Disney Light rail

[FutureCEO]

Originally posted by wdwcrazy
Yes I would use it, but I would much rather like to see a monorail or a people mover type transportation.

You have the monorial which is great. Connect that to all four parks and water parks. A People Mover transportation to all the hotels including The Marketplace and the Village. I would much rather have a people mover type transportation than a light rail which is basically an elevated train.

 

[Invero]

Hrm... okay... I think I'd like to add my 2 cents in here...

The thought about Light Rail had crossed my mind... being at grade, it wouldnt require guide posts and elevated stations. As such, stations could be incorporated into resorts such as Riverside much easier. Light rail tracks can also be switched slightly easier than monorail. However, my vote would still be a no.

Why do you ask? Well... here's a few reasons.

1.) Light rail is at grade... meaning, it runs on the ground. This means there might be some intersections that it would need to cross. Not a good idea, especially on Disney property with all the crazy tourists and cast members driving around. Any sections that are elevated are quite large, and are a complete eye sore.

2.) Ever listen to a light rail system? Constant screeching and grinding of the wheels along the rail. Ugh...

3.) The potential of a derailment... however improbable... it still is possible.

4.) Light rail is still expensive. Other (preferred) alternatives would be Maglev, or Monorail, both of which use elevated guideway. Both these alternatives can be done at similar prices.

5.) And lastly... I'm not convinced that light rail is flexible enough to work for Walt Disney World.


By the way... someone mentioned earlier that Monorails were attractions, and light rail was transportation... It's that exact mindset that is why you don't see monorails more often. Monorails are actually a superior form of transportation, and can be found all over in Europe and Japan. In fact, they're VERY popular in Japan. However, in 1959, when Walt Disney first introduced America to monorails, he unfortunetly cast the stereotype that monorails were attractions and nothing more, which is completely false.

I am attatching a picture of a few Bombardier light rail vehicles. Light rail vehicles can be made to look quite attractive, and blend right in...

 

[jmarc63]

Originally posted by Fantasia Boi
Hrm... okay... I think I'd like to add my 2 cents in here...

The thought about Light Rail had crossed my mind... being at grade, it wouldnt require guide posts and elevated stations. As such, stations could be incorporated into resorts such as Riverside much easier. Light rail tracks can also be switched slightly easier than monorail. However, my vote would still be a no.

Why do you ask? Well... here's a few reasons.

1.) Light rail is at grade... meaning, it runs on the ground. This means there might be some intersections that it would need to cross. Not a good idea, especially on Disney property with all the crazy tourists and cast members driving around. Any sections that are elevated are quite large, and are a complete eye sore.

2.) Ever listen to a light rail system? Constant screeching and grinding of the wheels along the rail. Ugh...

3.) The potential of a derailment... however improbable... it still is possible.

4.) Light rail is still expensive. Other (preferred) alternatives would be Maglev, or Monorail, both of which use elevated guideway. Both these alternatives can be done at similar prices.

5.) And lastly... I'm not convinced that light rail is flexible enough to work for Walt Disney World.


By the way... someone mentioned earlier that Monorails were attractions, and light rail was transportation... It's that exact mindset that is why you don't see monorails more often. Monorails are actually a superior form of transportation, and can be found all over in Europe and Japan. In fact, they're VERY popular in Japan. However, in 1959, when Walt Disney first introduced America to monorails, he unfortunetly cast the stereotype that monorails were attractions and nothing more, which is completely false.

I am attatching a picture of a few Bombardier light rail vehicles. Light rail vehicles can be made to look quite attractive, and blend right in...

Tyler ,I think you subliminally admited that the monorail is prefrable to light rail..

In past posts I have given links to west virginia university for the rumor that disney was looking at thei PRT/Peoplemover system whisc would take up a lot of areial real estate and look unatractive.

The monorail society for there comparision of Monorail VS. light rail.
I think that if Disney put in a system at grade you run the potencial for a major accedent. At this time I have to ask you except for the Incendents at the parks have there been any "bad traffic accedents on any of the roads in the boundrys of WDW/Ready Creek.

On the subjest of sight and sound. The steel wheels of rail screech and moan going around curves and near the resorts especially if routed by a wing of a resort like the Monorail doed by the north garden wing of the contempoary( my christmas home for two weeks from 71-76) would be disruptive as well as distracting and unsightly as all hell.

 

[jmarc63]

Originally posted by Fantasia Boi
Hrm... okay... I think I'd like to add my 2 cents in here...

