News Disney will be ending complimentary MagicBand distribution to Disney Resort hotel guests and moving to smart devices

[Santa Raccoon 77]

I would not be surprised If pretty much every customer service desk in every location in the entire world has them for the next year or two.

Not here

 

[The Visionary Soul]

That is disappointing. MagicBands > cell phones at WDW for several reasons:

• Children without cell phones can use MagicBands.
• MagicBands don't need to be charged.
• MagicBands are all waterproof.
• MagicBands are a tangible reminder of the Disney difference. They remind you that WDW isn't a normal place where you pay with your cell phone or a credit card; rather, there is something fun and "magical" about using a MagicBand to enter rides, pay for meals, or open your room. It might sound silly, but this is part of the reason why people are so sad to take them off at the end of their trip.
• They reduce the need for cell phones. The best times at WDW are when you're free of distraction from the outside world and you can be wholly immersed in the environment. Cell phones—with social media, work emails, etc.—work against that immersion. I think any new plan that encourages guests to use their phones more is a step in the wrong direction.

Umm, Children should have phones in the parks now so they can experience all the interactive elements. If you’re not giving your child a phone to play with in the park, your child is probably too young to have a phone (or an iPod) in the first place.
Magic Bands contain a non-replaceable battery that dies within 2-4 years, severely limiting the use of the device and making them very environmentally unfriendly.
Your phones and/or wearables, if bought in the last 2 years, are probably waterproof as well.
Wear an Apple Watch and you’ll have the same experience everywhere you go.
The need for cell phones may be reduced, but that’s irrelevant because people use them as their primary cameras so people will have their phones with them anyway.

Apple is working on system to allow unlocking in the event of a dead battery

Car Keys: A Feature That Lets You Unlock a Car With Your iPhone or Apple Watch

Apple's iPhones and Apple Watches have supported NFC for some time now, and now those NFC capabilities can be used to allow Apple users to lock,...

www.macrumors.com

Yeah, it already exists, but it’s not really compatible with Bluetooth LE yet.

This is BLE based though, so won’t benefit from that unfortunately

Exactly

I probably will too. But 1) I'd rather not pay extra for things that used to be complimentary and 2) there are plenty of first-time guests who won't buy MagicBands, and they will miss out on the better experience that MagicBands provide.

MyMagic+ already has reliability issues. I don't see how replacing free MagicBands, currently standardized for all resort guests, with a variety of cell phones (with varying operating systems, varying NFC capabilities, varying battery capacities, varying conditions) improves the guest experience.

It is bizarre that Disney is cutting complimentary MagicBands, the guest-facing cornerstone of their billion dollar MyMagic+ initiative.

It’s not bizarre at all. The program wastes millions of dollars a year and has some major issues. It was never meant to be permanent anyway. It was meant to bridge the gap from the early smartphone era to the future. They were never supposed to last more than 10 years from initial rollout. It’s honestly amazing we haven’t progressed more quickly, but you can blame Apple for locking down everything as part of that. Also, say goodbye to any “better” experience Magic Bands provide. Those benefits will all be either turned off or replaced with different tech within 5 years from now.

This shouldn't be an issue.

Apple rolled out support for student ID within Wallet two years ago and part of this is that it continues to work for five hours even after the phone shuts down due to low battery.

See https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208965

I expect the Disney use to be almost identical to these campus ID uses.

Disney is using Bluetooth LE. It’s a tech that has to be supported with door locks from Ving. I’d love to see the NFC, but it’s not wide spread enough yet.

Disney operated theme parks for 58 years before the Magic Bands were introduced. You can't run a business for that long without already knowing when and where crowds congregate, how much food and merchandise they want to purchase, and what levels of staffing are acceptable to accomplish it. These things were well documented for decades by operations teams who were already studying those exact questions.

That senior management said the technology would reveal these things, as though they were some great unknown, simply shows how detached they were (are?) both from the daily operations of their parks and the limitations of the technology they were developing. That they were convinced to spend such a large sum to reveal that data is even more embarrassing.

