Politics Disneyland Closure: Another six months?

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I had no plans to go back until second half of 2021 anyway. And, the longer this goes on, I suspect the more local APs will just give up and cancel.

So I say let it burn. Let it all burn...

...big fan, huh?

 

[BuzzedPotatoHead89]

But that’s not what is happening...all the recommendations were to prevent spread and mitigate the impact to the public and medical system...to tamp it down. And that has been only partially effective.

This is a nonsense world where everyone believes their personal, unqualified opinion should be considered. This is not a debate on abstract concepts.

If you want to say the California officials are going to far...I can see it. The Florida ones didn’t go far enough and continue to gamble.

Disneyland will return in course...patience is a virtue.

Any state based recommendations are at best only partially effective because the virus doesn’t know state borders and even with rates of domestic travel dropping off dramatically overall interstate commerce/travel is still occurring. Heck, there’s even LA-based influencers traveling to WDW. The problem with a lack of a consistent national strategy is that we (the US) are really only as strong as the weakest state’s guidance as some states and localities still refused to issue even reasonable measures to slow the spread of the virus.

At this rate, in terms of success/failure of our COVID mitigation measures the cat isn’t just out of the bag, but it has literally shredded the bag and proceeded to mess around with every ally cat in town. And while progress is being made toward a vaccine to be approved by an EUA for a limited population, there is no guarantee that a vaccine will be a silver bullet (in terms of reaching herd immunity) to return us to the level normalcy we used to enjoy. Per CDC this will be a phased distribution approach in a population of 300M and is not likely to supplant responsible safety precautions like mask wearing and social distancing for the foreseeable future.

I don’t personally care if Disneyland (Or other “nonessential businesses”) opens this year or even in 2021, but given the inadequate social safety net most CMs face (see: political disfunction around simply extending the UI benefits) combined with the budget hits to the local/state governments this “wait and see” approach is really a less than viable situation for the likely medium-to-long term duration of time for which COVID will now continue to persist.

In short: If we presume COVID is with us for the long term (Years) is there a place for theme parks and other forms of entertainment to coexist? As a fan, I think/hope there will have to be. This is a paradigm shift not unlike other seminole events which will require a reimagining of many industries, but it’s also a literal and figurative “evolve or die” scenario for the CA-based theme park industry.

 

[shambolicdefending]

...big fan, huh?

Of APs? Not really.

 

[shambolicdefending]

Have you had the disease?

No. In fact I don't even personally know anybody who's had it, even though I live in one of the harder hit states, statistically. But I do know several people who are suffering tremendous personal and financial consequences due to the lockdowns. Their symptoms are quite severe.

 

[cmwade77]

Have you had the disease?

Well, I can't speak for the other poster, but yes I believe I did before any testing was taking place and I fully believe most at my workplace at that time did as well, but this was early 2019 well before this was on anyone's radar, but all of the symptoms matched up and it spread through the office like wildfire, unfortunately we don't have many of the same staff members so full on antibody testing can't really take place to determine if it was the case. But based on the evidence I have at hand, this has been around far longer than anyone in the US is willing to admit.

But if you ask me if I have had it since the "official start" of this pandemic, no, I have not. I do know people who have had it whose symptoms have ranged from mild to death, although the death was caused by the complication of getting kicked in the head by a horse, but the death certificate say COVID. The rest have been pretty mild, although the one that went through our office before this wasn't mild, most people were out for at least a week.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Any state based recommendations are at best only partially effective because the virus doesn’t know state borders and even with rates of domestic travel dropping off dramatically overall interstate commerce/travel is still occurring. Heck, there’s even LA-based influencers traveling to WDW. The problem with a lack of a consistent national strategy is that we (the US) are really only as strong as the weakest state’s guidance as some states and localities still refused to issue even reasonable measures to slow the spread of the virus.

At this rate, in terms of success/failure of our COVID mitigation measures the cat isn’t just out of the bag, but it has literally shredded the bag and proceeded to mess around with every ally cat in town. And while progress is being made toward a vaccine to be approved by an EUA for a limited population, there is no guarantee that a vaccine will be a silver bullet (in terms of reaching herd immunity) to return us to the level normalcy we used to enjoy. Per CDC this will be a phased distribution approach in a population of 300M and is not likely to supplant responsible safety precautions like mask wearing and social distancing for the foreseeable future.