By the way... someone mentioned earlier that Monorails were attractions, and light rail was transportation... It's that exact mindset that is why you don't see monorails more often. Monorails are actually a superior form of transportation, and can be found all over in Europe and Japan. In fact, they're VERY popular in Japan. However, in 1959, when Walt Disney first introduced America to monorails, he unfortunetly cast the stereotype that monorails were attractions and nothing more, which is completely false

I think that is where the other problems lies, But we got hope. Las vegas is http://www.lvmonorail.com/index.html about half way done with their system. And what I like about the Vegas system is it is a Disney/Bombider style ( Mark VI ) which gives it more exposer as more than an attraction but real transportation. Also if you go to Monorail. org they have a grass roots effort to promote Monorails as transportation http://www.monorails.org/

Check it out I am going to join as soon as I get back to working
http://www.monorails.org/tMspages/Why.html
http://www.monorails.org/tMspages/CampaignUSA.html

 

[jmarc63]

more info on Vegas


Las Vegas update (7/14/02)

Las Vegas, Nevada. Beam number 200 has been cast. After it cures at the yard, it will be trucked and lifted into place in construction section L05, which is between the Chamber of Commerce and Harrah's. Pylons are being erected and track is being lifted into place at a furious pace. Within the last week the "hump" of track over a pedestrian bridge was lifted into place by the Convention Center. The highest point of the track is 59' 8", which ensures that future monorail passengers will be afforded a spectacular view of Las Vegas at this point. We have just added some wonderful new pictures in our Construction Gallery. http://www.monorails.org/tMspages/ConstGal.html Because of the generosity of several tMs sources there, we are able to bring you more pictures of monorail construction in Las Vegas than any other monorail project in the world. Meanwhile, over at the http://www.lvmonorail.com/index.html Las Vegas Monorail website, there are also some new images to enjoy. We're told that the company will be sending a helicopter up once a month for aerial photography of the progress. Two of the first helicopter images are on their site now. Also not to be missed at the LV Monorail website, a first look at a MVI car interior mock up (small version of the image at left). Now that the monorail is a real project and everyone can see that it WILL exist, it seems that the whole town wants a station. Again, looking at our Construction Gallery, be sure to see the amazing RTC map showing proposed routes for the Strip. Just about every resort property now sees the wisdom in having a monorail station and the map reflects that. Viva Las Vegas indeed!

If this was of of Disneys resorts it would take a lot of land area to do light rail.

 

[jmarc63]

Goto this thread and tell me if you are infavor of usinf walts original idea for the WDW area where the monorail would be the "Mainline system " and the people mover would take you to your final destinastion.

to see Walts vision for transportation go to
http://www.waltopia.com/

goto features and click on the E P C O T Movie and enjoy.

works better with a fast connection.


http://forums.wdwmagic.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11160&perpage=15&pagenumber=20

 

[Invero]

Originally posted by jmarc63
Tyler ,I think you subliminally admited that the monorail is prefrable to light rail..
[...]
Also if you go to Monorail. org they have a grass roots effort to promote Monorails as transportation

Subliminal? Sorry... I'll try better next time. Monorail is by FAR preferable to light rail, in my opinion at least. As for the Monorail society... been a proud member for 2-3 years!

Now... once again... I will state the following. I love the monorail. Monorails are a great, innovative, efficient, and clean form of transportation. And it would work out GREAT in cities that use mass transit. One example will be the new Las Vegas system. I'm sure this system will be a great success.

HOWEVER... I will also state... a fixed guideway system (whether it be light rail, maglev, or monorail) would not be the solution to Transportation at WDW. I've already stated (multiple times) why this is.

I will add one more thing though... I have tried not to bring money into the equation... but I think I will now.

Supposing WDW did expand the monorail to cover the "Problem" areas. This would be the All Stars. Who's going to pay for such a system? It couldn't be the All Stars... that would defeat the purpose of staying at a "Value" resort. People stay at the All Stars mostly because it's a cheap, no frills, Disney resort, and an alternative to off property hotels. If you build a monorail for them, you'd have to charge them for it. And I'd be willing to bet... when given the choice of a $50-90 a night basic room with an efficient bus system, or $100-$200 a night basic room with a monorail... an overwhelming majority would choose the bus.

Now, maybe for you (and I mean that you in a general sense) in particular might not mind plunking down $200 extra for the monorail... but Mr & Mrs. Smith, from Anytown USA, who might not be rich, have worked hard and saved thier pennies, so that they could take thier kids to Walt Disney World. They don't care what gets them there, as long as they get there.

There are lots of us who get to come down to WDW many times during our childhood... but let's not forget that there are also lots more folks, who can't afford that luxury. They work hard, and save up for a few years for this one trip. They might only get to visit WDW once or twice during thier childhood or lifetime.

By providing the All Star Resorts at a value price, these folks can now experience the Disney Resort.

 

[jmarc63]

ok ok ok

 

[1000th_Guest]

Question: How could one properly "theme" overhead power lines? This would be incredibly ugly under the best of circumstances.