Yes and no. The data gathered initially from using passive scans of Bluetooth identifiers in the earlier cell phones, and later Pal Mickey, showed different patterns than expected. Disney creates these patterns themselves by requiring guests to overplan their visits with the invention of Fastpass and Dining Reservations.

There is a mountain of mixed up issues floating around in this thread. The massive investment Disney made was not for Magic bands but for the entire infrastructure of My Disney Experience which includes hotel reservations, FP+, Dining Reservations, swapping out turnstiles to tapstiles at the gates, Replacing every single room key reader on the property, replacing every single payment terminal on the property, and so much more.
The MagicBand is nothing more than the physical tool needed to gain access to that platform and the entitlements you have purchased for your visit.

The technology used by the Magic Band is pretty common stuff nowadays and is available in most every modern smartphone and most modern smartwatches. One of the barriers to them swapping out earlier to using something like an AppleWatch to replace the NFC functions of the Magic Band is that Apple has historically restricted access to that chipset in their phones to their own ApplePay platform only. If Apple (Developer COnference is on Monday) is going to open that up in the next iOS release, then Disney will have access to use the NFC chips in both Android and Apple phones to replace the NFC functionality used for theme park access and payment access. That seems like a win right there. They can integrate the entitlement access into the MDE app, and I can either swipe my phone or, in my case, my AppleWatch and gain access to my admission entitlement or FP+ reservation. When the services come available on iPhones (already available on most android phones), then no new hardware needs to be installed at any of these locations, just updated MDE software, and these devices can then replace a MagicBand for those services. You'll still be able to purchase MagicBands and use those if you want, or you can just use your phone or appropriate smartwatch. To me, that seems like a no-brainer.

As for the BTLE stuff that is used for things like on-ride PhotoPass, again, they just need to have the MDE app communicating, so the beacon on the ride sees it and links the photo/video to your MDE account. They could do this now if they wanted to but it makes sense to wait until you could complete replace the MB before starting down this path.

And for the privacy advocates (I'm one of them) yes, you can choose to turn off the BTLE access for that app and those functions will no longer be available to you.

This seems like an inevitable progression of the platform to me. They don't have to throw away, or replace any part of the infrastructure, just enable new devices to access the platform via software.

Some hardware still needs to be swapped, but luckily they installed modular components at the touch points, so it’s easy to swap. But other than that, your analysis is spot on. But don’t expect the legacy magic bands to be supported 5-10 years down the road from now.

I don't think Disney will ever totally stop selling Magicbands, they're too much of a cash cow for them. They may tweak the tech every once so often but not totally. Plus, they know how much a souvenir item Magicbands are & MOST Disney World fans like them, me included. Some even collect them like the pins. Things can always change of course but for me personally, I'm confident that Magicbands will be around for a long time.

5 years tops.

Their payment terminals already have the full infrastructure for RFID payments. I’ve used my AppleWatch and ApplePay (which uses rfid) for virtually every purchase transaction for 4+ years. If Apple exposes access to the RFID chip in this form, they could enable it for room charge as well on these same payment terminals.

Yeah but they recalled all of those old payment terminals and are in the process of switching everything across property. The credit card user terminals got changed first, and now the PoS terminals are being swapped out. But that’s neither here nor there. My point is that Apple isn’t likely to open up NFC to everyone, too many people they could take advantage of that for credit card fraud.

Why are people going on and in about magicbands going away? They are not! People have been happy paying to upgrade the basic ones or just declining them when staying on site and the number of off site guests who buy them is considerable.
It's not a big issue that some people seems to make it out it is. Companies have always given things away for free when starting something up and then switch to a payment system once it has become widely accepted, no difference here in reality, just the timing.

They are going away, you just haven’t had the public announcement yet. Give it a few more years.

That is a big “if”. The main reason why Apple locks down NFC/RFID functionality as much as they do is due to their desire to avoid competition with Apple Pay (or anything close to it).