I don’t personally care if Disneyland (Or other “nonessential businesses”) opens this year or even in 2021, but given the inadequate social safety net most CMs face (see: political disfunction around simply extending the UI benefits) combined with the budget hits to the local/state governments this “wait and see” approach is really a less than viable situation for the likely medium-to-long term duration of time for which COVID will now continue to persist.

In short: If we presume COVID is with us for the long term (Years) is there a place for theme parks and other forms of entertainment to coexist? As a fan, I think/hope there will have to be. This is a paradigm shift not unlike other seminole events which will require a reimagining of many industries, but it’s also a literal and figurative “evolve or die” scenario for the CA-based theme park industry.

Very fair, well rationalized post

...I knew an intelligent Disneyland fan would show up


I love DL...not a frequent visitor but have been several times recently and will again fairly soon.

But as an East Coaster with more miles on my wdw odometer than I care to admit...it’s not much different for us than locked out disneylanders.

We can’t go. Local restrictions make it logistically near impossible. That’s for those in states that battled this thing in the trenches first with the biggest losses In money and men.

So Orlando is operating on the “quadrant” of the country that takes pride in not caring and has been a disaster all summer and continues to be as the weather turns.
And the only reason their bad statistics have been lessened? The dedicated work of real experts in medicine and administration that had to fight on the fly earlier this year...lessons hard learned.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

No. In fact I don't even personally know anybody who's had it, even though I live in one of the harder hit states, statistically. But I do know several people who are suffering tremendous personal and financial consequences due to the lockdowns. Their symptoms are quite severe.

...I think that means your voice is being muffled by your chair then.

 

[monykalyn]

Yes we mustn't let things like-decreasing deaths/IFR, decreasing hospitalizations, excessive deaths BELOW average since end of august - stand in the way of opening things up! Absolutely we should keep EVERYTHING closed because "safety first" boys and girls!! Mustn't update thinking as more is known NOW than what was known in March!! NOPE-have to stay set in stone from first "facts" regardless of how much has changed! pssh-essential businesses aside-only those which are now PC to be open should! Only low wage income earners (NH staff, grocery workers) should continue to be at risk so those elite comfortable earners can continue to be part of zoom community! No need to bother with the small business earner whose own livelihood is essential to them! Keep'em closed!

 

[cmwade77]

Very fair, well rationalized post

...I knew an intelligent Disneyland fan would show up


I love DL...not a frequent visitor but have been several times recently and will again fairly soon.

But as an East Coaster with more miles on my wdw odometer than I care to admit...it’s not much different for us than locked out disneylanders.

We can’t go. Local restrictions make it logistically near impossible. That’s for those in states that battled this thing in the trenches first with the biggest losses In money and men.

So Orlando is operating on the “quadrant” of the country that takes pride in not caring and has been a disaster all summer and continues to be as the weather turns.
And the only reason their bad statistics have been lessened? The dedicated work of real experts in medicine and administration that had to fight on the fly earlier this year...lessons hard learned.

Not really, look at the real numbers and ignore nursing homes (that is where the majority of issues are), Orlando does indeed care and is in fact safer than most places (except maybe South Dakota) as long as you avoid things like nursing homes and do your part. If I lived on the east coast, I would be going to WDW right now. I just can't justify spending that much time on a plane to fly out there right now, my work is busy, my wife is getting a lot of substitute teaching jobs, so really 8+ hours round trip on a plane for what would amount to being able to spend 2, maybe 3 days doesn't make sense.

Theme parks all across the country have proven it is quite possible to safely reopen and that includes Orlando, it is now time.

 

[Bob Harlem]

What happened in Nashville and the Mayor there is a good reason why Disneyland should have already opened up.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Not really, look at the real numbers and ignore nursing homes (that is where the majority of issues are), Orlando does indeed care and is in fact safer than most places (except maybe South Dakota) as long as you avoid things like nursing homes and do your part. If I lived on the east coast, I would be going to WDW right now. I just can't justify spending that much time on a plane to fly out there right now, my work is busy, my wife is getting a lot of substitute teaching jobs, so really 8+ hours round trip on a plane for what would amount to being able to spend 2, maybe 3 days doesn't make sense.