I remember walking across Disneyland's parking lot a few years ago (I was staying across the street) and thinking how ugly the overhead High Tension lines were. While light rail lines won't be as high, they can't be missed since they must be wherever the train runs.

 

[Invero]

Originally posted by 1000th_Guest
Question: How could one properly "theme" overhead power lines? This would be incredibly ugly under the best of circumstances.

Indeed a very good point. I might add that it's also incredibly hard to theme an overhead monorail station with pylons all over the place.

 

[no2apprentice]

THANK YOU, Tyler! I've tried to make the same point before, about the cost effecting prices SOMEWHERE in the system, whether it be resort prices or admission prices (I'm just a bottom-line kind of guy $$$).

People keep mentioning a people-mover concept, to supplement any possible smaller scale monorail expansion.

What about people mover costs? Wouldn't the cars have to be more enclosed, for better protection against the elements? If enclosed, they would have to be climate controlled, since they would not be going in and out of buildings, but in the great outdoors during most of the ride?

 

[WDWspider]

Originally posted by Fantasia Boi


Indeed a very good point. I might add that it's also incredibly hard to theme an overhead monorail station with pylons all over the place.

I do find the Pylons more attractive though. Maybe if the lines were contained in a boxing of some sort, it would be less messy looking???

 

[Invero]

Originally posted by no2apprentice
THANK YOU, Tyler! I've tried to make the same point before, about the cost effecting prices SOMEWHERE in the system, whether it be resort prices or admission prices (I'm just a bottom-line kind of guy $$$).

Some times... some days... some people just have a certain mind set, and no matter how many times you try and make a point... no matter how many different ways you say it... they some times just don't get it. *sigh*

I can't fault folks for dreaming, or trying to hold onto that dream... but... there are some things that just won't happen. It's life. Like my quote says, I dont live in a fantasy world... I just work at one.

Speaking of quotes, I love yours on thinking... so true.

 

[Goofster]

Yeah, at the beginning of this thread, I thought the light rail could be a good idea, but now, my mind has been changed. Now, i think if they were to do anything, (which they won't) it would have to be a monorail.

I mean, it doesn't even need to go to all the resorts, just AK, the Studios, and Downtown Disney. That's all that they need. Well, i know, they don't really need anything, but the monorail is the icon of WDW. Yeah, I know it's expensive. Someday, I'll be really rich, and I'll sponsor the monorail expansion. :drevil:

 

[no2apprentice]

Originally posted by spider-man


I do find the Pylons more attractive though. Maybe if the lines were contained in a boxing of some sort, it would be less messy looking???

How about decorations? Or the old Burma-Shave concept?

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[jmarc63]

Originally posted by Fantasia Boi


Indeed a very good point. I might add that it's also incredibly hard to theme an overhead monorail station with pylons all over the place.

Well I think the stations could be like MK or TTC or like this pic below . Well maybe change it to fit disney style a bit. BVut my prefrence it the at grade station like MK or TTC.

You just incorporate it into the design of the resort

 

[CmdrTostada]

Im pretty sure that Maglevs are extremely expensive, a monorail line would be cheaper.

 

[jmarc63]

Originally posted by Turbogames
Im pretty sure that Maglevs are extremely expensive, a monorail line would be cheaper.

yes maglevs are quite expensine nearly as much as a monorail and havw unsightly track ways and use as much space for the undercarrage as a standard elevated train like chicago's "L' or boston's "T"

 

[Invero]

Originally posted by Turbogames
Im pretty sure that Maglevs are extremely expensive, a monorail line would be cheaper.

Keep in mind... "Monorail" just means that the train has one rail... "Maglev" or "Magnetic Levitation" is the mode of propulsion. So, you can have a Maglev Monorail. (Such a system would have a small sized guideway, only slightly larger than Disney's monorail guideway)


I'm not sure if anyone has posted the link for this yet, but American Maglev Technology, Inc is currently designing and building a Maglev monorail for Old Dominion University. The track is less than 1 mile long, and will have one 45-ft car, that will travel at 40mph. Total cost for this system will be less than $14million. In addition to the low cost to build, AMT estimates monthly electric bills to only be about $3,000... in comparison to Monorail... thats a HUGE savings.

In addition, Transrapid International of Germany is currently shipping out it's first Maglev Monorail to Shanghai... this version however, will be a high speed one. I'm not sure of the cost for this, but Transrapid reports it is simmilar to that of a regular high speed rail system.

One fun little tidbit... on the AMT system... once levitated... you can move the train with the touch of your finger... no friction

Sites:
www.american-maglev.com
www.transrapid.de

 

[CmdrTostada]

I never realized a monorail was that expensive. I would think that maglevs are more expensive. But what disney should do is have an expressway maglev, because there hoping that Maglevs will become the fastest trains in the world, because of little friction. Also maglev tracks look almost identical to monorail beams.