Mobile Keys have been a thing in the hospitality industry for years — Apple hasn’t allowed the use of NFC for this in the past and I wouldn’t expect them to do so any time soon.

Bingo. Disney isn’t waiting on Apple as much as Disney is waiting on the door lock companies to come out with something after Apple unlocks the tech. That could be forever, so everyone is using what is available now, and that’s Bluetooth LE.

 

[Kamikaze]

No but it is potentially yet another reason not to stay on site.
We’ve done five trips to WDW in the last 20 years and always stayed on site. It is definitely starting to feel like there is little benefit now when rooms are significantly cheaper elsewhere.

When they limit FP to on-property resorts only that will make the difference.

 

[Kamikaze]

That is a big “if”. The main reason why Apple locks down NFC/RFID functionality as much as they do is due to their desire to avoid competition with Apple Pay (or anything close to it).

Mobile Keys have been a thing in the hospitality industry for years — Apple hasn’t allowed the use of NFC for this in the past and I wouldn’t expect them to do so any time soon.

This is factually incorrect. iPhones can be used for RFID keys since iOS 13, and Apple Watches have had it since the series 3 (possibly 2).

 

[aaronml]

This is factually incorrect. iPhones can be used for RFID keys since iOS 13, and Apple Watches have had it since the series 3 (possibly 2).

Nope. Do you have a source for this information?

Apple’s Core NFC SDK certainly doesn’t give any indication of that... https://developer.apple.com/documentation/corenfc

CarKey support will likely be coming out in iOS 14 but it isn’t currently supported.

The closest thing to NFC key support currently would be University ID card support.

 

[kong1802]

How in the world did we not see this coming?

Anytime they start charging for something that was once free, the free version disappears...

 

[21stamps]

Umm, Children should have phones in the parks now so they can experience all the interactive elements. If you’re not giving your child a phone to play with in the park, your child is probably too young to have a phone (or an iPod) in the first place.

I think there’s a lot of kids who don’t have phones, and who’s parents don’t really care about the smartphone interactive elements in parks.
Luckily though, they can still purchase Magic Bands.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I think there’s a lot of kids who don’t have phones, and who’s parents don’t really care about the smartphone interactive elements in parks.
Luckily though, they can still purchase Magic Bands.

Or they could purchase nothing...

 

[UNCgolf]

Are there any benefits left to staying onsite?

-Dining plan is a rip-off anyway.
-No Magic Bands.
-Extra Magic Hours are usually just one hour long and you end up being stuck in the most crowded park (or forced to park hop).

60 day Fastpass is still great, but you can stay at a Disney Springs Resort for that. I’m just having trouble figuring out why there’s so little additional benefit for those guests paying $500+ per night at Deluxe resorts.

Transportation. That's the main one, IMO. Can save a lot of money/annoyance -- I know some people choose to/enjoy driving and parking at the parks, but I find that a tremendous hassle that I will never do.

 

[Kamikaze]

Nope. Do you have a source for this information?

How to use NFC tags in the iOS 13 Shortcuts app | TechRepublic

Learn how to create an iOS shortcut that runs custom automations whenever your iOS device is close to an NFC tag.

www.techrepublic.com

 

[21stamps]

Or they could purchase nothing...

Sure, but that wouldn’t make much sense.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Sure, but that wouldn’t make much sense.

Yeah those cards are so hard to use.

 

[21stamps]

Yeah those cards are so hard to use.

I don’t think you’ll find an overwhelming amount of parents who want to deal with carrying cards around for their children. Much easier, and less likely to lose, if they just have something on their wrist.

 

[Rob562]

How to use NFC tags in the iOS 13 Shortcuts app | TechRepublic

Learn how to create an iOS shortcut that runs custom automations whenever your iOS device is close to an NFC tag.

www.techrepublic.com

I'm not a tech expert, but the situation in the article is the opposite direction from what would be happening in the parks. In the article, the phone is the reader and the tag is the transmitter. Taking that and putting it in a park context, your phone is acting like the touchpoint, the NFC tag is acting like the Band/card. In general terms, the "reader" is reading a static serial number from the NFC tag, and then performing functions based on the serial number of that tag. All of the computer processing is on the reader end.