It can’t be done if you live in where the “heavy hitter” wdw travelers are...That’s the megalopolis, still...in most cases due to logistics.

Florida can’t get their numbers under control to the point where their travel resume. Bad administration.

Let’s reopen some bars! You think that the amount of transient/service workers that cross cross the tourist corridor everyday is taking “full precautions”??

I surmise you haven’t lived in Orlando.

Anyway...Disneylands day will come. And hopefully luck rules the day In other places. We sure need it.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Well, I can't speak for the other poster, but yes I believe I did before any testing was taking place and I fully believe most at my workplace at that time did as well, but this was early 2019 well before this was on anyone's radar, but all of the symptoms matched up and it spread through the office like wildfire, unfortunately we don't have many of the same staff members so full on antibody testing can't really take place to determine if it was the case. But based on the evidence I have at hand, this has been around far longer than anyone in the US is willing to admit.

But if you ask me if I have had it since the "official start" of this pandemic, no, I have not. I do know people who have had it whose symptoms have ranged from mild to death, although the death was caused by the complication of getting kicked in the head by a horse, but the death certificate say COVID. The rest have been pretty mild, although the one that went through our office before this wasn't mild, most people were out for at least a week.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

What happened in Nashville is a good reason why Disneyland should have already opened up.

Not exactly the “beacon of enlightenment” is it.

But it was never “numbers are low...have at it!!”
Was it?

That’s a recipe for disaster. Lack of overall strategy leads to this...mistakes everywhere. They shouldn’t have lied.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Wait...”early 2019”?!?

Yikes...I’m out!!!

 

[cmwade77]

What happened in Nashville and the Mayor there is a good reason why Disneyland should have already opened up.

Yikes, I wasn't sure what you were referring to, just looked it up and that looks really bad on the government.

 

[shambolicdefending]

...I think that means your voice is being muffled by your chair then.

Well over 90% of the population of this country has not had (and god willing won't have) a symptomatic case. Saying none of those people are allowed to have a valid opinion on these issues is not a fair line of argument. I assume you know that, though. You're just trying to dismiss an opinion you might not like off hand.

 

[cmwade77]

Wait...”early 2019”?!?

Yikes...I’m out!!!

As I said, I don't have definitive proof of that due to the turn over in our office since then, but a couple of of them started as early late December 2018, again, all of the symptoms matched up with the initial set of symptoms, like lack of taste and smell, temperature, etc. I mean perfectly matched the initial set of symptoms. Additionally, I have the antibodies but was never sick since the official start of this, so either it was this or I was asymptomatic, either is possible, but we also know Italy has found it in their sewer systems dated to around this time frame as well, so it is quite possible.

 

[ThreadMaster5]

As I said, I don't have definitive proof of that due to the turn over in our office since then, but a couple of of them started as early late December 2018, again, all of the symptoms matched up with the initial set of symptoms, like lack of taste and smell, temperature, etc. I mean perfectly matched the initial set of symptoms. Additionally, I have the antibodies but was never sick since the official start of this, so either it was this or I was asymptomatic, either is possible, but we also know Italy has found it in their sewer systems dated to around this time frame as well, so it is quite possible.

pshhh I had it in 2010 get on my level

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Well over 90% of the population of this country has not had (and god willing won't have) a symptomatic case. Saying none of those people are allowed to have a valid opinion on these issues is not a fair line of argument. I assume you know that, though. You're just trying to dismiss an opinion you might not like off hand.

Without medical or public administration experience...none of those 90% opinions are valid in forming a uniform policy.

I think you don’t know that...so we can move on on our different paths.

This really has nothing to do with Disneyland as we continue to follow the rabbit down the hole.

 

[shambolicdefending]

Without medical or public administration experience...none of those 90% opinions are valid in forming a uniform policy.

I think you don’t know that...so we can move on on our different paths.

This really has nothing to do with Disneyland as we continue to follow the rabbit down the hole.

Yes, that's true. But your quest for a "uniform policy" is about as likely as the moon hurling itself into the Pacific Ocean this weekend - and would be approximately as popular. So, yes... carry on.