Disney hires San Fran mass-transit exec to run resort transportation

[TP2000]

And now you are comparing a tiny streetcar system in San Diego and Portland with a comprehensive mass transit system.

It appears you've never been to Portland. I was comparing the San Francisco light rail and streetcars that Mr. Lau was responsible for (MUNI) to the Portland light rail and streetcar system (MAX).

They are quite comparable on paper, but the reality is quite different between the rider experience on the two systems. Portland = Clean & Polite. San Fran = Dirty & Surly.

San Francisco MUNI (Light rail and streetcars)
Daily Ridership: 156,000
Number of Lines: 6
Number of Vehicles: 151
System Miles: 71
Began Modern Era Operation: 1980
Current Expansion Construction: 1.7 Miles (Central Subway project to Chinatown)

Portland MAX (Light rail and streetcars)
Daily Ridership: 133,000
Number of Lines: 5
Number of Vehicles: 138
System Miles: 60
Began Modern Era Operation: 1986
Current Expansion Construction: 10.5 Miles (Orange Line & Eastside Streetcar extension)

In 2015 when the Orange Line is done, if Portland doesn't have the slightly larger system, the Portland and San Fran systems will be nearly identical in terms of miles traveled, vehicles owned, and daily ridership. Although it's already a darn close match now, as you can see in the stats above. I didn't include the Portland area commuer heavy rail system called WES, or their restored vintage trolleys the same agency also runs downtown in those stats, nor did I include San Fran's fabulous Cable Cars (that are thankfully treated quite differently by the SFMR agency, instead of MUNI). We're just comparing similar systems to similar systems here, MAX to MUNI.

San Diego's rail system is smaller than Portland's, and not nearly as comprehensive citywide, but still not dramatically smaller than San Fran's with 118,000 daily riders on a 53 mile system. Of course there is also BART in the Bay Area, which is a regional transbay heavy rail system completely separate from Mr. Lau's current responsibility at MUNI.

I can be just as passionate about rail transit as the next guy, whether it's Amtrak, commuter heavy rail (of which there are over 75 commuter rail departures per day on Metrolink and Surfliners from the Anaheim/Disneyland Resort District station alone, and I enjoy using it), or local light rail and streetcars. I just love riding the rails! :wave:

All I'm saying is that in my personal and recent experience, the San Francisco transit system, and most notably the light rail and buses that Mr. Lau has been responsible for in recent years at MUNI, is a dirty, grungy and poorly managed system compared to other West Coast cities running similarly big systems. There's a reason the San Francisco Chronicle openly refers to the past decade as the "Muni Meltdown", you know. Trust me, I experienced it firsthand in December, and I switched to taking taxicabs after the first day. :lol:

Mr. Lau may bring a much needed logistical skill set to the table at WDW. But let's just hope he gets his standards for cleanliness, courtesy, maintenance and people management raised a great deal when he goes through his WDW orientation classes.

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[niteobsrvr]

Mr. Lau may bring a much needed logistical skill set to the table at WDW. But let's just hope he gets his standards for cleanliness, courtesy, maintenance and people management raised a great deal when he goes through his WDW orientation classes.

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Keep in mind that he is being hired pretty much solely for his logistical and operational and safety knowledge. He will be tasked with further unifying all transportation at Disney and creating a comprehensive plan for the future.

You also have to keep in mind that taxes pay for Public Transit like MUNI and I would imagine that Portland residents made a decision to pay for the level of quality of service that you see. If I am not mistake the income per capita in Portland is a little different than that of San Francisco.

At Mr. Lau's level of responsibility, I am sure cleanliness will be on the list of items to oversee but not at the same priority level as those directly under him tasked with the daily management of each mode of transport. By the time a cleanliness issue would reach his desk, it would likely mean a systematic failure of many things within the Disney Management organization and not just transportation.

 

[TP2000]

You also have to keep in mind that taxes pay for Public Transit like MUNI and I would imagine that Portland residents made a decision to pay for the level of quality of service that you see. If I am not mistake the income per capita in Portland is a little different than that of San Francisco.

San Francisco is actually a very wealthy city, with a very high median income. It's just that there's so many homeless folks bumming for change that you get the feeling it's a third world country at times. Portland is a very average American city income-wise. I Just checked on Google...

San Francisco Median Household Income - $81,100
Portland Median Household Income - $51,200

I'm not an expert on Portland property tax rates, but I do know that Oregon doesn't have a sales tax, which makes shopping in Portland a lot more fun. I also know that using the MAX light rail and streetcar lines in the 60 block downtown Portland area called the "Free Rail Zone" is completely free at all times. You only pay a fare if you are going more than 5 stops past the downtown core, out into the residential neighborhoods.

Portland also operates a nifty and very mod aerial tram up into the wooded hills near downtown for commuters. The shiny aluminum cabins hold a couple dozen people and can take wheelchairs very easily.

Where in WDW do you think we could slot one of these gizmos in? Maybe from the Swan & Dolphin to Epcot's International Gateway entrance? ...

Portland Aerial Tram

 

[niteobsrvr]

San Francisco is actually a very wealthy city, with a very high median income. It's just that there's so many homeless folks bumming for change that you get the feeling it's a third world country at times. Portland is a very average American city income-wise. I Just checked on Google...