What needs to happen is the exact opposite: You need the phone to act like the card sending out a serial number and the reader to be the one that can read that serial number and act on it. And for many of the park situations, you need to be able to do it with a phone that doesn't have power, or at the very least without having to unlock the phone, open an app, perhaps log in if it suddenly decides you need to, choose an option inside the app...

-Rob

 

[aaronml]

How to use NFC tags in the iOS 13 Shortcuts app | TechRepublic

Learn how to create an iOS shortcut that runs custom automations whenever your iOS device is close to an NFC tag.

www.techrepublic.com

This is literally a guide on using NFC on an iOS device to read a card, not to emulate a card (which is what is used for Apple Pay, VAS, etc. and what would be needed for an NFC Mobile Key)

 

[aaronml]

I'm not a tech expert, but the situation in the article is the opposite direction from what would be happening in the parks. In the article, the phone is the reader and the tag is the transmitter. Taking that and putting it in a park context, your phone is acting like the touchpoint, the NFC tag is acting like the Band/card. In general terms, the "reader" is essentially reading a static serial number from the NFC tag, and then performing functions based on the serial number of that tag. All of the computer processing is on the reader end.

What needs to happen is the exact opposite: You need the phone to act like the card sending out a serial number and the reader to be the one that can read that serial number and act on it.

-Rob

Exactly. You are correct

 

[Rob562]

BTW, if you have a case on your phone you can kinda-sorta use your phone to do all MagicBand functions right now. Just put an old RFID-enabled park ticket that's linked to your account inside the back of your phone case and tap it to the reader... (Doesn't work for all phone cases, though. Some are too thick.)

-Rob

 

[21stamps]

I wonder what percentage of adult guests already have an NFC capable watch, I would think it could be half.. I could be wrong though.

 

[disney4life2008]

Whoever has a small business making custom order plexi glass and installation is doing a booming business.

It's kind of like zoom. Had I known what I know now, I would have invested in zoom last year

 

[Kamikaze]

I'm not a tech expert, but the situation in the article is the opposite direction from what would be happening in the parks. In the article, the phone is the reader and the tag is the transmitter. Taking that and putting it in a park context, your phone is acting like the touchpoint, the NFC tag is acting like the Band/card. In general terms, the "reader" is reading a static serial number from the NFC tag, and then performing functions based on the serial number of that tag. All of the computer processing is on the reader end.

What needs to happen is the exact opposite: You need the phone to act like the card sending out a serial number and the reader to be the one that can read that serial number and act on it. And for many of the park situations, you need to be able to do it with a phone that doesn't have power, or at the very least without having to unlock the phone, open an app, perhaps log in if it suddenly decides you need to, choose an option inside the app...

-Rob

This is literally a guide on using NFC on an iOS device to read a card, not to emulate a card (which is what is used for Apple Pay, VAS, etc. and what would be needed for an NFC Mobile Key)

Here's an app that can both read and write. From a small dev. Obviously possible.

‎Simply NFC - Tag Writer/Reader

‎Simply NFC is the most powerful, simple, and accessible NFC writer/reader available. Simply tap the “Read NFC” button to start scanning for NFC tags and then place the back of your phone to the tag. It’s that simple! No external hardware required! The tag content will be read, stored in your...

apps.apple.com

Here's Hilton using BT LE to unlock: https://hiltonhonors3.hilton.com/en/hhonors-mobile-app/digital-key.html
Here's Disney confirming they use BT LE already: https://disneyworld.disney.go.com/faq/star-wars-galaxys-edge/bluetooth-low-energy/

So yes, they can easily make an iPhone serve as a key/contactless device for anything that you can do with a MagicBand.