas Commons.

 

[DrStarlander]

Disagree, maybe in 1995, but these days in the era of "Disney is too expense for what we get" you'd find more guests favoring less Parks but more experiences per Park than more Parks with less experiences per Park as they have now.

This is not going to be decided by Disney based on "what guests favor." It will be made based on what makes the most money.