San Francisco Median Household Income - $81,100
Portland Median Household Income - $51,200

Property Tax in Portland Oregon ranges from $14 to $20.30 per $1000 of assessed value. Tri-met is funded by fares (21%) and a Payroll Tax (55%) from businesses that operate within its boundaries (interesting choice of funding). The remainder comes from state and federal grants.

The San Francisco rate is set at a maximum of $11.40 per $1000 of assessed value. (34% goes to Public works, transportation, and Commerce)

 

[niteobsrvr]

Portland also operates a nifty and very mod aerial tram up into the wooded hills near downtown for commuters. The shiny aluminum cabins hold a couple dozen people and can take wheelchairs very easily.

Where in WDW do you think we could slot one of these gizmos in? Maybe from the Swan & Dolphin to Epcot's International Gateway entrance? ...

Portland Aerial Tram

Anything in the air scares me in Florida. The amount of lightning we have is incredible. The monorails go down from time to time, especially during the summer season, due to it.

I do find the system very interesting though. One of the battles at Disney is to take people with no experience with mass transit and get them to use it. Even those the Disney system is simplified compares to a multiple stop bus route in a city, it still confuses the begeebies out of people. I personally believe there is room for a regular bus route that runs up and down Buena vista Drive, connecting many of the resorts, mini golf and water parks that are located along that road. Making that happen and functional with the guess though would be quite a challenge.

 

[TP2000]

I personally believe there is room for a regular bus route that runs up and down Buena vista Drive, connecting many of the resorts, mini golf and water parks that are located along that road.

That's a brilliant idea!

And maybe that's the type of thinking Mr. Lau has been brought in to spearhead? Creating a few trunk routes throughout property that act more like a big city bus route?

 

[niteobsrvr]

That's a brilliant idea!

And maybe that's the type of thinking Mr. Lau has been brought in to spearhead? Creating a few trunk routes throughout property that act more like a big city bus route?

Thats what I am thinking. Of course, they could have just hired me.:wave: I have a degree in logistics but not 10 years transit experience. But then again, this insn't rocket science.


During the middle of the day during non rush periods, it could definitely put some vehicles to better utilization. Reeducating drivers and guest would be a challenge.

 

[rsoxguy]

Judging by the last several posts, some of you may be offended when I sit in the monorail stations, shaking my cup of change and giving you a sad look.

 

[TP2000]

Judging by the last several posts, some of you may be offended when I sit in the monorail stations, shaking my cup of change and giving you a sad look.

It might help business if you have a scrappy but friendly looking dog with you.

Buddy, can you spare a park hopper?

 

[scottnj1966]

As long as they keep using busses as the main mode of transportation it will never be any good.

The monorail needs to go to at least all the parks, and all the deluxe resorts.
Then dig a few more canals for more boat coverage.

Many will say that will not speed up much, maybe not but it would at least be an interesting ride instead of a dirty bus. No where have I ever been, or anyone I have ever talked to has ever told me they enjoy buss travel.

Nothing will change until the person running Disney wants the change.
One day it will happen because they will have no choice.

This latest idea really has no way to really help. I dont want Disney starting to be worked as a city. No city I know is efficient. Not one.

 

[niteobsrvr]

As long as they keep using busses as the main mode of transportation it will never be any good.

The monorail needs to go to at least all the parks, and all the deluxe resorts.
Then dig a few more canals for more boat coverage.

Many will say that will not speed up much, maybe not but it would at least be an interesting ride instead of a dirty bus. No where have I ever been, or anyone I have ever talked to has ever told me they enjoy buss travel.

Nothing will change until the person running Disney wants the change.
One day it will happen because they will have no choice.

This latest idea really has no way to really help. I dont want Disney starting to be worked as a city. No city I know is efficient. Not one.

As I have said before, there is a difference between transit operations and transit management. The latter is political and creates the inefficiencies. If the folks who know how to create transit operations systems were allowed to do their thing without political involvement it would be a much different story.

The inherent problem with rail transportation is it doesn't adapt well to rapidly changing demand. And believe me, demand is completely unpredictable at Disney outside of the obvious park open, close and parade issues. Ho do you predict that at 4:15 on August 24 at the Port Orleans resort, there will be 120 people waiting for transportation to the Magic Kingdom?

The quick answer is that they would all fit on one rail vehicle. But, You have to keep in mind that one rail vehicle isn't just going to serve one stop at Port Orleans but till likely make a loop through several resorts including Old Key West, Saratoga Springs, Fort Wilderness and so on. It also isn't going to make loops around the larger resorts, there would be one stop. From that stop, you would need to walk or ride a shuttle of some sort. I can't even begin to tell you what the average guests reaction to that would be. And god forbid if a rail vehicle broke down like happens on the monorail from time to time. You would not just bring the route to magic kingdom to a halt but every other route that had to share those tracks as well.

The only thing I can say about boats is that digging more canals in Florida, even at Disney is not very environmentally likely. Not to mention the trip might be enjoyable but the transit time would be more than many could bare. Why else would their still be bus transportation available at those resorts with water transport to Downtown Disney? And lets not forget, at Disney, in high winds, the boats shut down. They are considered attractions and not actually common carrier ships in order for Disney to avoid coast guard certification and licensing.